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UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

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Greg Ambrose said:
Nonsense. His job was to recruit players who could contribute to the overall success of the program, specifically make the NCAA tournament and get to the Frozen Four. Scott Borek failed in that mission. I really don't care how many players he recruits that make it to the NHL, his job was to assemble a roster that could compete. To be generous, that hasn't happened in five years.
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Your entitled to your opinion as am I. A HOF football coach said if you want them to make you dinner you should be able to shop for the groceries. I think the opposite is true as well. He brought in the players that "fit the program" but he didn't have the final say in the menu and the the head chef didn't really know what groceries he had and really didn't care what they were, how much they cost until everyone was seated for dinner. At least in the last few years. And btw a few more would have de-committed but did not because they were told they fit better in the UNH system. I was told DU was not a great x and os guy what made him a great coach was whipping up the chemistry in the room to get all to buy in and contribute as much as they had. That has stopped, two players parents of players confirmed that, that there coach was disengaged and distant. And these are parents of former players that said it was their kids whole time there.
This is just my opinion and you can say it's nonsense, just my optic on the program from where I see it.
Richie is a legend and probably all we be forgotten a few years after he retires( unless they never rebound). My opinion is that he should have been Barry Sanders rather than Brett Favre, but the band aids and extremely hard work of others made the situation look better than it actually was. And the ultimate blame belongs on Marty because it was hisjob to keep the HC accountable to do his job in all parts of the program,not just kissing babies, shaking hands and throwing cliches at the media and FOH.
Leaman must be pretty happy with the groceries he's brought him thus far. He probably at least made the list and on certain occasions went shopping with him. Time will tell in 3 years how effective Borek was in part by what he brings a program where everyone is all in.
I'm guessing the last thing Richie wanted was for SB to leave he enabled humans still would be if Marty gave him the written contract. Instead a guy with 4 years coaching experience at 2 doesn't matter programs got it in writing. My biggest question that still matters is how that affected a former pro, alum, 100 point club, with 13 years experience still involved in the dysfunction? Less than the chemistry I'd think you'd want? Is there just one guy engaged now? Did Marty read DU the riot act? Hard to watch this as a fan, and having a little "whole picture knowledge".
Again MHO.

mi.net/packageID/PackageID.aspPID=420038249274890108381015399131
 
bomberhockey said:
Your entitled to your opinion as am I. A HOF football coach said if you want them to make you dinner you should be able to shop for the groceries. I think the opposite is true as well. He brought in the players that "fit the program" but he didn't have the final say in the menu and the the head chef didn't really know what groceries he had and really didn't care what they were, how much they cost until everyone was seated for dinner. At least in the last few years. And btw a few more would have de-committed but did not because they were told they fit better in the UNH system. I was told DU was not a great x and os guy what made him a great coach was whipping up the chemistry in the room to get all to buy in and contribute as much as they had. That has stopped, two players parents of players confirmed that, that there coach was disengaged and distant. And these are parents of former players that said it was their kids whole time there.
This is just my opinion and you can say it's nonsense, just my optic on the program from where I see it.
Richie is a legend and probably all we be forgotten a few years after he retires( unless they never rebound). My opinion is that he should have been Barry Sanders rather than Brett Favre, but the band aids and extremely hard work of others made the situation look better than it actually was. And the ultimate blame belongs on Marty because it was hisjob to keep the HC accountable to do his job in all parts of the program,not just kissing babies, shaking hands and throwing cliches at the media and FOH.
Leaman must be pretty happy with the groceries he's brought him thus far. He probably at least made the list and on certain occasions went shopping with him. Time will tell in 3 years how effective Borek was in part by what he brings a program where everyone is all in.
I'm guessing the last thing Richie wanted was for SB to leave he enabled humans still would be if Marty gave him the written contract. Instead a guy with 4 years coaching experience at 2 doesn't matter programs got it in writing. My biggest question that still matters is how that affected a former pro, alum, 100 point club, with 13 years experience still involved in the dysfunction? Less than the chemistry I'd think you'd want? Is there just one guy engaged now? Did Marty read DU the riot act? Hard to watch this as a fan, and having a little "whole picture knowledge".
Again MHO.

mi.net/packageID/PackageID.aspPID=420038249274890108381015399131
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*him and. Not humans.
 
Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

bomberhockey said:
And btw a few more would have de-committed but did not because they were told they fit better in the UNH system.
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As in, "I blew it recruiting you and don't want to bring you to Providence, so you fit better in the UNH system." ??

Look, I've tried to avoid this conversation, because its obvious I place a lot of blame on Borek's recruiting, but are you honestly claiming that UNH has had the 'ingredients' and Umile has simply bungled the roster? I'll buy that Umile's lack of attention or support for recruiting made his job more difficult, but he did not recruit well at UNH. Period. His initial success at UNH was solid as he rode the wave of success after the 2003 NC game - and he's doing the same now at PC - but that success had consistently and dramatically slipped away year after year and been THE key factor in UNH sinking to these depths. Let's check in with the Friars in a few more classes.

You can't complain that Umile wasn't involved in recruiting and then entirely blame Umile for the recruiting classes. Borek had what he wanted, apparently, the empowerment to recruit who he wanted and he sprinkled in the occasional solid recruit with a whole bunch of replacement level talent. The rosters the last few years have been awful. You think Borek mixing the lines and engaging a little more than Dick makes them tourney teams? No way...

I am not really concerned with what Borek does at PC. If he's figured somethings out, actually believes in what he's selling and has Leaman's help maybe he'll do well long term. He didn't do well at UNH. After the lost class of White, Reid and Bourque he was terrible. Again, I'll believe that Umile has also been terrible. I'll share the same questions about the future regime. I won't buy the fact that Borek's recruiting classes don't deserve MUCH of the blame.

UNH may steal a game this weekend - because they'll have the TWO best players on the ice. They'll more likely get swept - because the rest of the roster is so incredibly talent deficient (with the exception of some youngsters not ready to ride shotgun to Pots/Kells).

BTW, TvR was a DIII prospect who no one wanted before UNH swooped in with a 'partial' offer. When Borek recruits a bunch of TvR's and one hits, I don't think he should be out celebrating. A couple of Pesces and TvRs and a whole lot of 2015-16 defensemen...
 
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Tough first period for the goalie Borek identified as "the guy", the defenseman he recruited to play top-4 minutes and the upperclass forwards he IDd at 16 as top-six NCAA scorers...
 
Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

Say what you will about Borek's recruiting, but let's not forget ... as head coach at Lake State - back in the era when that actually meant something - he presided over a program that was on its way down from incredible heights. That same general pattern has now repeated itself - although with him *only* as an assistant, not from such great heights, and not so quickly down - at UNH.

I like his chances better at PC with Coach Leaman at the helm, who doesn't seem to be anywhere close to the back nine of his coaching career. I suspect things will work out better, and SB won't be forced to be the "lone ranger/road warrior" all by himself on the recruiting front, as was apparently the case in his later seasons at UNH.
 
Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

Chuck Murray said:
Say what you will about Borek's recruiting, but let's not forget ... as head coach at Lake State - back in the era when that actually meant something - he presided over a program that was on its way down from incredible heights. That same general pattern has now repeated itself - although with him *only* as an assistant, not from such great heights, and not so quickly down - at UNH.

I like his chances better at PC with Coach Leaman at the helm, who doesn't seem to be anywhere close to the back nine of his coaching career. I suspect things will work out better, and SB won't be forced to be the "lone ranger/road warrior" all by himself on the recruiting front, as was apparently the case in his later seasons at UNH.
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back nine? How about the 19th hole?
 
Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

I wanted to revisit bomber's quote (*edited* as he requested for easier reading) ...

bomberhockey said:
I'm guessing the last thing Richie wanted was for SB to leave he enabled *him and* still would be if Marty gave him the written contract. Instead a guy with 4 years coaching experience at 2 doesn't matter programs got it in writing. My biggest question that still matters is how that affected a former pro, alum, 100 point club, with 13 years experience still involved in the dysfunction? Less than the chemistry I'd think you'd want? Is there just one guy engaged now? Did Marty read DU the riot act? Hard to watch this as a fan, and having a little "whole picture knowledge".
Click to expand...

Something I've wondered about, and posted about several times on this board.

You don't have to have a psych degree/license to see this situation from the various angles, and to come up with logical questions and conclusions as to basic human motivational issues.

I suspect we shall all find out Coach Stewart's level of long-term commitment soon enough ...
 
Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

He's one of those **** foreigners we don't get in Melrose. Don Cherry warned me about them chicken swedes. Will never go into a corner. Never had one, never will. I remember when Brian first took the job and told me he wanted to recruit out in British Columbia. I told him we could only recruit in the north shore, and Ontario. Well, he took out a map and surprised me by showing that British Columbia was actually part of Canada, not England or South America. Imagine my surprise to learn they actually played hockey outside of Arlington (Chebator), Reading (Thomson, Sullivan), Waltham (Perry), Lawrence (Cooper) and Southie (Donovan, Malone), I even got a foreigner (Jim McGrath) who was from New Jersey but fooled me because he played for Cushing.

(Actually, my hiring of Brian is a funny story. I typically only hire guys like me who know the neighborhood (Serino, Tortorella) or guys I worked with at PC (Lassonde, Borek), but I had learned of Brian through Scotty. I thought Brian was a Boston Mick, and only found out he wasn't one of us until after he showed up. I never made that mistake again.)

After that embarassment about Georgraphy (or geometry, I always get those confused) I decided to leave all the recruiting to one guy who would speak the foreign language that they speak in Canada (not sure what that is. As a further aside, imagine my repeated surprise when admissions keeps rejecting my recruits because they refuse to accept "Canadian" as the foreign language requirement.).

Funny thing, we've never had foreigner here, but I see Scotty's now brought one in at Providence in his first month there. I always thought Scotty wasn't a true American - we got to look after our own.

Luckily I've got three more years to impart on Mike all the recruiting and coaching wisdom I've accumulated.
 
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Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

So,between Foegele, Masonius, etc. money and holding off on commits during the year, UNH is in a position to grab a late available player. Michael O'Leary decommitted from Cornell, and while he probably wants a higher level education, would be a good pick up. Just saw that puck moving Brinson Paschnicuk from Alberta is no longer committed to Vermont. He is exactly what the D needs. (I suspect Souza's trip to Halifax was either for O'Leary or more likely, for Cam Lee, who decommitted from Providence and is also a puck moving D. He committed to Western Mich later.) And though I joked about foreign players from Finland, a more realistic possibility is Pulkkinen, who decommitted from Bemidji State.

There's also Colin Grannary from the BCHL, last top 10 uncommitted player.

Let's see if Souza moves on any of these kids.
 
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Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

NCAA watcher said:
So,between Foegele, Masonius, etc. money and holding off on commits during the year, UNH is in a position to grab a late available player. Michael O'Leary decommitted from Cornell, and while he probably wants a higher level education, would be a good pick up. Just saw that puck moving Brinson Paschnicuk from Alberta is no longer committed to Vermont. He is exactly what the D needs. (I suspect Souza's trip to Halifax was either for O'Leary or more likely, for Cam Lee, who decommitted from Providence and is also a puck moving D. He committed to Western Mich later.) And though I joked about foreign players from Finland, a more realistic possibility is Pulkkinen, who decommitted from Bemidji State.

There's also Colin Grannary from the BCHL, last top 10 uncommitted player.

Let's see if Souza moves on any of these kids.
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One gets the sense you might be working harder on the recruiting trail than MS (or GS), 'watcher.

Is the Pulkkinen kid the younger brother of Teemu, now playing with my beloved DRW?
 
Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

Chuck Murray said:
One gets the sense you might be working harder on the recruiting trail than MS (or GS), 'watcher.

Is the Pulkkinen kid the younger brother of Teemu, now playing with my beloved DRW?
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I doubt it. If we've seen anything from Bomber it's that work by the assistants isn't the issue (except maybe keeping track of their grades). Having something to sell is. With the impediment still there I don't know what to expect Souza to do. "Ignore the old guy who will coach you the first two years, who burried Foegele and Eiserman, our only NHL prospects, so that seniors can play, but you'll be one of my guys in 3 years when dad lets me be the boss.

It's an unfair position for Mike, making him responsible for the mess without the ability to fix it.

No, not brother of Detroit's.
 
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Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

NCAA watcher said:
I doubt it. If we've seen anything from Bomber it's that work by the assistants isn't the issue (except maybe keeping track of their grades). Having something to sell is.
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It certainly seemed to me that Borek lost his faith in selling UNH. When I hear people close to him complaining about facilities, bigger schools, admissions, etc - I can only assume they hear that from one source. If you don't believe in the school your selling, you're dead in the water. I am clinging to the hope that Souza and Stewart love and believe in their alma mater, enjoyed their time on campus and think UNH hockey is and should be something special.

Enthusiastically pitch a resurgence, that the recruit can lead/be a part of, etc and you can win recruiting battles you're not 'supposed' to win. I've done it. So, the right person at UNH can certainly get it done (even with Umile hanging around for two more years)...
 
Re: UNH Recruits: 2012-2018

NCAA watcher said:
I doubt it. If we've seen anything from Bomber it's that work by the assistants isn't the issue (except maybe keeping track of their grades). Having something to sell is. With the impediment still there I don't know what to expect Souza to do. "Ignore the old guy who will coach you the first two years, who burried Foegele and Eiserman, our only NHL prospects, so that seniors can play, but you'll be one of my guys in 3 years when dad lets me be the boss.

It's an unfair position for Mike, making him responsible for the mess without the ability to fix it.
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Overall I tend to agree ... but no one was forcing Souza to take the job under these conditions. He had to know this might be the case, as it's not his first rodeo on the recruiting circuit, either. If he thought it wouldn't be a hard sell (the first couple of years anyway), then he was pretty naïve. And the relative silence results-wise speaks for itself, although I (like you) am reserving judgment until we see how he does his business. If anything has been "unfair", it *might* be how Coach Stewart was bypassed (and bomber might say how SB wasn't offered the written contract that Coach Souza was given) ... but hey, who said life was supposed to be fair?

BTW while writing out this response, I realized our current head-coach-in-waiting shares the same initials with the AD's Christian name. So from here on out, MS = Coach Souza, BS35+3 = our *beloved* AD. :) :D

Carmine Scarpaglia said:
This all started with Rush lyrics in an epic post.
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Another weird realization is how both Geddy and Coach Umile are notable for operating at the high end of the vocal pitch (?) range. They're not too far off age-wise. Long-lost brothers :eek: or *gulp* separated at birth?? :eek: :eek:
 
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