Wisconsin vs Total Recall

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

"Conservatism can never fail; it can only be failed."

Every time I post evidence to the contrary there's a conservative folk in here defending it. There's one particular guy who I know is excellent on economics and he'll blast anything I post about it as well. That's why I don't think the Republican party or the American people will ever get a clue and come up with a better idea.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

Every time I post evidence to the contrary there's a conservative folk in here defending it. There's one particular guy who I know is excellent on economics and he'll blast anything I post about it as well. That's why I don't think the Republican party or the American people will ever get a clue and come up with a better idea.

The American right is about emotion, not facts. It's not a rational process, it's a gut feeling: "morals are failing, the poor are just lazy, minorities/gays/women are just complainers, the way to win a fight is to strike first, apologies are for the weak, everything I have was by the sweat of my brow while everything you have was handed to you," etc. It's sloganeering, not analysis. Facts just bounce right off.

 

[burd]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

The American right is about emotion, not facts. It's not a rational process, it's a gut feeling: "morals are failing, the poor are just lazy, minorities/gays/women are just complainers, the way to win a fight is to strike first, apologies are for the weak, everything I have was by the sweat of my brow while everything you have was handed to you," etc. It's sloganeering, not analysis. Facts just bounce right off.

It just amazes me that the Republican party has not come forward with a fiscally conservative, thoughtful, socially-in-the-ballpark-of-moderate candidate. I know most of us think such a candidate would never get the nomination because of the dimwitted tail that is wagging that dog, but won't the market forces take over at some point? I mean, there are a lot of moderates and even disappointed liberals who would follow the right kind of fiscal conservative. This is all ultimately about money, so won't they develop a product to fill that market need? Am I completely at sea?

 

[Kepler]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

It just amazes me that the Republican party has not come forward with a fiscally conservative, thoughtful, socially-in-the-ballpark-of-moderate candidate. I know most of us think such a candidate would never get the nomination because of the dimwitted tail that is wagging that dog, but won't the market forces take over at some point? I mean, there are a lot of moderates and even disappointed liberals who would follow the right kind of fiscal conservative. This is all ultimately about money, so won't they develop a product to fill that market need? Am I completely at sea?

If the Republicans ran a genuine fiscal conservative who would balance budget cuts and progressive tax raises 1:1, even I would listen, and I'm farther left of MSNBC than they are of FNC. I want the safety net stronger, and the way to ensure that is to bring the country back into fiscal balance. We all know who will get hurt the most if the country slides off a cliff -- the same people who always get hurt by casino capitalism.

I thought Ron Paul could have been that guy. His kid is unfortunately just another sleazebag.

There have been a few others along the way -- Bush Senior in 1980 (god help me), John Anderson, Jack Kemp, even Bob Dole -- but in running for the nomination they had to sell their souls to the banksters and the thumpers. Nobody on the right has had the stones to stand up to either, let alone both. (Until, again, Paul Sr. He really seemed like he might take the GOP for a ride and use it to get an honest to God Libertarian elected, and that could have been a sea change in American politics).

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

Man, I remember when I thought Ron Paul could be a force for change and get elected...and then I finished my freshman year of college and saw through his whole schtick.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

Man, I remember when I thought Ron Paul could be a force for change and get elected...and then I finished my freshman year of college and saw through his whole schtick.

Too easy. State specifically in what way it's a schtick.

I get that Paul Ryan et al. are using libertarian rhetoric to give their rich donors (or in Ryan's personal case, their rich selves) a reach-around -- it's been obvious for decades that all the talk of lowering taxes from the Republicans was nothing more than a way to funnel money to the donor class. But Paul has bona fides: he had been a Libertarian, talked a lot about how the GOP was just as guilty as the Dems of pork and sacred budgetary cows -- in a word, he had the courage of his convictions. I'll absolutely give you that Rand is just another GOP grifter channeling William Graham Sumner and looking to ride to a plutocracy over the bodies of the poors. But show me where Ron wasn't actually wanting to back up the rhetoric with real change.

I don't think you can. You went for the easy laugh, but there's nothing behind it.

 

[FadeToBlack&Gold]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

Too easy. State specifically in what way it's a schtick.

I get that Paul Ryan et al. are using libertarian rhetoric to give their rich donors (or in Ryan's personal case, their rich selves) a reach-around -- it's been obvious for decades that all the talk of lowering taxes from the Republicans was nothing more than a way to funnel money to the donor class. But Paul has bona fides: he had been a Libertarian, talked a lot about how the GOP was just as guilty as the Dems of pork and sacred budgetary cows -- in a word, he had the courage of his convictions. I'll absolutely give you that Rand is just another GOP grifter channeling William Graham Sumner and looking to ride to a plutocracy over the bodies of the poors. But show me where Ron wasn't actually wanting to back up the rhetoric with real change.

I don't think you can. You went for the easy laugh, but there's nothing behind it.

You're right, 'schtick' was the wrong word. I guess I was trying to say that Paul was obviously unelectable, which has always been true.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Wisconsin vs Total Recall

You're right, 'schtick' was the wrong word. I guess I was trying to say that Paul was obviously unelectable, which has always been true.

Oh.

Never mind.