Wisconsin Hockey 24-25 Improving With All Due Haste.

[WiscTJK]

Tonight, the reality hit me that this team is just not very good. I know the signs have been there with the start, but I figured they would start to string some wins together.

Hastings has his hands full with this group. I don’t see them getting to .500 and will likely be his first losing season as a coach.

I’m also beginning to wonder if his system and recruits will work in the big7. They are going to need to improve the recruiting quickly. They are in desperate need of higher end talent.

Minnesota has nhl draft picks for 13 of 22 players on the active roster. Wisconsin has 6.

Edit: Gramme was awesome this weekend particularly tonight and Horbach played admirably at D.

 

[digitalbooya]

I’m also beginning to wonder if his system and recruits will work in the big7. They are going to need to improve the recruiting quickly. They are in desperate need of higher end talent.

Minnesota has nhl draft picks for 13 of 22 players on the active roster. Wisconsin has 6.

Said this in the offseason thread when all of our draft picks were leaving and people did not take to it kindly.

In fact, reading the offseason thread is an absolute trippppp lol. Highly recommend.

 

[solovsfett]

I understand the frustration, particularly after last seasons results. This is the start I was expecting last year.

Overall, this team is improving from week to week. The improvement isn’t linear and it isn’t consistent, but you can see more of the pieces fall into place each week. Their is significant work to do and I suspect that we will see significant roster turnover.

Additional turnover might be a good thing, with the opening of CHL players, since there will be a major pool of experienced players who will be looking for opportunities at the same time rosters are going to be capped at 26 players. Huge opportunity to get some experienced quality players for Hastings system. Hopefully, they are out scouting the MJ leagues (particularly the WHL and OHL) HARD this fall. This is where the name Wisconsin should help open some doors.

It’s VERY possible I’m overreacting.

But man that overtime was very disappointing effortwise imo. That was terrible. Just letting Minnesota come at them with virtually no challenges for puck possession.

definitely agree Hastings should look at CHL guys.

 

[WiscTJK]

Said this in the offseason thread when all of our draft picks were leaving and people did not take to it kindly.

In fact, reading the offseason thread is an absolute trippppp lol. Highly recommend.

I think if those that left: Lucious, Whitelaw and Stramel plus others weren't with the program that coach was laying out, they needed to move on. But that puts the coaches front and center to get recruits and transfers that can succeed in the Big7. This group doesn't seem to be it. I may well be overreacting, but oof this season has been ugly. 46 of 64 in the pairwise tells you as much.

 

[Almington]

I think if those that left: Lucious, Whitelaw and Stramel plus others weren't with the program that coach was laying out, they needed to move on. But that puts the coaches front and center to get recruits and transfers that can succeed in the Big7. This group doesn't seem to be it. I may well be overreacting, but oof this season has been ugly. 46 of 64 in the pairwise tells you as much.

it has been a very ugly season, not what any of us expected or were hoping for.

Rebuilding a team is very much like renovating a house, until to get in there and start opening things up and looking around, you don’t know exactly what issues you will encounter.

I think that some of the issues were deeper and more pronounced than they appeared on the surface that that required rebuilding more of the foundation and underlying structure than anticipated.

when you look at who they brought in for this season, it was high floor, low ceiling experienced players who were not going to be here for a long time and thus wouldn’t have long term roster implications.

The following things are all true:
1.) this team is less talented than last year.
2.) the results are far worse than last season.
3.) offensively, this team is struggling mightily
4.) chemistry, as much as talent, accounts for the offensive struggles.
5.) the team is improving, albeit slowly.
6.) next year’s recruiting class, with the eligibility extended to CHL players for the first time, will be critical to getting the right players into the program.
7.) getting the program back to national relevance on an annual basis is going to require some serious patience.
8.) we are 1/3 of the way through the 2nd season, not the 10th. Now is not the time to panic.

 

[digitalbooya]

I think if those that left: Lucious, Whitelaw and Stramel plus others weren't with the program that coach was laying out, they needed to move on. But that puts the coaches front and center to get recruits and transfers that can succeed in the Big7. This group doesn't seem to be it. I may well be overreacting, but oof this season has been ugly. 46 of 64 in the pairwise tells you as much.

I agree and I think you’ve had a pretty level headed response to it all around. I’m more poking at the people who told me Hastings could pull in 26 Wisconsin fans and get wins and who openly mocked me for sounding the alarm.

 

[srkbadger]

I agree and I think you’ve had a pretty level headed response to it all around. I’m more poking at the people who told me Hastings could pull in 26 Wisconsin fans and get wins and who openly mocked me for sounding the alarm.

Not even close. I challenge you to find any such post on this entire board. I believe you'll find the comments along the lines of what WiscTJK said: if those who left wouldn't adapt to Hastings' system then it's best that they left.

 

[WiscTJK]

Prev Weekend: Loss 2-3 and Loss OT 2-3 vs Minnesota

Record: 2-8-0 overall (1-5-1-3); 1-2-0-3 6 pts, T-2[SUP]nd[/SUP] (3[SUP]rd[/SUP]) in Big7 (+1 (multiple games more played))
USCHO Poll: n/r (no votes); n/r (T-30[SUP]th[/SUP] in votes) (-14)
PWR: 46 of 64; 54 of 62 (+8)
RPI: 46 of 64; 54 of 62 (+8)
Scoring: 1.75 GPG (54[SUP]th[/SUP]); 1.75 GPG (54[SUP]th[/SUP]) (-4)
Defense: 3.00 GAPG (T-37[SUP]th[/SUP]); 3.00 GAPG (T-38[SUP]th[/SUP]) (+1)
Save %: .882 (T-52[SUP]nd[/SUP] of 64); .867 (58[SUP]th[/SUP] of 62) (+6)
Power Play Rate: 18.92% (7 of 37) 32[SUP]nd[/SUP]; 18.18% (6 of 33) 31[SUP]st[/SUP] (-1)
Penalty Kill Rate: 74.07% (20 of 27) 52[SUP]nd[/SUP]; 80.95% (17 of 21) T-35[SUP]th[/SUP] (-17)
Penalty Min per Game (1st is worst): 6.20 (60[SUP]th[/SUP] of 64); 5.75 (58[SUP]th[/SUP] of 62) (+2)
Penalty Min (1[SUP]st[/SUP] is worst): 62 (53[SUP]rd[/SUP]); 46 (54[SUP]th[/SUP]) (-1)
Shorthanded Goals Scored; 0 (T-34[SUP]th[/SUP]); 0 (T-28[SUP]th[/SUP]) (-6)
Shorthanded Goals Allowed (1[SUP]st[/SUP] is worst): 1 (T-13[SUP]th[/SUP]); 1 (T-12[SUP]th[/SUP]) (+1)
Team Faceoff: 55.3% (9[SUP]th[/SUP]); 55.2% (T-10[SUP]th[/SUP]) (+1)
SOG taken: 349 (4[SUP]th[/SUP]); 286 (2[SUP]nd[/SUP]) (-2)
Shooting % (1[SUP]st[/SUP] is worst): 5.2% (64[SUP]th[/SUP] of 64); 4.9% (60[SUP]th[/SUP] of 62) (-4)
SOG allowed (1[SUP]st[/SUP] is worst): 254 (T-35[SUP]th[/SUP]); 181 (45[SUP]th[/SUP]) (-10)

This week: at Penn State Fri 11/15 6 pm (B1G+), Sat 11/16 6:30 pm (B1G+)
Next week: BYE
Next game: Alaska Anchorage Fri 11/29 6 pm (B1G+); Sat 11/30 8 pm (B1G+)

 

[digitalbooya]

Not even close. I challenge you to find any such post on this entire board. I believe you'll find the comments along the lines of what WiscTJK said: if those who left wouldn't adapt to Hastings' system then it's best that they left.

Okay:

…
seriously. Wisconsin will be just fine without Lucius. I trust Hastings. He could take 26 Wisconsin fans and get wins out of em’.
​​​​​​….

There's a poster in this forum who knows what Hastings is doing wrong (albeit after one year with 26 wins, an NCAA berth, and apparently with a few guys who were checking out in the last part of the season), so maybe he has the strategy to turn it around and could take over the reigns.

Pages 7 and 8 of the offseason thread. Care to comment further about how there were not any of those posts?

 

[solovsfett]

Okay:



Pages 7 and 8 of the offseason thread. Care to comment further about how there were not any of those posts?

Grow up. Lucius didn’t want to be here and his absence is NOT the reason the team is 2-8. Ditto Whitelaw.

I know you don’t like it when people disagree with you but seriously, Hastings track record is undeniable. Even if this is his first losing season EVER. I’m frustrated as hell but in no way can we judge whether his style/players work in b10 with less than 2 years on the resume.

 

[srkbadger]

I'm sure Solo knows better than that, and with all due respect it was a stupid thing to say. Mike Hastings has an exceptional track record, but he's not a miracle worker. I'll stand by all of my posts. If players did not want to be at Wisconsin, regardless of the reason, it's best they moved on. I can only guess they weren't forced out other than being told that they would need to adapt to continue to play. Hastings will own the culture he installs and the results that come from it, so he needs to do it his way. You may think his way is wrong, I cannot draw such a conclusion after his years of success and the fact that we're 1/3 of the way through his second season. We all thought the Granato dream team would be raking in the hardware. How did that turn out?

BTW, Stramel has 2 goals and 4 assists through 8 games. Whitelaw has 1 goal and 2 assists through 9 games, and Lucius' stats are not posted even on the ASU website. I'm not judging this output, but if they were still here with that production I'm not sure we're winning any more games. Especially since they were allergic to the defensive zone, and that's still a problem for us now.

 

[solovsfett]

I'm sure Solo knows better than that, and with all due respect it was a stupid thing to say. Mike Hastings has an exceptional track record, but he's not a miracle worker. I'll stand by all of my posts. If players did not want to be at Wisconsin, regardless of the reason, it's best they moved on. I can only guess they weren't forced out other than being told that they would need to adapt to continue to play. Hastings will own the culture he installs and the results that come from it, so he needs to do it his way. You may think his way is wrong, I cannot draw such a conclusion after his years of success and the fact that we're 1/3 of the way through his second season. We all thought the Granato dream team would be raking in the hardware. How did that turn out?

BTW, Stramel has 2 goals and 8 assists through 8 games. Whitelaw has 1 goal and 2 assists through 9 games, and Lucius' stats are not posted even on the ASU website. I'm not judging this output, but if they were still here with that production I'm not sure we're winning any more games. Especially since they were allergic to the defensive zone, and that's still a problem for us now.

My point on talent based on Hastings’ entire career as coach is he’s like a Dick Bennett and Bo Ryan. He can take anyone and make them competitive. We’ll certainly find out more about that by Xmas break.

 

[digitalbooya]

Grow up. Lucius didn’t want to be here and his absence is NOT the reason the team is 2-8. Ditto Whitelaw.

I know you don’t like it when people disagree with you but seriously, Hastings track record is undeniable. Even if this is his first losing season EVER. I’m frustrated as hell but in no way can we judge whether his style/players work in b10 with less than 2 years on the resume.

Honestly, it is the tantrum fits, lack of critical analysis on events, and condescension that get me. Nothing to do with disagreement.

If you said these players leaving was fine because they don’t play the system the right way and we will have a down year as a result, fine because that seems like a logical progression. It’s the ridiculing those who sounded the alarm in the offseason, saying Hastings will win with anyone, and then having a temper tantrum during the season because the team cannot score without its top offensive players from the previous season. What did you expect to happen?

I cannot even tell if you like Hastings or not. You just said in one of your recent prior posts that the coaches have no clue how to fix the team’s problems. Now you’re saying his record is undeniable and we can’t judge his system/players because it’s only year 2. Would you pick a lane??

I'm sure Solo knows better than that, and with all due respect it was a stupid thing to say. Mike Hastings has an exceptional track record, but he's not a miracle worker. I'll stand by all of my posts. If players did not want to be at Wisconsin, regardless of the reason, it's best they moved on. I can only guess they weren't forced out other than being told that they would need to adapt to continue to play. Hastings will own the culture he installs and the results that come from it, so he needs to do it his way. You may think his way is wrong, I cannot draw such a conclusion after his years of success and the fact that we're 1/3 of the way through his second season. We all thought the Granato dream team would be raking in the hardware. How did that turn out?

BTW, Stramel has 2 goals and 8 assists through 8 games. Whitelaw has 1 goal and 2 assists through 9 games, and Lucius' stats are not posted even on the ASU website. I'm not judging this output, but if they were still here with that production I'm not sure we're winning any more games. Especially since they were allergic to the defensive zone, and that's still a problem for us now.

I don’t have a problem with Hastings as a coach. Said that multiple times in the offseason thread. He’s very similar to Mike Eaves (defensive scheme, wins with older teams), but has a better recruiter by his side that keeps the classes more balanced.

Some of us liked Don Granato much more than Tony Granato when it came to coaching. It was clear in season 2, when they couldn’t progressive the puck into the offensive zone against North Dakota at the Kohl Center, that Tony wasn’t a good coach and Don had left for Buffalo.

I am happy that Stramel left as a Wild fan. It was clear that he was never going to get an opportunity under Hastings and that it was better for his development to go to MSU and play for a coach he knew.

Lucius leaving stings the most. He was a difference maker. Whitelaw is just buried on a stacked offensive team. He would produce more here.

 

[solovsfett]

Honestly, it is the tantrum fits, lack of critical analysis on events, and condescension that get me. Nothing to do with disagreement.

If you said these players leaving was fine because they don’t play the system the right way and we will have a down year as a result, fine because that seems like a logical progression. It’s the ridiculing those who sounded the alarm in the offseason, saying Hastings will win with anyone, and then having a temper tantrum during the season because the team cannot score without its top offensive players from the previous season. What did you expect to happen?

I cannot even tell if you like Hastings or not. You just said in one of your recent prior posts that the coaches have no clue how to fix the team’s problems. Now you’re saying his record is undeniable and we can’t judge his system/players because it’s only year 2. Would you pick a lane??



I don’t have a problem with Hastings as a coach. Said that multiple times in the offseason thread. He’s very similar to Mike Eaves (defensive scheme, wins with older teams), but has a better recruiter by his side that keeps the classes more balanced.

Some of us liked Don Granato much more than Tony Granato when it came to coaching. It was clear in season 2, when they couldn’t progressive the puck into the offensive zone against North Dakota at the Kohl Center, that Tony wasn’t a good coach and Don had left for Buffalo.

I am happy that Stramel left as a Wild fan. It was clear that he was never going to get an opportunity under Hastings and that it was better for his development to go to MSU and play for a coach he knew.

Lucius leaving stings the most. He was a difference maker. Whitelaw is just buried on a stacked offensive team. He would produce more here.

Where did I post about problems scoring?
Yes, I’m glad Whitelaw and other players left who didn’t want to play the system.

Yes, I’m pissed that a coach I hold to VERY high standards based on his track record isn’t getting wins this year. And yes, I still believe he’s a Ryan/Bennett type coach.

But I have no right to be pissed about 2-8 regardless? Get real.

also to paraphrase you:
”if you said the players leaving was due to the system”…the funny thing about the internet is we all can voice our opinions. They don’t need to adhere to what you like, respect agree with or anything else. We generally disagree and have from the jump. I don’t know why you insist on engaging.

but since you do insist I’ll respond. Yea, I’m pissed at 2-8…but as you haven’t deduced I suppose, it’s more than 2-8 that has me pissed. It’s the malaise of 30 years interrupted by maybe 4-5 truly great seasons. If you weren’t around for the glory years maybe you don’t understand. So while I think Hastings is a great coach and is likely the answer we’re not far enough away from 30 years of mediocrity for me to let my foot off the gas of expectations.

 

[srkbadger]

This big issue is that those 'anyones' have to be willing to play within the structure of what the coach is installing. Some will naturally do so, some will adapt, and some won't change. Right or wrong this last group sometimes gets labeled as selfish. Maybe last year Hastings bent a little to what he had inherited, but in the long run it wasn't what he wanted the team to be. Too much change too fast. I'm no hockey systems genius to know whether what they're trying to do is markedly different this year versus last year. I doubt what he is asking them to do is beyond their capabilities, but boy they sure are struggling. More talent might have improved results so far this year. I'm more sure that better talent, all willing to play within Hastings' system, would improve the results. It looks like further infusion of players Hastings recruits will be necessary. In the end maybe his philosophy won't work in the Big 10, but I doubt it.

 

[WiscTJK]

I'm sure Solo knows better than that, and with all due respect it was a stupid thing to say. Mike Hastings has an exceptional track record, but he's not a miracle worker. I'll stand by all of my posts. If players did not want to be at Wisconsin, regardless of the reason, it's best they moved on. I can only guess they weren't forced out other than being told that they would need to adapt to continue to play. Hastings will own the culture he installs and the results that come from it, so he needs to do it his way. You may think his way is wrong, I cannot draw such a conclusion after his years of success and the fact that we're 1/3 of the way through his second season. We all thought the Granato dream team would be raking in the hardware. How did that turn out?

BTW, Stramel has 2 goals and 8 assists through 8 games. Whitelaw has 1 goal and 2 assists through 9 games, and Lucius' stats are not posted even on the ASU website. I'm not judging this output, but if they were still here with that production I'm not sure we're winning any more games. Especially since they were allergic to the defensive zone, and that's still a problem for us now.

• Stramel, 2 goals, 4 assists thru 8 games, T-3rd in scoring on MSU with 6, 17 minutes ice time, +5, (both goals scored against B/C 10/12); he played for Nightengale before and seems to be doing slightly better than under Hastings / Granato and will likely have his best stat year in college.
• Lucius hasn't played a game due to injury.
• Whitelaw 15:30 ice time for Michigan (0 +/-); extrapolated, his stats will likely be less than last year under Hastings.

 

[digitalbooya]

Where did I post about problems scoring?
Yes, I’m glad Whitelaw and other players left who didn’t want to play the system.

Yes, I’m ****ed that a coach I hold to VERY high standards based on his track record isn’t getting wins this year. And yes, I still believe he’s a Ryan/Bennett type coach.

There’s actually substance here, so let’s build on it.

If scoring isn’t the problem for this team, then what is? And don’t tell me it was lack of effort in OT against the gophers. Minnesota worked the 3v3 possession like they were an NHL team; changing players while maintaining possession and not allowing our team to change.

 

[Timothy A]

Lucius leaving stings the most. He was a difference maker. Whitelaw is just buried on a stacked offensive team. He would produce more here.

Every time he had the puck in the O zone he made something happen. He's the biggest loss, thought they lost a ton of experience at F overall. Losing that F kid to PSU was a blow as well. He brought in 2 of the more highly regarded F's to try and fill the gaps and from a recruiting standpoint he only had 1 year under his belt at UW and most of the desirable guys were signed 2-3 years ago by other teams, so he didn't have a lot to pick from from the uncommitted.

UW has great coaches with a proven track record up and down the staff, not just Hastings. It will come together.

 

[srkbadger]

Every time he had the puck in the O zone he made something happen.

Now tell me about what he did in the D zone. It's a 200 foot game.

 

[solovsfett]

There’s actually substance here, so let’s build on it.

If scoring isn’t the problem for this team, then what is? And don’t tell me it was lack of effort in OT against the gophers. Minnesota worked the 3v3 possession like they were an NHL team; changing players while maintaining possession and not allowing our team to change.

Like I said, we fundamentally disagree on what is happening here.

you seem to think it’s a talent issue, i don’t.

Hastings is a great coach and his assistants are great too. He arrived to a full cupboard and it showed last year. The cupboard is still full. THAT is a part of the frustration. This isn’t a Sauer team circa 1997 or Eaves circa 2015.

THAT is why I get frustrated. Add to it the history of the last 30 years and I have 0 patience.

As for Hastings’ style perhaps not working in b10?

the same was said about Bo Ryan and Dick Bennett. They turned out okay as I recall.