The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

[Sloe Gin]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

So...the Spirit Airlines pilots that went on strike last month went to jail?

first off, that was last year, but nice try, thanks for playing.

The Spirit Airlines pilots went on strike legally and ethically. After all negotiating had been suspended, per the Railway Labor Act, which I suggest you read before arguing further, the pilots were allowed to LEGALLY strike. There were no "illegal job actions" performed by the pilots.

That sick out yesterday was illegal. Every teacher that did it should be immediately fired and jailed. End of story. Execute them too, for all I care.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

They signed on to do a job under the impression they had collective bargaining rights. I'd be farking ****ed, too, if some nutjob threatened to take that away without even attempting a good faith negotiation beforehand.

Once again, given that this wasn't proposed until Monday, what else were the teachers and other public sector employees supposed to do?

Yeah, I don't get that either. I guess they were just supposed to bend over.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

they were supposed to do their jobs. First and foremost, do your job.

having collective bargaining rights does not give you the right to walk out on your job. If all airline pilots called off sick, we'd not only be fired, but most likely jailed for breaking the law

Collective bargaining is just like any contractual right. Unless you're in breach, they just can't nullify it.

I'd love it if the same logic were applied to property rights. The government doesn't agree with the way you're handling your property, so they'll just confiscate it.

 

[unofan]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

That sick out yesterday was illegal. Every teacher that did it should be immediately fired and jailed. End of story.

Yeah, sorry about the date thing. I still write 2010 on things, so the date on the articles in google looked normal. By the time i mentally switch to 2011, it'll be 2012.

That said, teachers and most public sector employees aren't employed by common carriers, so the federal mediation boards and the railway labor act don't apply.

The other thing I'd note is that my guess is if an airline threatened to bust the pilot's union on 3 days notice, the federal government would either swat them down hard or allow an immediate strike.

 

[Sloe Gin]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

what I don't understand is you have a country who is in a budget crisis. The amount of debt we are accumulating is astronomical; yet when steps are taken to change this, you all freak out and demand the cuts need to be made somewhere else. Scooby, let me ask you an honest question. Assuming you don't want our country owing trillions of dollars, what steps would you take in balancing the budget? I'm open to all options. All of them.

 

[walrus]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

I'd love it if the same logic were applied to property rights. The government doesn't agree with the way you're handling your property, so they'll just confiscate it.

Didn't Souter already make that legal?

 

[Sloe Gin]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Yeah, sorry about the date thing. I still write 2010 on things, so the date on the articles in google looked normal. By the time i mentally switch to 2011, it'll be 2012.

That said, teachers and most public sector employees aren't employed by common carriers, so the federal mediation boards and the railway labor act don't apply.

The other thing I'd note is that my guess is if an airline threatened to bust the pilot's union on 3 days notice, the federal government would either swat them down hard or allow an immediate strike.

of course the railway labor act doesn't apply to non-transportation jobs, but I know public sector employees are also governed by some laws. It's why police and firefighters can't strike even when their contracts expire. It's *tty, but it prevents the country from shutting down.

and those tactics have been played out before. Whenever a pilot group is in negotiation for a contract, airlines will do anything possible to bust the union, including furloughing pilots, firing them for menial acts, eeking out every hour of the pilots then can, etc. It's part of the game. We accept it, because we cannot do it any differently until legislation changes.

Why haven't the teachers, instead of marching on the capitol and causing students to miss more school, try to work with the governor and offer some consessions?

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Didn't Souter already make that legal?

I knew that was coming. Knew it, knew it, knew it.

I will trade you straight up Kelo for Citizens United. Both craptacular decisions (in my completely uninformed humble opinion).

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

what I don't understand is you have a country who is in a budget crisis. The amount of debt we are accumulating is astronomical; yet when steps are taken to change this, you all freak out and demand the cuts need to be made somewhere else. Scooby, let me ask you an honest question. Assuming you don't want our country owing trillions of dollars, what steps would you take in balancing the budget? I'm open to all options. All of them.

The buget was under control in 1999-2000. What caused that to change?

1. The Bush Tax Cuts were passed to create jobs. Yet, they created none. Fail. They just passed again. Fail.
2. The Bush Doctrine put us in wars in the Middle East that have done nothing to change the Middle East. In fact what happened in Egypt and Tunisia has a better chance of effecting change in the Middle East than anything that we have done in Iraq or Afghanistan.
3. The Housing Bubble and collapse was allowed to happen by a government and a private sector that has no regard for it's people. And if you want to read a great article that just came out on how out to lunch the SEC and Wall Street are here it is.

Until we stop trying to squeeze blood out of turnip and making taxes akin to stealing WE ARE NEVER going to fix this budget problem. To be honest I think the biggest problem right now is accountability for funding. Which level of government is responsible for paying for public schooling? Do you know? Cause I sure don't and neither do the school districts.

 

[Sloe Gin]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

The buget was under control in 1999-2000. What caused that to change?

1. The Bush Tax Cuts were passed to create jobs. Yet, they created none. Fail. They just passed again. Fail.
2. The Bush Doctrine put us in wars in the Middle East that have done nothing to change the Middle East. In fact what happened in Egypt and Tunisia has a better chance of effecting change in the Middle East than anything that we have done in Iraq or Afghanistan.
3. The Housing Bubble and collapse was allowed to happen by a government and a private sector that has no regard for it's people. And if you want to read a great article that just came out on how out to lunch the SEC and Wall Street are here it is.

Until we stop trying to squeeze blood out of turnip and making taxes akin to stealing WE ARE NEVER going to fix this budget problem. To be honest I think the biggest problem right now is accountability for funding. Which level of government is responsible for paying for public schooling? Do you know? Cause I sure don't and neither do the school districts.

so if I understand you 100%, you would only raise taxes. You would not cut a dime of spending, except maybe in defense and military.

Now, who do you raise taxes on?

 

[unofan]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Why haven't the teachers, instead of marching on the capitol and causing students to miss more school, try to work with the governor and offer some consessions?

That's kind of the point - the governor didn't call up the union asking for negotiations or concessions, he just went ahead and proposed a bill that would decrease benefits and kill the union. Oh, and he fast-tracked it so that it would be back on his desk for his signature within the week.

The unions are the ones asking for sit-down talks. The governor is telling them to **** off because this is a "crisis."

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

so if I understand you 100%, you would only raise taxes. You would not cut a dime of spending, except maybe in defense and military.

Now, who do you raise taxes on?

Flat tax. Straight percentage. You want to know why that hasn't gotten traction yet ask someone who's already rich.

 

[unofan]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

I knew that was coming. Knew it, knew it, knew it.

I will trade you straight up Kelo for Citizens United. Both craptacular decisions (in my completely uninformed humble opinion).

One by each side of the ideological spectrum, too. I'll take that trade. I've no love for Citizens United but flat out abhor Kelo.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

I honestly can't think of a single decision made by the Supreme Court in my lifetime that is as back-asswards as Kelo. It might be the single worst decision I'll ever see in my lifetime. Honestly.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Good news! We've found the Senators.

Wisconsin state Democrats who refused to show up for a vote on Governor Walker’s budget repair bill have been located.
The lawmakers are in Rockford, Illinois at the Best Western Clock Tower Resort.

Fear not. They're comfortable.

Enjoy a great family experience with 65,000 square feet of indoor water park fun at CoCo Key Water Resort and Key Quest Arcade. Day passes are available as well as overnight stay with water park pass packages.
Also at our resort is the SunDial Restaurant and the Tilted Kilt Pub & Eatery. Visit www.tiltedkiltrockford.com for a list of events and specials at Rockford’s hottest new sports pub!

 

[Handyman]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

they are NOT vastly underpaid. They work 6 months out of the year (and don't tell me differently, because you know for a fact that's true). They get every single holiday off, every single important day on the calendar off, and let's not even get into the benefits that every teacher gets. Tenure after a certain amount of time? What the *k is that? Then, when the governor has the balls to tell them they need to sacrifice like EVERY OTHER AMERICAN the Union gets its thong turned all around and demands unreasonable *t. Oh, you didn't get a raise last year? Boo *king hoo. I didn't get a raise this year, and I'm guessing most Americans didn't either. In fact, most in the private sector have taken paycuts that have not been restored in years.

Give me a *king break. Overworked. Easiest profession in the world.

I am a teacher, you are not only wrong you are ignorant. Please stop pretending you have any knowledge on any subject pertaining to this and go back into whatever hole you slink out of. I am sick of people like you who talk out of their *** and dont even have the IQ to point where their *** is.

But hey, prove me wrong, you do it, you teach and tell me that they are overpaid, and that it is the easiest job in the world. Put your money where your mouth is internet tough guy!

 

[Handyman]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Yeah, I don't get that either. I guess they were just supposed to bend over.

IIRC this was the same guy who said if you get pregnant you should not only be forced to have the kid but be the parent until they are adults. Of course his pea sized brain didnt think that such a ridiculous and unconstitutional policy would put half the new mothers out there on Welfare costing all of us more money and endanger the lives of the kid...but what does he care it isnt HIS problem.

When the problem effects people like him then he cares (like the airline strike) when it is anyone else they can kiss his ***.

edit: BTW there needs to be cuts EVERYWHERE...everyone needs to take the hit. And taxes need to be raised too...time for the people to start paying up, all the people. Unless we tax more and spend less there is no solution to the deficit. Period, end of story.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Governor Kasich, come on down!

COLUMBUS -- Ohio's unions saw it coming. The Republican-led Ohio Senate -- with strong support from new Republican Gov. John Kasich -- detailed Wednesday how it plans to overhaul the state's collective bargaining laws to weaken what it views as costly union clout.

The Republican-led Ohio Senate -- with strong support from new Republican Gov. John Kasich -- detailed Wednesday how it plans to overhaul the state's collective bargaining laws to weaken what it views as costly union clout.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

That's kind of the point - the governor didn't call up the union asking for negotiations or concessions, he just went ahead and proposed a bill that would decrease benefits and kill the union. Oh, and he fast-tracked it so that it would be back on his desk for his signature within the week.

The unions are the ones asking for sit-down talks. The governor is telling them to **** off because this is a "crisis."

Except they only started wanting to negotiate once Walker took office. They were quite happy to ram through a new contract in the lame duck in December with Gov. Doyle in charge, but a few outgoing Democrats had the guts to vote against it. Earlier under Doyle, a budget repair bill was introduced and passed within 24 hours.

As Gov. Walker has said, it was pretty dang tough not to have seen this coming. He campaigned on it, he talked about it in his state of the state address, and then he introduced a bill.

In other news, WKOW in Madison reports the Democrats have left their hotel in Rockford, They might be coming back, but hey, they might be heading further south.

Edit: Nope, on the news right now Sen. Erpenbach has said they aren't coming back.

 

[icebadger]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Good news! We've found the Senators.

Fear not. They're comfortable.

BTW there needs to be cuts EVERYWHERE...everyone needs to take the hit. And taxes need to be raised too...time for the people to start paying up, all the people. Unless we tax more and spend less there is no solution to the deficit. Period, end of story.

What about people in my situation? I'm a researcher at Wisconsin. I wrote, applied, and received the funds which pay my salary and benefits (as well as supplies and equipment) from a private foundation (in Europe, no less). Because I work at the University, my checks say 'State of WI' on them, though I am, in effect, 'free' to the State. I pay taxes, I spend my money, I work for free from the State's perspective. Yet they want to increase the amount I pay for benefits. The State does not pay my benefits. My grant does. Taking more money from me does nothing other than take more money out of the economy. I understand why the WI Dem's are hiding out in Rockford. The Repub's won't even sit down to talk about illogical situations like the one I just described.