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Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Old Pio said:
Rep. Jan Schakowsky, D-Al Qaeda, describes the killing of bin Laden as "murder."

http://dailycaller.com/2011/05/11/r...a-was-kind-of-a-loser-until-after-obl-murder/
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Please. Not at all her point:

“I can’t imagine — what service would it be to the public to provide those kinds of photos,” Schakowsky said. “[T]hat kind of chest-thumping and you know, being — bragging about this kind of murder, no I think the president has handled it just right"

...and in that it appears that most Americans agree with her:

Most Americans say it was wrong to celebrate Qaida chief’s death: Poll

Six in 10 Americans find it was wrong to celebrate the death of al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden, according to a new poll. The poll conducted by Public Religion Research Institute found that 60% of Americans believe the Bible's admonition not to "rejoice when your enemies fall" applies to how Americans should react to bin Laden's death.
 
Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Priceless said:
So it's been almost two weeks and AQ hasn't managed to do diddly. They may have tried something that we'll never know about, but if they did it wasn't successful.
Every day that passes without incident is evidence that AQ has been substantially weakened. They'll never be completely dead - it's much easier to kill a man than an idea - but hopefully the days when they could drive US foreign policy (and duct tape sales) are over.
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We've spent 10 years taking out their infrastructure, mapping their networks, pinging all their contacts... the fact is you can't have a wide ranging terror network and be successful in the west after all this time. I have to think the only reason Alwaki (sp?) in Yemen has had any success is because we haven't had the time to map out his network that well... and his success is limited to an instance of the politically correct institutional bias of our military and a guy who couldn't ignite his shorts. Anytime you operate you make noise in terms of communication. I think it says a lot that in the end they went from sat phones around 2000 (until one of our papers released the number) and in the end they were down to passing notes.

edit: I doubt there are many "sleepers" per se in the west and if they exist they've all disbanded for now. Let's not forget there was a massive muslim roundup and questioning after 9/11... i know we've all forgotten because nobody mentions it anymore. I wonder how much cleanup of sleepers we did in that time and place. The only thing we may see is a one-off but one must still consider that possibility. For instance, the terror attack at LAX.
 
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Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Priceless said:
So it's been almost two weeks and AQ hasn't managed to do diddly. They may have tried something that we'll never know about, but if they did it wasn't successful.
Every day that passes without incident is evidence that AQ has been substantially weakened. They'll never be completely dead - it's much easier to kill a man than an idea - but hopefully the days when they could drive US foreign policy (and duct tape sales) are over.
Click to expand...

Attack when it is least expected. That lesson of war is as old as Sun Tzu. ;) The US expected an attack soon after. You are right when you say that they may have tried already and were thwarted. However, when the US's guard is let down (relatively), watch out.
 
Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Brenthoven said:
Attack when it is least expected. That lesson of war is as old as Sun Tzu. ;) The US expected an attack soon after. You are right when you say that they may have tried already and were thwarted. However, when the US's guard is let down (relatively), watch out.
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True. Personally, I would have thought that the perfect soft target for them would have been some small collage football game perhaps. Some place that gets oh say maybe 12,000 or more perhaps. Plenty of D1-AA's and D2 schools get about that for most games, heck, there's a lot of HS that can get that. with not a huge police presence either. have just enough guys around that they can take out most of the cops all at once and still maintain the stadium perimeter, and they would have themselves a field day.
 
Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

5mn_Major said:
Most Americans say it was wrong to celebrate Qaida chief’s death: Poll

Six in 10 Americans find it was wrong to celebrate the death of al-Qaida chief Osama bin Laden, according to a new poll. The poll conducted by Public Religion Research Institute found that 60% of Americans believe the Bible's admonition not to "rejoice when your enemies fall" applies to how Americans should react to bin Laden's death.
Click to expand...

It's an interesting result, but if that isn't a clear-cut example of a poll question being framed . . .

Consider the unstated alternative "Yeah, I know about the whole Bible thing, but I really just don't give a rip." :eek: Totally neutral wording, there. :D

In other words, my money's on lots of false positives.
 
Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

amherstblackbear said:
It's an interesting result, but if that isn't a clear-cut example of a poll question being framed . . .

Consider the unstated alternative "Yeah, I know about the whole Bible thing, but I really just don't give a rip." :eek: Totally neutral wording, there. :D

In other words, my money's on lots of false positives.
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Concur. I think lots of folks give what they think is the "right" answer, particularly on a values type question. Pollsters were surprised at the 1980 presidential results which they had predicted were too close to call. Collectively they concluded people were lying to them about their intention to vote for Carter. Or take polling of high schoolers about drugs. How many of 'em are lying that they don't or that they do?
 
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Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Brenthoven said:
If you f*ing beat this pr**k long enough, he'll tell you he started the goddam Chicago fire, now that don't necessarily make it f*ing so!

Just sayin'.
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Exactly, which is why (if you do it) your technique is slightly different from the Gestapo in a WWII movie. You have to rely on other methods and sources. I've had a tough time with this one. McCain is the only one of us who's been tortured (for five freakin' years) and he says waterboarding is torture. On the other hand, I read recently that students at one of our military academies are waterboarded as part of their training. And in the customary hypothetical: there's a suitcase nuke out there, and we need to find out where it is before it blows up. Do we waterboard (or worse) then? I'd give it a qualified yes. As far as "where the intelligence came from to find bin Laden" is concerned, I'm thinking it's a little more subtle than "yes" or "no" to waterboarding. One thing leads to another thing, which is verified by a third thing, and so on. IIRC, the final piece of the puzzle was one lousy cell phone call (out of billions) that the NSA captured and was able to link to Abottobad. An astonishing technical accomplishment, and indicative of how difficult this business is, especially when you factor in language, religious and cultural differences.
 
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Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Patman said:
We've spent 10 years taking out their infrastructure, mapping their networks, pinging all their contacts... the fact is you can't have a wide ranging terror network and be successful in the west after all this time. I have to think the only reason Alwaki (sp?) in Yemen has had any success is because we haven't had the time to map out his network that well... and his success is limited to an instance of the politically correct institutional bias of our military and a guy who couldn't ignite his shorts. Anytime you operate you make noise in terms of communication. I think it says a lot that in the end they went from sat phones around 2000 (until one of our papers released the number) and in the end they were down to passing notes.

edit: I doubt there are many "sleepers" per se in the west and if they exist they've all disbanded for now. Let's not forget there was a massive muslim roundup and questioning after 9/11... i know we've all forgotten because nobody mentions it anymore. I wonder how much cleanup of sleepers we did in that time and place. The only thing we may see is a one-off but one must still consider that possibility. For instance, the terror attack at LAX.
Click to expand...

Don't forget "Dr." Hasan, who was evidently an Al Awlaki accolyte.
 
Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

The Pakistani Taliban claimed a twin-suicide attack in the country’s northwest that left more than 80 people dead and about 100 wounded Friday. They called the bombings revenge for the US killing of Osama bin Laden earlier this month in Abbottabad, Pakistan.

"We have done this to avenge the Abbottabad incident," Ahsanullah Ahsan, a Pakistani Taliban spokesman, told the Associated Press, also warning that additional strikes could target Americans in Pakistan.
Click to expand...

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Asia...aliban-avenge-bin-Laden-s-death-with-bombings

And the carnage continues.
 
Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

ScoobyDoo said:
You'd have to be insane to be an American and live there.
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About the only Americans who actually live in Pakistan are diplomats, military personnel on TDY, spooks, er, I mean, commercial advisers, and NGO workers. I agree with you that there's not enough money, patriotism, or good karma in the world to convince a sane person to work there.
 
Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Kepler said:
About the only Americans who actually live in Pakistan are diplomats, military personnel on TDY, spooks, er, I mean, commercial advisers, and NGO workers. I agree with you that there's not enough money, patriotism, or good karma in the world to convince a sane person to work there.
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Journalists. They may be the most insane of all.
 
Re: Osama bin Laden Declared Dead

Reuters: Porn found inside bin Laden's compound
U.S. commandos who raided Osama bin Laden's compound also recovered a "fairly extensive" stash of pornography, including videos, Reuters reports.

The news agency quotes unidentified current and former U.S. officials as saying it is unclear where in the sprawling compound the material was found nor is it clear who had been viewing it.

The officials specifically say they do not know if bin Laden himself had acquired or viewed the materials, Reuters reports.

Recently released home videos showed bin Laden viewing pictures of himself on a TV screen, indicating that the compound did have equipment for playing videos.
Click to expand...
 
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