Wisconsin vs Total Recall

[Craig P.]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

Anyways though, on the state and local level,yes I believe PEUs are very much a - while of course not the only- culprit.

Part of the problem is ill-considered benefit plans, which the PEUs have some responsibility for (but so do the states and localities that agreed to them). However, part of the problem is states and localities underfunding pensions for years, and that's certainly not the fault of the PEUs.

 

[XYZ]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

Apparently the recall election has become so heated and so divisive that family members and lifelong friends have stopped talking to one another; and at some family events there is a prohibition against any political conversation.....

People need to grow up.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

People need to grow up.

I'm all in favor of not discussing politics or religion at family gatherings. Nobody needs to hear Uncle Bob's Larouchite conspiracy theory, and in those settings it's always the Uncle Bobs who talk with the loudest voice.

The stupid are always the most bellicose and the most self-confident.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

I'm all in favor of not discussing politics or religion at family gatherings. Nobody needs to hear Uncle Bob's Larouchite conspiracy theory, and in those settings it's always the Uncle Bobs who talk with the loudest voice.

The stupid are always the most bellicose and the most self-confident.

Yeah, but he knows the melting point of zirconium!

 

[Carter]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

I'm all in favor of not discussing politics or religion at family gatherings. Nobody needs to hear Uncle Bob's Larouchite conspiracy theory, and in those settings it's always the Uncle Bobs who talk with the loudest voice.

The stupid are always the most bellicose and the most self-confident.

I'm starting to think it's about time to begin avoiding a big rural chunk of my family. We met them on Memorial Day weekend to place urns in the local cemeteries, and they had a humungous Walker sign in their driveway. For me, whose entire career was spent at the University of Wisconsin, that sign is no different that them telling me I'm a useless, overpaid bum. And the same for my wife, and my sister, and my brother-in-law. And it's particularly sad considering how much public medical assistance this family has had over the years. Probably in the millions. Still, it all comes down to Jesus, and since they really, really believe in Jesus, and Jesus loves Scott Walker, that's all that matters. Eff the poor, just not their poor. I think it's just better that I not mingle with them anymore.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

part of the problem is states and localities underfunding pensions for years, and that's certainly not the fault of the PEUs.

It seems like it is in part the "fault" of PEU leaders (a fault shared by their bought-and-paid-for legislative lapdogs):
> choice A: fully fund pension for existing PEU members; start a new tier for people who have not been hired yet with more affordable benefits going forward only for new hires
> choice B: do not fully fund pensions for existing members and keep adding new hires to the same pension tier that is already underfunded


Guess which option PEU leaders choose, every time.

Guess which option existing PEU members want their leaders to choose.


PEU leaders no longer have the trust of a substantial number of PEU members; there is a growing disconnect between the two.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

I'm starting to think it's about time to begin avoiding a big rural chunk of my family. We met them on Memorial Day weekend to place urns in the local cemeteries, and they had a humungous Walker sign in their driveway. For me, whose entire career was spent at the University of Wisconsin, that sign is no different that them telling me I'm a useless, overpaid bum. And the same for my wife, and my sister, and my brother-in-law. And it's particularly sad considering how much public medical assistance this family has had over the years. Probably in the millions. Still, it all comes down to Jesus, and since they really, really believe in Jesus, and Jesus loves Scott Walker, that's all that matters. Eff the poor, just not their poor. I think it's just better that I not mingle with them anymore.

My co-workers are like this for the most part, and I've become friends with some and maintained a mutually respectful truce with others by simply not talking any politics or religion at work. An election year is a particularly important time to lay low.

 

[TimP]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

My co-workers are like this for the most part, and I've become friends with some and maintained a mutually respectful truce with others by simply not talking any politics or religion at work. An election year is a particularly important time to lay low.

It's sickening to see how intolerant and closed-minded Christian Republicans are. It's like if you disagree with them, you might as well be in al-Quaeda.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

It's sickening to see how intolerant and closed-minded Christian Republicans are. It's like if you disagree with them, you might as well be in al-Quaeda.

yup, Christian Republicans are the only ones on either side that are intolerant of another person's views...thats a good one! I needed a laugh this late on a monday.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

It takes a special kind of denial to ignore the wreckage caused by public sector unions around the country.

No one denied the actual wreckage - rather it was argued it's not about to turn us into Greece.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

It's sickening to see how intolerant and closed-minded Christian Republicans are. It's like if you disagree with them, you might as well be in al-Quaeda.

You mean you're not?

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

No one denied the actual wreckage - rather it was argued it's not about to turn us into Greece.

See, the sun is shining outside the bunker.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

See, the sun is shining outside the bunker.

I find this characterization puzzling - the only people I envision building bunkers are knuckledraggers.

 

[Wol4ine]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

The stupid are always the most bellicose and the most self-confident.

It's sickening to see how intolerant and closed-minded Christian Republicans are. It's like if you disagree with them, you might as well be in al-Quaeda.

and for the record, I don't think you're in al-Quaeda, I think you are all Socialists.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

In about 36 hours, I will be waking up to the joyous sound of not having to give a **** about this until the ramp-up to the 2014 elections, where I can continue to despise everything I see on the ballot.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

I find this characterization puzzling - the only people I envision building bunkers are knuckledraggers.

I'm referring, of course, be tastefully decorated bunkers, built with green concerns uppermost in the minds of the residents. Libtards can't abide dank, stuffy old bunkers you know.

 

[carltonbarrett]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

I'm starting to think it's about time to begin avoiding a big rural chunk of my family. We met them on Memorial Day weekend to place urns in the local cemeteries, and they had a humungous Walker sign in their driveway. For me, whose entire career was spent at the University of Wisconsin, that sign is no different that them telling me I'm a useless, overpaid bum. And the same for my wife, and my sister, and my brother-in-law. And it's particularly sad considering how much public medical assistance this family has had over the years. Probably in the millions. Still, it all comes down to Jesus, and since they really, really believe in Jesus, and Jesus loves Scott Walker, that's all that matters. Eff the poor, just not their poor. I think it's just better that I not mingle with them anymore.

I think the problem is that the typical private sector worker can no longer stomach the fact that state union workers get better pay, they retire years earlier, get generous pensions that don't even really exist anymore in the private sector, pay much, much less for health care, get more vacation, sick time, can never get fired, etc and this is all at the taxpayers expense. Wouldn't you be a little PO'd if your taxes were going through the roof every year, knowing that a lot of it was going towards keeping the status quo with union pay and benefits, while at the same time you were getting no raises, paying more and more for health care and having to work until your 70 and retiring with just social security benefits? I know it sucks to lose anything, but you have to stop drinking the Kool-Aid and look at it from the non union employee point of view.

 

[amherstblackbear]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

I'd be curious to see a good study of public-private wages. Part of the problem comparing the two is that at least some public sector jobs don't map over very well to the private sector. I'm with you as far as arguing that public employees shouldn't make more than similar private sector employees. But I don't really have a problem with police officers making more money and getting better benefits than shopping mall security guards.

Someone must have published a careful study. Anyone have a link bookmarked?

 

[carltonbarrett]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

In MA, when you have toll booth collectors, MBTA bus Mechanics, Court clerks, school Janitors, MASSPORT secretaries, garbagemen, simple statehouse IT help desk clerks, etc making over $100K per year, then I think it's safe to say that public sector workers do better than those in the private sector.

 

[joecct]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

Apparently the recall election has become so heated and so divisive that family members and lifelong friends have stopped talking to one another; and at some family events there is a prohibition against any political conversation.....

Tuesday's election on whether to recall Mr. Walker has so bitterly divided this state that many residents live in parallel societies, limiting themselves to like-minded friends, separate drinking holes and sympathetic media outlets.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100...72709448302.html?mod=WSJ_hps_MIDDLE_Video_Top

Sounds like a high school lunch room.