Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

[Kepler]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

A: What is written on the doors of all the bathroom stalls in Washington?




did I get it right??

We would also have accepted "...in every corporation," or "...in every marriage."

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

People get too wrapped up over Faux News. Look, they exist to make money. Its easier to play into a persecution complex for conservatives than it is for liberals. Naturally paranoid and angry people are going to buy into that. If Murdoch's corporate people (the ones not under arrest right now) showed him an analysis that flaming liberalism would bring in more revenue, he'd switch programming overnight. Think about it, if you started a "McCain wasn't born in the US, he was born in Panama outside of the Canal Zone" or "The Canal Zone is not US territory anymore so he's disqualified" few lefties would bite on this one. Far easier to cover stories about that newly discovered Kenyan birth certificate.



Where Fox did have an impact was when they (and right wing talk radio) were the only game in town to get a rumor into the mainstream news media. That was helpful in setting a narrative, but with the advent of the internet and social media those advantages have been eliminated. Consider this: IIRC Fox cable came about in the early 90's (I realize the network is from 1986 I think). Since that time, the Dems have won 3 out of 5 Presidential elections and outvoted the GOP in 4 out of 5. Before Fox came along, they'd lost 5 out of 6.

Post hoc, ergo propter hoc

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

The... the global warming... and... and corporate America...

FYP.

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

Naturally paranoid and angry people are going to buy into that.

Huh. Didn't know you had bought into Fox News. Very interesting.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

I have no idea about the case at hand, but the thing that makes Fox unique among the major networks is exactly that: not only their history of twisting and even changing facts to support their viewpoint, but the whole idea of having a major "news" organization formally chartered to purvey only one side. It's entirely possible that CBS etc. have an editorial bias, and that it's reflected in their coverage. I'll grant that. But CBS wasn't founded expressly as the propaganda arm for a major party as Fox News was. To say so isn't naive, it's just an understanding of who created Fox News, when, and for what purpose.

The journalism world is chock full of minor and niche organizations that were founded as purely partisan outlets. Nobody reading Salon or Kos or watching MSNBC or RT should have any illusions about that. Arguably, the thing that makes Fox News unique is that it has been so successful. They do the same things that the minnows have always done, but they do them so well that they've gained such an enormous audience that they are mistaken to be an actual news site rather than a party house organ.

Nor is that unprecedented. In the early history of the Republic all newspapers were like that. This is just the first time a TV network was like that. And judging by copycats like MSNBC, it won't be the last.

The continuing irony, of course, is that all the ladies in the chorale spend far more time watching, obsessing, posting, b*tching about Fox, Faux, False than I do. Which is fairly easy, since I almost never watch. What NBC did here should not be minimized. It was a journalistic fraud. Deliberate. Designed to shape the debate and to help the President gin up the African American vote in a key swing state. And their continuing efforts to cover it up will, I suspect, once again prove the accuracy of the "Nixon rule." Tu Quoque arguments about how "Fox, Faux, False does it all the time" (even if they are true) do not get NBC off the hook here. After all, this is a "major" legacy network with a "news tradition" from the days when network news coverage actually meant something. Given the various checks and balances in their editorial process, no reasonable person can believe "editgate" was accidental. I have fired reporters for smaller failures of professionalism. Also, NBC should bench Sharpton, or at least have someone else report on the Martin situation. Having him "anchor" coverage, which significantly involves his marches, speeches and declarations is totally unacceptable. Period.

As to whether Fox, Faux, False is the "propaganda arm for a major party," to the best of my knowledge they've never put their most senior anchorman out there with a fist full of forged documents, in a last minute, totally false, hit piece on a candidate for president. A deliberate, ham handed effort to influence the outcome of an election.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

He was great in "King of Comedy."

And he did an episode of SVU as Richard Belzer's confused uncle.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

Tu Quoque arguments about how "Fox, Faux, False does it all the time (even if they are true) do not get NBC off the hook here. After all, this is a "major" legacy network with a "news tradition" from the days when network news coverage actually meant something.

I'm in 100% agreement with this. If murderer B is accused by murderer A of murder, the correct procedure is to prosecute them both, not exonerate one.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

I'm in 100% agreement with this. If murderer B is accused by murderer A of murder, the correct procedure is to prosecute them both, not exonerate one.

Of course. I bow to others "expertise" on the various felonies and misdemeanors of Fox News, since others around here apparantly spend far more time watching than I do. As a general rule, I limit my cable network news watching to "wall to wall" coverage of major events, switching back and forth to see new details as they emerge.

I've posted several times that I never watch Bill O'Reilly* and haven't since he declared that Shawn Hornbeck, who had been kidnapped as a little boy, and raped repeatedly by a 300 pound pedophile with a gun over a period of years, must have "liked" what was happening to him because he didn't run away. It raises the question of how comprehensively ignorant and mean spirited one man can be.

*I rarely watced him before the Hornbeck outrage.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

As a general rule, I limit my cable network news watching to "wall to wall" coverage of major events, switching back and forth to see new details as they emerge.

I think a lot of rational people (and maybe even a few irrational people) treat cable news the same way. Most people know its crap and will only watch when something big is going down. Until that something big is happening, cable news isn't going to get viewers on their own merits. Therefore: sensationalist garbage to lure in morons while everyone else is busy not giving a crap about CNN/MSNBC/Fox.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

I think a lot of rational people (and maybe even a few irrational people) treat cable news the same way. Most people know its crap and will only watch when something big is going down. Until that something big is happening, cable news isn't going to get viewers on their own merits. Therefore: sensationalist garbage to lure in morons while everyone else is busy not giving a crap about CNN/MSNBC/Fox.

One of my most enjoyable evenings in recent years was watching MSNBC the night Scott Brown won the senate race in Massachusetts. Completely entertaining, with more crepe hanging than for the Lincoln assassination.

Journalistic standards across the board have taken a severe beating in recent decades. We are far more tabloidized now than ever before, and there's no end in sight. Remember when Kennedy cousin Willie Smith was on trial for rape? The proceedings were televised and the victim's face was covered with a blue dot when she testified to protect her privacy. Subsequently, one of the tabloids released her identity. Then the august NYT did a story about how the tabloid had released her identity, and . . .released her identity. The tabloid had given them cover. This sort of thing goes on every day.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

One of my most enjoyable evenings in recent years was watching MSNBC the night Scott Brown won the senate race in Massachusetts. Completely entertaining, with more crepe hanging than for the Lincoln assassination.

FNC the night Obama won was similarly hilarious. It had never occurred to them in their wildest dreams that the office they were entitled to hold in perpetuity might go to the other side. The nerve of those ungrateful voters!

If you are the kind of person whose mind can be changed by Wolf Blitzer or Gretchen Carlson, you deserve what you get.

 

[bronconick]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

FNC the night Obama won was similarly hilarious. It had never occurred to them in their wildest dreams that the office they were entitled to hold in perpetuity might go to the other side. The nerve of those ungrateful voters!

If you are the kind of person whose mind can be changed by Wolf Blitzer or Gretchen Carlson, you deserve what you get.

Picking the losing side's channel to watch is required for full enjoyment of election nights. Because the dems were getting slaughtered in 2010, MSNBC decided to spend 10 minutes letting the Republican nominee for NY's governor speak while he held onto a baseball bat for some inexplicable reason in front of his supporters. They then asked Bachmann if she was a zombie. You could almost taste the butthurt through the TV.

 

[walrus]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

One of my most enjoyable evenings in recent years was watching MSNBC the night Scott Brown won the senate race in Massachusetts. Completely entertaining, with more crepe hanging than for the Lincoln assassination..

The Harvard prof running against Brown is killing him in donations. She has tons of dough while he doesn't. I doubt he is more than an asterisk after November

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

The Harvard prof running against Brown is killing him in donations. She has tons of dough while he doesn't. I doubt he is more than an asterisk after November

Which is interesting, but irrelevant to the comment I made. The Dems are going to pull out all the stops here since they think they're entitled to the seat. Especially since that lush Teddy Kennedy's fat a*s occupied it for so long. We'll see.

 

[unofan]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

As to whether Fox, Faux, False is the "propaganda arm for a major party," to the best of my knowledge they've never put their most senior anchorman out there with a fist full of forged documents, in a last minute, totally false, hit piece on a candidate for president. A deliberate, ham handed effort to influence the outcome of an election.

Of course not. They put their most senior anchorman out there with a fist full of forged documents in a well-planned totally false hit piece against the actual president in a deliberate, ham handed effort to influence the outcome of an election.




(oh comeon, you set that one up on a tee).

Come to think of it, though, who is Fox News' most senior anchorman? It's not O'Reilly, since he's most assuredly not a traditional anchor.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

The Harvard prof running against Brown is killing him in donations. She has tons of dough while he doesn't. I doubt he is more than an asterisk after November

He actually still has a ton of money -- more than she does. But it hasn't come from the last two quarters which she owned.

Warren's the real deal. The GOP blundered badly when they threw that hissy fit; they had the opportunity to tuck her into a remote corner. Instead, she's going to be a helluva high profile presence. My wife has had the opportunity to work with her personally and she was very impressed.

And that race may wind up the most expensive Senate race in history. But she's going to win big; the underwear model was a fluke.

 

[Rover]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

I too marvel at the tactical stupidity of today's GOP. Used to be you could at least count on them to make smart campaign decisions. The only, and I mean only, person in Massachusetts who could have possibly given Brown a race was Warren. That's it. The rest of the D list roster of people who had declared would have lost by double digits. I have to wonder if a Rove (or a Cheney) was still calling the shots they would have told dumb*** McConnell to S T F U and let her become Consumer Protection Bureau head to take away a strong Senate recruit.

While I see a close race, the problem for Brownie is this. Obama will most likely win 60% of the vote in Mass, even against the unliked Romney. That means 10% of that 60% need to split their votes and choose Brown, a surrogate of McConnell, even as they're re-electing the President. Stated another way, about 20% of Dem voters for Prez need to also vote R for Senate. In this partisan climate, that's a lot to ask.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

I have to wonder if a Rove (or a Cheney) was still calling the shots they would have told dumb*** McConnell to S T F U and let her become Consumer Protection Bureau head to take away a strong Senate recruit.

IINM as that was going down Rove wrote an open editorial letter to the GOP saying "what the hell are you guys doing?" And this is Rove, who himself helped turn an enormous GOP electoral advantage into the decaying regional disaster of today.

There seem to be dynastic periods when one party's strategic vision is far superior to the other's. From the 1930's through the middle 1960's the Democratic party had all the strategic brains. From the late 1960's through the middle 1990's it was the Republican party. Then at some point in the mid 1990's -- roughly the time Newt became Speaker -- the GOP started acting like a suicide cult, and the Dems gained ascendance. I fully expect that around the 2020's the pols' poles will switch again.

It could just be that the very smart, sharp, unaffiliated gunslingers who come up during a period of dominance naturally go to the other side because there's more daylight. Lee Atwater famously became a Republican strategist rather than a Democratic strategist because there was less competition. The people who actually come up with the narratives that entire generations of voters take to heart as Gospel are almost always politically agnostic. They have no more belief in liberalism or conservatism than an ad man setting out to create a campaign for Coke or Pepsi. It's simply the art of manipulation for them.

The one truth that, if widely known, would possibly bring the entire system down, is that all those deeply intoned beliefs that people think come from their own experience and reason were created as piece work by an industry that's just churning out baby food. Consent is not earned. It is made to order. It may always have been like that to some extent, but technologies improve over time, and that of mass manipulation is no exception.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

It could just be that the very smart, sharp, unaffiliated gunslingers who come up during a period of dominance naturally go to the other side because there's more daylight. Lee Atwater famously became a Republican strategist rather than a Democratic strategist because there was less competition. The people who actually come up with the narratives that entire generations of voters take to heart as Gospel are almost always politically agnostic. They have no more belief in liberalism or conservatism as an ad man setting out to create a campaign for Coke or Pepsi. It's simply the art of manipulation for them.

The one truth that, if widely known, would possibly bring the entire system down, is that all those deeply intoned beliefs that people think come from their own experience and reason were created as piece work by an industry that's just churning out baby food. Consent is not earned. It is made to order.

Nicely put. We are very much in agreement here; my screeds against "career politicians" do have a reasoned thoughtful background behind them, which you have articulated nicely here.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Obama XXIII: The Muslin Anti-Christ Wages War on the forces of Christianity!

Nicely put. We are very much in agreement here; my screeds against "career politicians" do have a reasoned thoughtful background behind them, which you have articulated nicely here.

Though of course the narrative of "those darned career politicians" is itself just another product, packaged, distributed, and bought.

Insofar as there is a way "outside" the system, it's to know the comparative history of other countries and the way effective political themes are manufactured in them. Our own politics is too close -- it's in our blind spot. But it's helpful to look at, say, Norwegian political campaigns for and against fish slapping ("it's our fundamental tradition that holds the family together!"), and then try to analogize back to ourselves. But to be honest, even that doesn't really help all that much. At the end of the day, some candy just tastes better to us personally than other candy. Some people really love "Rugged Individualism" M&Ms. Other people love "Social Justice" tic tacs. Our biography is our "taste buds." That's why people who make similar choices at the candy counter tend to resemble each other in ways that on the surface should have no relationship to their ability to reason out a personal political view. They share a demographic. They're primed for the same ads.