Ohio State 22-23 Are we Better Than You Think?

[Hockeybuckeye]

Only Muzz's NC has forced him to do something about the women's program.

So what needs to be done different in your opinion and don't tell me we need a new arena for the men. Yost at Michigan is a 100 year old barn that is so substandard it doesn't even have a real locker room for visiting teams and it doesn't impede their recruiting either so one's facility is not a real factor. Muzerall gets top talent and the old barn doesn't impede her. When the men were in their last Frozen Four we didn't capitalize on that momentum and get top recruits. To build a top program when a coach is hired they need to do the job and have initial success and build on that success. If that doesn't happen it will stagnate or never win the ultimate prize. That's what happened to Granato at Wisconsin.

 

[TalonsUpPuckDown]

Hey, it could be worse...you were 60 seconds away from BOTH of your little brothers having a natty in hand.

Is the WI job that much better as to substantially move the needle for Rhols? Maybe, but I have my doubts. We have an in-state example of a coach leaving a pretty good gig to take over a reclamation project at his alma mater and look how that's turning out. Add in the expectations of the WI fan base and one misstep could put him behind the 8-ball. Besides, I think their first call is to a Mankato area code.

EDIT: And as far as the alma mater thing, BG reached out to Wayne Wilson at RIT when Bergeron left and he used the situation to get a pretty decent raise so it's not always a given.

 

[Eddie Schorr]

So what needs to be done different in your opinion and don't tell me we need a new arena for the men. Yost at Michigan is a 100 year old barn that is so substandard it doesn't even have a real locker room for visiting teams and it doesn't impede their recruiting either so one's facility is not a real factor. Muzerall gets top talent and the old barn doesn't impede her. When the men were in their last Frozen Four we didn't capitalize on that momentum and get top recruits. To build a top program when a coach is hired they need to do the job and have initial success and build on that success. If that doesn't happen it will stagnate or never win the ultimate prize.

Michigan is Michigan. Don't underestimate being a blueblood located in a 3M state, not to mention the huge recruiting advantage that the U16 has given them. We need something to counter that to get us to the next level, and a shiny state of the art new facility would be huge. Give Rohls that new arena, and if his recruiting doesn't pick up then there's something wrong. Look at what Pegula has done for a brand new, from scratch program at Penn State. Look at the boost that little shoebox at Miami of Ohio gave their program. If that broke ass athletic department could do it, then there's no excuses for Ohio State. The difference is that Ohio State has the total package and would be able to sustain it for the long term versus being the flash in the pan that Miami of Ohio turned out to be.

 

[Eddie Schorr]

Hey, it could be worse...you were 60 seconds away from BOTH of your little brothers having a natty in hand.

I will ALWAYS root for Boston University for the merciful gift they bestowed upon us (and you guys too) to keep Fredo from winning a NC.

 

[Hockeybuckeye]

We need something to counter that to get us to the next level, and a shiny state of the art new facility would be huge.

So please explain to me why you think the Schott is a problem?

 

[klbaum1077]

So what needs to be done different in your opinion and don't tell me we need a new arena for the men. Yost at Michigan is a 100 year old barn that is so substandard it doesn't even have a real locker room for visiting teams and it doesn't impede their recruiting either so one's facility is not a real factor. Muzerall gets top talent and the old barn doesn't impede her. When the men were in their last Frozen Four we didn't capitalize on that momentum and get top recruits. To build a top program when a coach is hired they need to do the job and have initial success and build on that success. If that doesn't happen it will stagnate or never win the ultimate prize. That's what happened to Granato at Wisconsin.

Michigan will always get the top kids because of the history they have. They have a gold mine right down the highway and they take advantage of it. Youth hockey in ohio has to grow and then keep those top kids home. The womens game isnt as big and there arent as much competition for the top recruits as in mens hockey. She used her connections im sure to get a top player or two to buy in and they won because of it. I dont know how she is still at Ohio State really. Like mentioned above that National Title is the only reason they are getting a new building. I also dont think the Admin past or present care about hockey. Markell was allowed to stay 2 years to long and then after Oz left the cupboard was really bare. Rohls has done a nice job building from the ground up. They have won a regular season title played for 2 playoff titles which they lost both in OT. Been to a Frozen Four and probably would have been to another in the Covid year.

 

[klbaum1077]

So please explain to me why you think the Schott is a problem?

The problem with the schott is they dont get to practice in the place they play.

 

[Eddie Schorr]

So please explain to me why you think the Schott is a problem?

Limited time to practice on the ice you play on. Getting bumped out of your own arena for high school tournaments. Even with the upper level fully closed off, a 4000 attendance game seems like an empty barn. Don't think the Schitt isn't used against us in recruiting. And explain to me how a new state of the art 6500 seat arena wouldn't be a huge improvement, not least in the message it would send that Ohio State is finally ready to invest in hockey the way they've done in everything else from fencing to lacrosse.

 

[Eddie Schorr]

It makes me all kinds of stabby that baseball got a gem of a park to play in. Their average attendance is less than half that of hockey. And here's the real nut punch, they have ZERO chance to ever compete for a national championship. None!

 

[klbaum1077]

It makes me all kinds of stabby that baseball got a gem of a park to play in. Their average attendance is less than half that of hockey. And here's the real nut punch, they have ZERO chance to ever compete for a national championship. None!

It was pretty much privately funded. At the Time Ohio State was in a Regional almost every year. They only missed 2 regional in the 90's. In the first 10 years that was built they hosted 2 regionals and 2 super regionals.

 

[Stauber1]

You really can't compare the recruiting challenges of the men's game to the women's. A player that OSU women are interested in is also considering MN, WI, and *maybe* an eastern team or two or Duluth.. The same type of player for the men would be in contact with those previously mentioned plus some combination of UND, Duluth, St. Cloud, Denver, UNO, the other UND, MI, MSU, PSU...

 

[Eddie Schorr]

It was pretty much privately funded. At the Time Ohio State was in a Regional almost every year. They only missed 2 regional in the 90's. In the first 10 years that was built they hosted 2 regionals and 2 super regionals.

The Bob Todd era was about the max for a cold weather school, and even then we never sniffed Omaha. The program has next to no chance of ever competing for a national championship. Yes, Michigan rode a heater a couple of years ago and ended up in the final, but that was a pure aberration. The next most recent cold weather school to make the final was Southern Illinois in 1971. The last cold weather school to win a NC was Thee Ohio State University in 1966. I don't begrudge the baseball park. I'm happy for the program That being said, it's still criminal that men's hockey--which can potentially win a national championship--doesn't have a proper facility.

And as someone who works with the OSU Foundation and its Chicago office, I can tell you that private funds in large part are very much steered to where the university (or athletic department) put its priorities. If a men's hockey arena was a priority, the private fundraising dollars would appear.

 

[klbaum1077]

The Bob Todd era was about the max for a cold weather school, and even then we never sniffed Omaha. The program has next to no chance of ever competing for a national championship. Yes, Michigan rode a heater a couple of years ago and ended up in the final, but that was a pure aberration. The next most recent cold weather school to make the final was Southern Illinois in 1971. The last cold weather school to win a NC was Thee Ohio State University in 1966. I don't begrudge the baseball park. I'm happy for the program That being said, it's still criminal that men's hockey--which can potentially win a national championship--doesn't have a proper facility.

And as someone who works with the OSU Foundation and its Chicago office, I can tell you that private funds in large part are very much steered to where the university (or athletic department) put its priorities. If a men's hockey arena was a priority, the private fundraising dollars would appear.

I wouldnt say never sniffed Omaha they were 1 win a way a couple times from going but you are correct when you say that era was it. Right now they have no chance of getting there. I still hold out hope that someday I will see them there. I also agree if they wanted a Mens arena it would have happened.

 

[GoBucky18]

Dipping my toes in the water as a WI fan. I think a lot of your guys' comments are pretty accurate.

As far as facilities, I feel MI gets away with Yost because they just invested a ton into giving it a face lift and its a good fan experience. No real bad sight lines. They dont care about an opposing team locker room (it quite literally is portable curtains in the concourse, lol). But they can sell any recruit the history and legacy, despite their last Natty coming in 1998.

I've been to the Schott a bunch too, and its decent but OSU certainly has a landlord problem there. I wonder if they get such a low cost that it is worth being a 2nd class citizen there. If I remember right, Oz got fired bc he confronted Gene Smith about the schools committment to hockey...it wasnt pretty.

Capital projects require a whale to come in and put up a huge chunk of $. Pegula, Kohl, etc...and they get the ability to tell the university where that $ goes.

Now, the downside of PSU is that tix to hockey games are pretty rediculous if you want a seat with a good view. Smaller arenas compress the lower bowl and reduce sight lines significantly. So to have a great seat at Pegula and want to catch a game, youre looking at anywhere from $60-$100/ticket via ticketmaster to sit in the upper level.

Assuming OSU ever got that new arena with 7500 capacity...will fans pay that? Even Badgers tix at Kohl are about $25/ticket and people gripe all the time.

 

[Eddie Schorr]

Assuming OSU ever got that new arena with 7500 capacity...will fans pay that? Even Badgers tix at Kohl are about $25/ticket and people gripe all the time.

Last part is interesting. We usually discuss arena sizes based on current attendance numbers. If, however, ticket prices rise substantially, what will that do to demand? Does 7500 in the Schott at low prices turn into 6000 in the new arena at double the cost. Personally, I think the team winning and a shiny new arena will make it a hot ticket.

As for Oz, I'm not a program insider by any stretch, but I seem to remember that a number of parents complained about a toxic environment in the program. Perhaps someone else can rehash exactly why he was given the boot.

 

[GoBucky18]

https://www.dispatch.com/story/sports/college/2013/04/16/ohio-state-men-s-hockey/23506577007/

Quick search. States difference of opinion between the AD and Oz. Not to rehash it lol but he ran a clean prgm, but I do wonder if there was internal strife...Oz came from Eaves and Eaves was a pretty hard core in your face coach. So who knows.

The other thing I was going to mention is that OSU is in a difficult area for hockey too. No mans land to an extent. On the southern edge of northern schools...competing against both Western and Eastern teams for recruits (at least regionally) and very limited recuits to the south.

I think its likely WI may take a run at Rhols here, bit it's at least in my mind impressive with his player development and squeezing the results he has considering the extent to which the deck is stacked against the hockey team there with external factors.

 

[Eddie Schorr]

Going to use some ofmthe millions sent to Madison under the beneficence of the media deals we drive to steal our coach away. How's that for gratitude!

 

[GoBucky18]

Going to use some ofmthe millions sent to Madison under the beneficence of the media deals we drive to steal our coach away. How's that for gratitude!

Haha! No doubt right? I mean Im sure Texas feels the same about TAMU down south

Guarantee if there are any major hockey donors left in Madison, they will be ponying up. Ironically UW athletic dept was in such shambles in the 80s, they run their own ship now and are completely self sufficient. But that is a curse too bc they cant pay top dollar esp in football and basketball. Hockey a difft story bc top dollar is relative. But its still significantly more than what many other hockey schools can afford or are willing to pay.

For example, TG made $600/yr for a crappy record and Rhols gets $500/yr and is demonstrably more successful with access to less top end talent.

 

[klbaum1077]

https://www.dispatch.com/story/sports/college/2013/04/16/ohio-state-men-s-hockey/23506577007/

Quick search. States difference of opinion between the AD and Oz. Not to rehash it lol but he ran a clean prgm, but I do wonder if there was internal strife...Oz came from Eaves and Eaves was a pretty hard core in your face coach. So who knows.

The other thing I was going to mention is that OSU is in a difficult area for hockey too. No mans land to an extent. On the southern edge of northern schools...competing against both Western and Eastern teams for recruits (at least regionally) and very limited recuits to the south.

I think its likely WI may take a run at Rhols here, bit it's at least in my mind impressive with his player development and squeezing the results he has considering the extent to which the deck is stacked against the hockey team there with external factors.

From what I was told Oz was not nice to any of the employees and the players hated him.

 

[osualum86]

You women's coach is doing an amazing job. How she hasn't been hired away is beyond me.

You must not follow women's hockey. She won a National Title here in 2022 and is one of the highest paid women's coaches in our league (WCHA). Anyone who thinks she is going to get "hired away" either doesn't follow women's hockey or is wishfully thinking she goes somewhere else so they have a better chance of beating Ohio State's women. Please get back to me on who could "hire her away" that would provide more money and resources than Ohio State. And don't bother with Minnesota or Wisconsin because Brad Frost and Mark Johnson aren't going anywhere anytime soon. Ditto with Maura Crowell at UMD. With Ohio State slated to get a new facility soon, there will be nothing that other coaches can use to negative recruit against Ohio State.