MavHockey14
New member
this is exactly right. This thread is for one ultra liberal guy to try rehashing his same points and values over and over again.
I thought I was the only Mavs guy left here! Good to see you!
USCHO Fan Forum
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.
Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
- Thread starter Noise Inside My Head
- Start date
this is exactly right. This thread is for one ultra liberal guy to try rehashing his same points and values over and over again.
I thought I was the only Mavs guy left here! Good to see you!
uaafanblog
AKA - "Drop The Puck"
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
It is humorous to see those who claim righteousness defend their use of this nickname/logo by decrying analogous usage in other places.
"But Mommy, why do I have to clean my room? Billy across the street doesn't have to clean his!"
You folks here questioning and defending all this do realize that the probable majority of people in your state prefer that the nickname go away if for no other reason than to be done with the whole controversy? Isn't 5 or 6 years of this enough for you? Can you not learn to associate yourselves with some other symbology that isn't offensive to a group of people that had their lands stolen, culture nearly demolished and ancestors murdered by an invading force which disgustingly perverted their own religious beliefs to justify themselves?
Seriously, are your own personal identities that deeply tied to a college hockey teams name? You can survive this ... it is nothing more than a tiny slice removed from your spuriously adopted egos. Let it go. It's no more painful washing your hair in the shower.
It is humorous to see those who claim righteousness defend their use of this nickname/logo by decrying analogous usage in other places.
"But Mommy, why do I have to clean my room? Billy across the street doesn't have to clean his!"
You folks here questioning and defending all this do realize that the probable majority of people in your state prefer that the nickname go away if for no other reason than to be done with the whole controversy? Isn't 5 or 6 years of this enough for you? Can you not learn to associate yourselves with some other symbology that isn't offensive to a group of people that had their lands stolen, culture nearly demolished and ancestors murdered by an invading force which disgustingly perverted their own religious beliefs to justify themselves?
Seriously, are your own personal identities that deeply tied to a college hockey teams name? You can survive this ... it is nothing more than a tiny slice removed from your spuriously adopted egos. Let it go. It's no more painful washing your hair in the shower.
uaafanblog
AKA - "Drop The Puck"
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
Are you seriously stupid enough to compare a short period of racism and repression that seemingly all immigrants go through when they voluntarily come to the U.S. to the RANK GENOCIDE that was consciously perpetrated against the peaceful people who inhabited this continent long before any European even imagined the place existed?
Come back to this thread when you are older than 14. Else you might get trod upon in ways which are inconceivable to someone like you (i.e... a child) who operating with less than a fully matured prefrontal cortex.
And now for something that you can comprehend ...
Are you seriously stupid enough to compare a short period of racism and repression that seemingly all immigrants go through when they voluntarily come to the U.S. to the RANK GENOCIDE that was consciously perpetrated against the peaceful people who inhabited this continent long before any European even imagined the place existed?
Come back to this thread when you are older than 14. Else you might get trod upon in ways which are inconceivable to someone like you (i.e... a child) who operating with less than a fully matured prefrontal cortex.
And now for something that you can comprehend ...
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
And some of us are saying that one tribe has approved the usage, and some of our own personal heritages are also being stereotyped (Irish, in my case), and bringing up the fact that it isn't a "racist" or "hostile and abusive" name except to a certain minority (compared to those who support it). Furthermore, the logo was designed by an Indian, and it is NOT a caricature (like the Cleveland Indians former logo), and UND does tons for the Indian population. How is that offensive.
Knowing your "bit," you might be just doing this to stir the pot, I dunno. Either way, you are coming off just as ignorant as the white folk who fight these things, and/or the NCAA.
And some of us are saying that one tribe has approved the usage, and some of our own personal heritages are also being stereotyped (Irish, in my case), and bringing up the fact that it isn't a "racist" or "hostile and abusive" name except to a certain minority (compared to those who support it). Furthermore, the logo was designed by an Indian, and it is NOT a caricature (like the Cleveland Indians former logo), and UND does tons for the Indian population. How is that offensive.
Knowing your "bit," you might be just doing this to stir the pot, I dunno. Either way, you are coming off just as ignorant as the white folk who fight these things, and/or the NCAA.
MavHockey14
New member
why should 5 or 6 years be enough to fight for something we believe in?
MavHockey14
New member
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
maybe we should've listened to Dirty..
maybe we should've listened to Dirty..
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
Yep.
UND had a decision based on a variety of complicated factors and made a specific decision. The govt has taken that decision away from them. Big government is not defined by the number of people it governs, but rather the number of decisions it takes away from society.
I don't see it as demeaning to NAs. But my opinion on the particular issue is irrelevent as it doesn't target me. A substantial representation of Sioux have come out saying its demeaning.
If folks think the Irish are being abused...they should campaign to get Notre Dame's logo changed.
American Universities have decided that there is significant collateral damage from such logos...and the NCAA just is carrying it out.
Yep.
UND had a decision based on a variety of complicated factors and made a specific decision. The govt has taken that decision away from them. Big government is not defined by the number of people it governs, but rather the number of decisions it takes away from society.
I don't see it as demeaning to NAs. But my opinion on the particular issue is irrelevent as it doesn't target me. A substantial representation of Sioux have come out saying its demeaning.
If folks think the Irish are being abused...they should campaign to get Notre Dame's logo changed.
American Universities have decided that there is significant collateral damage from such logos...and the NCAA just is carrying it out.
uaafanblog
AKA - "Drop The Puck"
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
The tons that they do for the Indian population can easily be enhanced through one simple and painless act. Eliminate the name and logo. What is harmed other than ego in that act? Who does ceasing it's use hurt?
It was truly an awful period in history when Ethiopia invaded and conquered Ireland then repressed them for 500 years. Just awful. Get it? Irish people participated gleefully in the rape and pillaging of the homelands of American aboriginals. Just like German, English, Dutch, Scottish, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Italian, Greek etcetera did at various times. Native peoples have been demeaned, repressed and cast aside with prejudice for that entire 500 years. Your failure to recognize that history is no big surprise since nobody took the time to teach it to you. That however, doesn't mean it didn't happen. Cos, it did.
The Chippewa who designed that logo is no less a product of the propagandized history than you. His formal schooling did no more to teach him what really happened than did yours. Do you really think that his ethnic heritage makes him immune from being brainwashed by inaccurate histories written by the conquering hoard?
The tons that they do for the Indian population can easily be enhanced through one simple and painless act. Eliminate the name and logo. What is harmed other than ego in that act? Who does ceasing it's use hurt?
Fortunately for you ... I'll be limiting my interaction with you on this board in the future (not that I already don't try to ignore drunken stupid twats). Thank your own quite limited cognition for that. There is nothing in what I've said here in this thread which can be construed as some "bit" which this deeply disingenuous and petty statement implies. I'm far from "ignorant".
MavHockey14
New member
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
You are intelligent, don't get me wrong. But your black-n-white stance on this issue is ludicrous. Ridiculous. Ignore me? Fine. I don't care. I'll still speak my mind and my opinions. Ignorant? No. Fair? I believe yes. So keep stoking the fire. I will sit back and laugh.
You are intelligent, don't get me wrong. But your black-n-white stance on this issue is ludicrous. Ridiculous. Ignore me? Fine. I don't care. I'll still speak my mind and my opinions. Ignorant? No. Fair? I believe yes. So keep stoking the fire. I will sit back and laugh.
uaafanblog
AKA - "Drop The Puck"
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
Thank you for entirely living up to exactly what I expected. Rather than address any issue raised or argued in this thread; you choose to resort to a wholly inaccurate label of my political leanings.
As I mentioned earlier, you are incapable of participating in this discussion. My assumption that you're not an adult may be completely wrong however you've done nothing in this post to indicate otherwise. So ... go away and let adults exchange thoughts. Please "burd" ... come back.
These political labels that you've been programmed to trot out in circumstances like this (a discussion where you reasoning abilities have been exceeded) are pathetic. Your usage of such a thing speaks volumes about your personal character and nothing about mine.
Thank you for entirely living up to exactly what I expected. Rather than address any issue raised or argued in this thread; you choose to resort to a wholly inaccurate label of my political leanings.
As I mentioned earlier, you are incapable of participating in this discussion. My assumption that you're not an adult may be completely wrong however you've done nothing in this post to indicate otherwise. So ... go away and let adults exchange thoughts. Please "burd" ... come back.
These political labels that you've been programmed to trot out in circumstances like this (a discussion where you reasoning abilities have been exceeded) are pathetic. Your usage of such a thing speaks volumes about your personal character and nothing about mine.
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
UND chose to be part of this program (the NCAA). They can withdraw, if they want, and not be subject to the NCAA's sanction about "hostile and abusive" logos. However, IMO, the NCAA is a monopoly. And they, like the NFL in theory, and the MLB in law, are exempt. Too bad that if UND withdraws from the NCAA, they are more f*ed than now. Whoopdeedoo.
UND chose to be part of this program (the NCAA). They can withdraw, if they want, and not be subject to the NCAA's sanction about "hostile and abusive" logos. However, IMO, the NCAA is a monopoly. And they, like the NFL in theory, and the MLB in law, are exempt. Too bad that if UND withdraws from the NCAA, they are more f*ed than now. Whoopdeedoo.
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
At least the Trojans have a loophole - they can just change the logo to a rubber.
How many Irish, Spartans, and Trojans petitioned the schools with those names to drop said names?
At least the Trojans have a loophole - they can just change the logo to a rubber.
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
True, but it is a mirror of the University's wishes anyways (and they are not a monopoly).
True, but it is a mirror of the University's wishes anyways (and they are not a monopoly).
MinnesotaNorthStar
Minding the gap
How many Seminoles petitioned FSU? Yet, they were on the initial list...
White = OK
Indian = Not OK
Again, sounds racist.
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
And the Irish? They're too drunk to care.
White people have been the ruling class in this country since its founding - pretty tough to be 'hostile and abusive' toward them with nicknames.
And the Irish? They're too drunk to care.
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
The "governement" isn't dictating anything here. The NCAA is. Big difference.
The "governement" isn't dictating anything here. The NCAA is. Big difference.
HarleyMC
Registered User
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
I appreciate your post from a humanitarian and multicultural perspective and it spoke to my heart. You are right. I would add it takes a significant effort to uncover the authentic history (beyond the intrinsic selection bias within history textbooks) of Euro-American attitudes towards "Indians" as a malignant presence to be extirpated; and the well documented but obscure history of the perpetuity of government sponsored, systematic ethnocide and cultural genocide that virtually decimated Native American tribal culture over a half of millennium.
It's pretty clear from documented historical accounts not normally stocked on public school bookshelves, that the Christian influenced European expansionism agenda, under a perceived God ordained banner of manifest destiny, was responsible for the complete obliteration of entire tribes...men, women and children.
As an American, I've never been too proud of our historical human rights record towards particular ethnic immigrant people groups. But this historical holocaust was sadly without exception (true historical accounts of brutality towards Mexicans run a close second), the most infamous example of wholesale racism and premeditated annihilation of an aboriginal people group under the spurious guise of Christian values in the history of this country.
I recall reading shocking quotes like this from the 26th President of the United States, Teddy Roosevelt:
Or this one by Congressman James M. Cavanaugh of Montana in 1868, who reiterated without rebuke from the floor of the House of Representatives perhaps the most infamous and widely held racial slur ever uttered in the United States Congress:
As time passed treaties were made, but regularly broken, frequently altered or completely ignored. The federal and state governments often re-acquired land designated for reservations if it was found that the land held significant economic value. So goes the historical and ongoing plight of Native Americans, whose multiethnic distinctives and sociocultural diversity has been typically castrated under the dominant culture's covert racist term, "Indians".
In my view, if a Native American tribe believes that stereotyping is an issue with a sports moniker, as much as I like the look of Sioux logo, name, jersey, we must let it go and give them the constitutional honor that is rightfully theirs as Americans to take whatever steps they feel are necessary to reconstruct their social identity. While I'm sure there are historical examples of brutality at the hands of Native American people against Euro-Americans, I am saddened by the extant atrocities that rivet our great history as a nation.
Let's not allow sports entertainment to blind us in myopic shortsightedness when we can at least do something, however small in retrospect, to redeem and mend historical injustices perpetrated towards a virtually disenfranchised people group that is seeking at the very most a voice and little dignity. In the end I believe this will be a win-win situation.
I appreciate your post from a humanitarian and multicultural perspective and it spoke to my heart. You are right. I would add it takes a significant effort to uncover the authentic history (beyond the intrinsic selection bias within history textbooks) of Euro-American attitudes towards "Indians" as a malignant presence to be extirpated; and the well documented but obscure history of the perpetuity of government sponsored, systematic ethnocide and cultural genocide that virtually decimated Native American tribal culture over a half of millennium.
It's pretty clear from documented historical accounts not normally stocked on public school bookshelves, that the Christian influenced European expansionism agenda, under a perceived God ordained banner of manifest destiny, was responsible for the complete obliteration of entire tribes...men, women and children.
As an American, I've never been too proud of our historical human rights record towards particular ethnic immigrant people groups. But this historical holocaust was sadly without exception (true historical accounts of brutality towards Mexicans run a close second), the most infamous example of wholesale racism and premeditated annihilation of an aboriginal people group under the spurious guise of Christian values in the history of this country.
I recall reading shocking quotes like this from the 26th President of the United States, Teddy Roosevelt:
Or this one by Congressman James M. Cavanaugh of Montana in 1868, who reiterated without rebuke from the floor of the House of Representatives perhaps the most infamous and widely held racial slur ever uttered in the United States Congress:
As time passed treaties were made, but regularly broken, frequently altered or completely ignored. The federal and state governments often re-acquired land designated for reservations if it was found that the land held significant economic value. So goes the historical and ongoing plight of Native Americans, whose multiethnic distinctives and sociocultural diversity has been typically castrated under the dominant culture's covert racist term, "Indians".
In my view, if a Native American tribe believes that stereotyping is an issue with a sports moniker, as much as I like the look of Sioux logo, name, jersey, we must let it go and give them the constitutional honor that is rightfully theirs as Americans to take whatever steps they feel are necessary to reconstruct their social identity. While I'm sure there are historical examples of brutality at the hands of Native American people against Euro-Americans, I am saddened by the extant atrocities that rivet our great history as a nation.
Let's not allow sports entertainment to blind us in myopic shortsightedness when we can at least do something, however small in retrospect, to redeem and mend historical injustices perpetrated towards a virtually disenfranchised people group that is seeking at the very most a voice and little dignity. In the end I believe this will be a win-win situation.
Last edited:
Re: Fighting Sioux to fight on...For one more year at least.
Not even close. The settlement for UND was whether to drop the logo or keep the logo and have it not to use it during the postseason (without any further ramifications). UND decided the former.
The government has determined that the University does not have freewill in this case...and dictated the outcome for the University. UND opposes this government intervention (GFH, 3/1/11)...and now the government is trying stifle dissent by removing UND's leadership.
Big government is doing what the NCAA could never do.
Not even close. The settlement for UND was whether to drop the logo or keep the logo and have it not to use it during the postseason (without any further ramifications). UND decided the former.
The government has determined that the University does not have freewill in this case...and dictated the outcome for the University. UND opposes this government intervention (GFH, 3/1/11)...and now the government is trying stifle dissent by removing UND's leadership.
Big government is doing what the NCAA could never do.