What's new
By:
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

admiral0417 said:
Actually....NO. The East has won two of the last 5. A much better historical reference would show the East has won 14 of the last 20. By that measure, the East has show plenty in March.
Click to expand...

Sorry...I meant 4 of the last 6. Why would using 14 of the last 20, when western teams have won 4 of the last 6, be a better measure for the 2013-14 rankings? Cue Janet Jackson's "What Have You Done For Me Lately".
 
Last edited:
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

With all due respect to Eau Claire last year......St. Norbert IS the West.
 
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

LakerFan99 said:
Then you don't understand the point of a "preseason" poll. The poll isn't supposed to be based on what was accomplished last year. It's supposed to be based on the team's potential THIS year. Just as you said, does Platty have the potential to be a top 3 team? Absolutely. That's why they are top 3 in the other poll. Because THAT poll is more based on what the teams look like THIS year as opposed to what happened LAST year.
Click to expand...

Last year's performance is a very strong indicator as to how teams perform this year. Also strong indicators are historical success, changes in staff, and portion of students graduated. They can all be indicators of success. My issue is that even though Plattsburgh has a lot of talented guys on it, they didn't accomplish anything they set out to accomplish last season. And didn't they lose in the first round of the NCAAs the year before that? If memory serves correctly, I don't think a single person on Platty's roster has ever even made the Frozen Four before. Last year the only stats that stood out were their #3 defense and their #1 penalty kill. Their best point-scorer was ranked #34 in the league and he graduated. Chewy was ranked #5 and #12 for GAA and sv pctg respectively. Offense ranked #13, and power play ranked #16. None of that screams a #3 overall team.

Does Plattsburgh have talented guys on their team? Absolutely. Will they come together to produce some positive results this year? Maybe, but they didn't do it last year. And to me, that's a huge burden to cavalierly throw aside. It's not like they just pulled in a bunch of NHL-level players as freshmen recruits. So what's changed on their roster between last year and this year? They've got mostly the exact same guys, therefore last year's record is a VERY strong indicator of how they're going to do this year. You might say that they're bound to get better this year, but by the very nature of the game, there is an equal chance they could do worse.

As always, if Oswego doesn't make the NCAA's, I hope Plattsburgh does and they win it all. And I always root for them in NC games. But I just don't feel a top 3 overall rating is justified for them just yet. If they win their first 5 games by landslide margins, then absolutely. But pre-season? No, they got WAY too much to prove after last year's failure.
 
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

toto238 said:
Last year's performance is a very strong indicator as to how teams perform this year. Also strong indicators are historical success, changes in staff, and portion of students graduated. They can all be indicators of success. My issue is that even though Plattsburgh has a lot of talented guys on it, they didn't accomplish anything they set out to accomplish last season. And didn't they lose in the first round of the NCAAs the year before that? If memory serves correctly, I don't think a single person on Platty's roster has ever even made the Frozen Four before. Last year the only stats that stood out were their #3 defense and their #1 penalty kill. Their best point-scorer was ranked #34 in the league and he graduated. Chewy was ranked #5 and #12 for GAA and sv pctg respectively. Offense ranked #13, and power play ranked #16. None of that screams a #3 overall team.

Does Plattsburgh have talented guys on their team? Absolutely. Will they come together to produce some positive results this year? Maybe, but they didn't do it last year. And to me, that's a huge burden to cavalierly throw aside. It's not like they just pulled in a bunch of NHL-level players as freshmen recruits. So what's changed on their roster between last year and this year? They've got mostly the exact same guys, therefore last year's record is a VERY strong indicator of how they're going to do this year. You might say that they're bound to get better this year, but by the very nature of the game, there is an equal chance they could do worse.

As always, if Oswego doesn't make the NCAA's, I hope Plattsburgh does and they win it all. And I always root for them in NC games. But I just don't feel a top 3 overall rating is justified for them just yet. If they win their first 5 games by landslide margins, then absolutely. But pre-season? No, they got WAY too much to prove after last year's failure.
Click to expand...

There is an interesting article somewhere on the internet about predicting performance for this year's crop of teams. You can look if you'd like :)
 
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

toto explain to me how last years Plattsburgh team was a failure. They had a young and unheralded group who managed to take two games from Oswego with the shutout loss in the SUNYAC Finals being Oswego's best defensive performance of the year. They beat a bunch of good teams, lost some close games and didn't lose much to graduation. Some of the other top teams, Oswego, Norwich and Eau-Claire lost some very important pieces to their teams. While I am sure the new guys on all three of those teams will keep them competitive on a high level, Plattsburgh looks primed to move ahead of them if they experience any growing pains.
 
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

toto's pretty upset with Plattsburgh's pre-season rank !! Not sure why. Anyone who follows the DIII game would probably agree with it. I take nothing away from Oswego and they are sure to be good. But the problem is they are about 75% unknown/new team. Same for Norwich. Those two are obviously Plattsburgh's biggest rivals.
You don't base pre-season polls on LAST years performance. It is a factor. Some teams get wiped out by graduation and are starting a new group out. It's just an educated guess on who will/should/may be in the hunt this coming year. Means nothing really. The part about Plattsburgh accomplishing nothing last year is a bit ridiculous I'd say. Beating Oswego twice for starters!
 
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

toto's pretty upset with Plattsburgh's pre-season rank !! Not sure why. Anyone who follows the DIII game would probably agree with it. I take nothing away from Oswego and they are sure to be good. But the problem is they are about 75% unknown/new team. Same for Norwich. Those two are obviously Plattsburgh's biggest rivals.
You don't base pre-season polls on LAST years performance. It is a factor. Some teams get wiped out by graduation and are starting a new group out. It's just an educated guess on who will/should/may be in the hunt this coming year. Means nothing really. The part about Plattsburgh accomplishing nothing last year is a bit ridiculous I'd say. Beating Oswego twice for starters!
 
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

Both polls are useless. For example if I remember right UWEC maybe received votes in one pre-season poll and didn't get one vote in the other. The polls are fun to look at but a waste of time to debate. Especially since the puck hasn't even dropped yet for almost every (DIII) team in the country.
 
toto238 said:
Last year's performance is a very strong indicator as to how teams perform this year. Also strong indicators are historical success, changes in staff, and portion of students graduated. They can all be indicators of success. My issue is that even though Plattsburgh has a lot of talented guys on it, they didn't accomplish anything they set out to accomplish last season. And didn't they lose in the first round of the NCAAs the year before that? If memory serves correctly, I don't think a single person on Platty's roster has ever even made the Frozen Four before. Last year the only stats that stood out were their #3 defense and their #1 penalty kill. Their best point-scorer was ranked #34 in the league and he graduated. Chewy was ranked #5 and #12 for GAA and sv pctg respectively. Offense ranked #13, and power play ranked #16. None of that screams a #3 overall team.

Does Plattsburgh have talented guys on their team? Absolutely. Will they come together to produce some positive results this year? Maybe, but they didn't do it last year. And to me, that's a huge burden to cavalierly throw aside. It's not like they just pulled in a bunch of NHL-level players as freshmen recruits. So what's changed on their roster between last year and this year? They've got mostly the exact same guys, therefore last year's record is a VERY strong indicator of how they're going to do this year. You might say that they're bound to get better this year, but by the very nature of the game, there is an equal chance they could do worse.

As always, if Oswego doesn't make the NCAA's, I hope Plattsburgh does and they win it all. And I always root for them in NC games. But I just don't feel a top 3 overall rating is justified for them just yet. If they win their first 5 games by landslide margins, then absolutely. But pre-season? No, they got WAY too much to prove after last year's failure.
Click to expand...

Opinions are great but what's your Top 15?
 
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

PSUChamps2001 said:
Opinions are great but what's your Top 15?
Click to expand...

For me, top 5 teams, in no particular order:
WEC, Norwich, St. Norbert, Adrian, Utica

6-10 teams, in no particular order:
Plattsburgh, Oswego, Hobart, Bowdoin and maybe Babson of UMass Boston for the 10th spot.

I don't really know enough about many teams after that point.

I don't deny that Plattsburgh pulled off some great wins against some tough teams last year. But they also suffered some bad losses to some mediocre teams. Genny, Middlebury, Amherst, Castleton, Freddy and a tie with Cortland.

It's not enough to have a lot of talent on your roster. Middlebury has talent. Geneseo has talent. Umass Boston has talent. Neumann had the #1 goalie in the league last year by save pctg. Fitchburg State had the #1 point scorer in the league. Becker had the #1 goal-scorer. St. Thomas had the #3 goaltender in the league by GAA. Babson had the #2 PP and PK in the league. These are all teams with talent on them. But none of them are top 5 teams right now. Some of them have no chance whatsoever of getting into the top 5 this year (Fitchburg, Becker).

What I'm saying is that some teams don't have a lot to prove. St. Norbert and Oswego last year didn't have much to prove. They both made the championship game after a fairly successful regular season and didn't lose many guys to graduation. This year, Oswego lost 75% of their guys, so they have a lot to prove. It's the combination of both keeping your guys AS WELL as your guys having a proven record that should be considered with these rankings. Those that accomplished both last season deserve to be in the top 5. Teams like Norwich or Utica that made the Frozen Four and only lost 5 or 6 guys. Or Adrian that only lost 4 guys. Or St. Norbert that only lost 5 guys. These are teams that accomplished a lot in the regular season, accomplished a lot in the post-season, and are keeping most of the guys that did that for them.

So why should Plattsburgh, a team that has great talent but only managed to win one post-season game last season, be placed in front of other teams that both have great talent AND managed to win more than a couple tough games against tough opponents in the post-season when it really counts?
 
Re: USCHO.com Men's Division III pre-season poll

admiral0417 said:
I don't even know where to go with all that ???
Click to expand...

Let's see if I can help the little dog out here...
This is taking into consideration Toto's Top 5 and Plattsburgh/Oswego...

Seniors lost:
NORWICH 5
SNC 5
ADRIAN 5
PLATTS 5
UTICA 6
UWEC 11
OSU 14

Games Played Lost:
PLATTS 17.40812379
SNC 20.76788831
NORWICH 23
ADRIAN 25.18518519
UTICA 25.18656716
UWEC 47.45762712
OSU 66.31762653

Points Lost:
PLATTS 18.56060606
UTICA 21.03658537
SNC 31.76100629
ADRIAN 31.94444444
NORWICH 45
UWEC 50.5988024
OSU 81.21827411

GOALS Lost:
PLATTS 14.14141414
UTICA 18.85245902
SNC 36.13445378
ADRIAN 35.76642336
NORWICH 53
UWEC 58.4
OSU 78.62068966


GWG Lost:
UTICA 23.80952381
PLATTS 26.31578947
SNC 39.13043478
ADRIAN 52.17391304
UWEC 54.16666667
NORWICH 71
OSU 80

So even tho Plattsburgh lost the same number of Seniors as SNC, Adrian, and Norwich, they are last in 3 of the 4 major categories. Most by half of ToTo's power 5. WEC as he calls it not only lost over 50% of their offense, but lost arguably one of the best DIII goaltenders. Memory serving me correctly I think Plattsburgh still has a pretty good goalie back this year?

Plattsburgh also has one of the best incoming freshman class in DIII. They may not be NHL calibar, but I bet you see several All SUNYAC Team members from this class and potentially and probably ROTY and an All-American.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top