What's new
By:
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Rover said:
We Want Newt! We Want Newt!
Click to expand...
I honestly don't see the appeal. But I do think that Prof. Davis makes a great point:
‎"A lot of conservatives owe Bill Clinton an apology if they applauded the Gennifer Flowers story back in 1992 (or called for Clinton's impeachment in '98), but now support Newt. The same people who insisted that "character is the issue" and lamented over the "death of outrage" in the 1990s are now giving Newt a free pass." - Michael A. Davis (History Professor at Liberty University)

In the long run, I'm sure it advantages Romney to have an exciting primary and emerge victorious later in the summer, armed with months of headlines, an excited electorate, and widespread name recognition. Regardless, I feel like Newt is too dangerous to flirt with. Just dump him now and run against Obama early.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

geezer said:
I honestly don't see the appeal. But I do think that Prof. Davis makes a great point:
‎"A lot of conservatives owe Bill Clinton an apology if they applauded the Gennifer Flowers story back in 1992 (or called for Clinton's impeachment in '98), but now support Newt. The same people who insisted that "character is the issue" and lamented over the "death of outrage" in the 1990s are now giving Newt a free pass." - Michael A. Davis (History Professor at Liberty University)

In the long run, I'm sure it advantages Romney to have an exciting primary and emerge victorious later in the summer, armed with months of headlines, an excited electorate, and widespread name recognition. Regardless, I feel like Newt is too dangerous to flirt with. Just dump him now and run against Obama early.
Click to expand...

I agree with the professor, more or less. But let's not forget millions of Democrats wanted to nominate a guy who'd only killed a girl and run away. Clinton, in addition to being a serial philanderer may have come this close to being a rapist, if you believe Ms. Broderick. And Democrats nominated a guy for VP who produced a "love child," apparantly hid the child's existence and paid for his upkeep using campaign funds, which may, in fact, have been a crime.

Bad behavior is bad behavior. And we should all try to be consistent in analyzing it. Newt has behaved badly, but he's hardly the first. Where's Wilbur Mills when you really need him?

Far more hypocritical and cynical to me were NOW et al, who professed great concern about Clarence Thomas' language with a Yale Law School grad, but were silent on Bill Clinton and his cigar in the Oval, with an intern.
 
Last edited:
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

geezer said:
I honestly don't see the appeal. But I do think that Prof. Davis makes a great point:
‎"A lot of conservatives owe Bill Clinton an apology if they applauded the Gennifer Flowers story back in 1992 (or called for Clinton's impeachment in '98), but now support Newt. The same people who insisted that "character is the issue" and lamented over the "death of outrage" in the 1990s are now giving Newt a free pass." - Michael A. Davis (History Professor at Liberty University)

In the long run, I'm sure it advantages Romney to have an exciting primary and emerge victorious later in the summer, armed with months of headlines, an excited electorate, and widespread name recognition. Regardless, I feel like Newt is too dangerous to flirt with. Just dump him now and run against Obama early.
Click to expand...
Should the President be held to a higher standard than a Congressman? Should an intern count for more negative points than an lobbyist / staffer? Does failing to tell the truth while under oath count for anything?

And Willie dropped drawers in the Oval Office, not the family quarters upstairs. That ought to be a big negative, too.

However, adultery is adultery, even though society thinks it's ok, until somebody gets caught, then its cluck cluck of the tongues.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

joecct said:
Should the President be held to a higher standard than a Congressman? Should an intern count for more negative points than an lobbyist / staffer? Does failing to tell the truth while under oath count for anything?

And Willie dropped drawers in the Oval Office, not the family quarters upstairs. That ought to be a big negative, too.

However, adultery is adultery, even though society thinks it's ok, until somebody gets caught, then its cluck cluck of the tongues.
Click to expand...

I didn't bring it up to defend Slick Willie, by any means. My point was more that Newt is just as much a sleazy greaseball as Bill. I think basic morality should count for something.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

In my mind, an intern shouldn't count more than a staffer. You will recall, however, that the core argument of NOW and Katherine MacKinnon (whom CBS trotted out night after night as an unrebutted "expert.") during the Hill/Thomas hearings was that Thomas was guilty of "sexual harrassment" for allegedly coming on to a Yale Law School grad. No claim of sexual contact nor of threats should contact be rejected. It was the "power differential" which was key. Not so much in the case of POTUS and a young intern. Some of us found that inconsistent, at a minimum.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Priceless said:
From the Rick Santorum website.

Unite-rotator.jpg


I bet a lot of people want to make a big C.U.M. deposit.
Click to expand...

This is just brilliant.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

TimP said:
If you were the President, would you want your citizens to know how good the Cubans have it? You have your corporate overlords to protect!
Click to expand...

How good the Cubans have it? Jeebus, I hope that was pure sarcasm.... Otherwise you, good sir, have made the least informed and most naive post I have ever seen on this board. Ever.

That's why Cubans flee to the US. Because it's so epicawesomefantastic in Cuba.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

dxmnkd316 said:
How good the Cubans have it? Jeebus, I hope that was pure sarcasm.... Otherwise you, good sir, have made the least informed and most naive post I have ever seen on this board. Ever.

That's why Cubans flee to the US. Because it's so epicawesomefantastic in Cuba.
Click to expand...
Does UAA have another "handle"? Stupidity is running rampant lately.... TimP - genius at large :rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

unofan said:
Should someone running on a social conservative platform be held to a higher standard than someone who is running on a "keep gov't out of our bedrooms" platform? I think for many people the problem isn't adultery per se, but the hypocracy that goes along with it.

There should be a double standard to the extent a person runs on a given issue. I don't think candidate's families should really be fair game, but if you run on the "protecting traditional marriage" ticket, then you opened up the door to your marriage being an issue.

What do I care, though. I definitely won't vote for Newt, and there's only about a 5% chance I'd vote for Romney. The GOP candidates pretty much all suck this cycle.
Click to expand...

Just so we're clear. You have no problem with Bill Clinton and his cigar in the Oval. Or Teddy Kennedy killing and running, because neither of them were hypocritical about it? One's a disgusting lech, the other a murdering drunk, but that's okay by you because they never claimed to be otherwise? Hypocrisy is the "real" crime.

Gerry Studds is less reprehensible than Mark Foley becase even though Studds actually corn holed under age Congressional pages, he didn't portray himself as being something other than a pedophile? Foley, who never laid a glove on a page, but who trolled through the page population looking for future assignations is worse, because he posed as a family values guy?
 
Last edited:
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

joecct said:
Should the President be held to a higher standard than a Congressman? Should an intern count for more negative points than an lobbyist / staffer? Does failing to tell the truth while under oath count for anything?

And Willie dropped drawers in the Oval Office, not the family quarters upstairs. That ought to be a big negative, too.

However, adultery is adultery, even though society thinks it's ok, until somebody gets caught, then its cluck cluck of the tongues.
Click to expand...

I think folks are saying Democrats and Republicans should be held to the same standards. The issue with conservatives vs. liberals. Liberals just don't really care that much. For many conservatives, bedroom issues are the main deal...that is until their guy cheats on his wife indefinitely or is caught in an airport stall picking up other guys.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Old Pio said:
Just so we're clear. You have no problem with Bill Clinton and his cigar in the Oval. Or Teddy Kennedy killing and running, because neither of them were hypocritical about it? One's a disgusting lech, the other a murdering drunk, but that's okay by you because they never claimed to be otherwise? Hypocrisy is the "real" crime.

Gerry Studds is less reprehensible than Mark Foley becase even though Studds actually corn holed under age Congressional pages, he didn't portray himself as being something other than a pedophile? Foley, who never laid a glove on a page, but who trolled through the page population looking for future assignations is worse, because he posed as a family values guy?
Click to expand...

What he said is that:
Adultery + Hypocrisy is worse than just Adultery.

Actual crimes are worse than adultery (with and without hypocrisy)
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Almington said:
What he said is that:
Adultery + Hypocrisy is worse than just Adultery.

Actual crimes are worse than adultery (with and without hypocrisy)
Click to expand...

I agree with what you say, but I don't think that was his point at all.

That's why I asked for clarification. Mark Foley, who didn't have sex with male Congressional pages is worse than Gerry Studds who DID have sex with male Congressional pages because Foley presented himself as a social conservative while Studds did not.

Since Barney Frank never condemned gay prostitution from any perspective: moral, legal or ethical. Then we have no right to criticize when his boyfriend opens a gay brothel in the congressman's town house.

The "crime" in UNO's eyes is running as a social conservative and falling short of the mark. Of course, there's more than one kind of hypocrisy, isn't there? For instace, posing as an environmentalist while living the lifestyle of an oriental potentate. See: Gore, Al and Kennedy, Teddy.
 
Last edited:
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Old Pio said:
I agree with what you say, but I don't think that was his point at all.

That's why I asked for clarification. Mark Foley, who didn't have sex with male Congressional pages is worse than Gerry Studds who DID have sex with male Congressional pages because Foley presented himself as a social conservative while Studds did not.

Since Barney Frank never condemned gay prostitution from any perspective: moral, legal or ethical. Then we have no right to criticize when his boyfriend opens a gay brothel in the congressman's town house.

The "crime" in UNO's eyes is running as a social conservative and falling short of the mark. Of course, there's more than one kind of hypocrisy, isn't there? For instace, posing as an environmentalist while living the lifestyle of an oriental potentate. See: Gore, Al and Kennedy, Teddy.
Click to expand...

You are trying to extend his argument to claim that hypocrisy is worse than an actual crime, I didn't read his post that way. I don't think that failing to speak out against something implies support for that choice. I think that the environmentalist examples are a much better parallel. In short, you shouldn't tell others how to live their life if you are not going to follow those principles in your own life.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Polling has Gingrich up 8 in Florida and Romney's 20+ point national lead down to 3.
 
Re: 2012 Elections Pt II: Bachmann Turned Me Into a Newt! A Newt?

Kepler said:
Great site.

Interesting that Paul and Obama's breakdown of sources are so similar.

How has Obama already spent $100M on campaigning? Is that just lead costs on setting things up?
Click to expand...

I think he's given to all the super PACs not supporting Romney.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top