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The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
- Thread starter dxmnkd316
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walrus
Wind up workin' in a gas station
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Trump was happy though, now they can kick Ryan to the curb
Trump was happy though, now they can kick Ryan to the curb
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
While it's funny to hear Ryan and don being so butthurt blaming the Democrats- don's 37% is all in on that.
Even though they were in the very solid minority, and the house should have been the easy side to force this through.
And they will also get more blame for not doing what don says.
While it's funny to hear Ryan and don being so butthurt blaming the Democrats- don's 37% is all in on that.
Even though they were in the very solid minority, and the house should have been the easy side to force this through.
And they will also get more blame for not doing what don says.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
He has to be drunk...
He has to be drunk...
French Rage
NICKERSON HAS [CENSORED]
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Lollercoaster: http://screengrabber.deadspin.com/basketball-fans-treated-to-ads-congratulating-republica-1793629526
Lollercoaster: http://screengrabber.deadspin.com/basketball-fans-treated-to-ads-congratulating-republica-1793629526
FlagDUDE08
Banned
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Paul Ryan's globalism was exposed. And those exposing it, such as Rand Paul, are now being accused of working with the Russians.
Paul Ryan's globalism was exposed. And those exposing it, such as Rand Paul, are now being accused of working with the Russians.
FlagDUDE08
Banned
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Taking a look at the activity of the Dow 30, it looks like they tried to do a sell-off once they called off the vote, but then investors said "Oh no you don't, this is a good buying opportunity". Indexes ended up close to even.
Taking a look at the activity of the Dow 30, it looks like they tried to do a sell-off once they called off the vote, but then investors said "Oh no you don't, this is a good buying opportunity". Indexes ended up close to even.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
So Typical. That will work with 37% as well.
So Typical. That will work with 37% as well.
FadeToBlack&Gold
Microlot Marxist
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Paul working for Putin/Russia is one of the most comical bits of all the recent e-tabloid bait. Sometimes I think McCain really is losing it.
Paul working for Putin/Russia is one of the most comical bits of all the recent e-tabloid bait. Sometimes I think McCain really is losing it.
rufus
rock and roller
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Even Peggy Noonan is sounding sensible today.
https://patriotpost.us/opinion/48182
Even Peggy Noonan is sounding sensible today.
https://patriotpost.us/opinion/48182
rufus
rock and roller
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
And why Republicans were in such a hurry to pass this craptastic plan. It wasn't about providing health care for people. It was all about tax cuts for the wealthy. This aspect of it was what I was trying to get at earlier.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/03/25/why-republicans-were-in-such-a-hurry-on-health-care/
And why Republicans were in such a hurry to pass this craptastic plan. It wasn't about providing health care for people. It was all about tax cuts for the wealthy. This aspect of it was what I was trying to get at earlier.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2017/03/25/why-republicans-were-in-such-a-hurry-on-health-care/
FadeToBlack&Gold
Microlot Marxist
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
'Twas always thus. Sic semper tyrannis.
'Twas always thus. Sic semper tyrannis.
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
And remembering history- a lot of the R complaints about the ACA was that it was "forced" through with none of their input or votes.
Yes, it's overly complicated, yes, it costs money, but in the end, there was a goal of helping people, and as time has gone one, we are finding that out.
For this- it was NEVER about helping people, unless you made clear of $200k.
And remembering history- a lot of the R complaints about the ACA was that it was "forced" through with none of their input or votes.
Yes, it's overly complicated, yes, it costs money, but in the end, there was a goal of helping people, and as time has gone one, we are finding that out.
For this- it was NEVER about helping people, unless you made clear of $200k.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
That's why I can't figure out why it didn't pass.
1. Tax Cuts.
2. Defund Planned Parenthood.
Seems like a no brainer to me.
That's why I can't figure out why it didn't pass.
1. Tax Cuts.
2. Defund Planned Parenthood.
Seems like a no brainer to me.
rufus
rock and roller
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Because for the Freedumb Caucus, it wasn't enough tax cuts.
Because for the Freedumb Caucus, it wasn't enough tax cuts.
Kepler
Si certus es dubita
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Because the Republicans are no longer only the party of low taxes for the rich. There is a small zealot group that is the party of ending government.
The "moderate" GOP wants to continue to use government as a coercive force to protect the rich while they exploit everyone else. That's Reaganism. But that's not enough for the radical GOP, who wants to end government so that there is no countervailing mechanism for the people to use to limit the predations of the rich. Conservatives call the latter group "idealists."
Fish and Flag are exemplars of each respective group. Fish is the Old Useful Idiot. He has been trained to run interference for the rich using sophistry and casuistry and keeping attention focused on DC, while the .01% raids the treasury and stashes the loot in the Caymans. Their masterpiece was the Bankster Heist.
Flag, OTOH, is the New Useful Idiot. He has been trained to deride not just government but the Enlightenment and western liberal values. His assumption is there is a deliberate world historical struggle that over-determines all other issues: race, gender, class etc are all just expressions of the fight between The Good trying to escape the clutches of The Bad.
The great irony is that while Fish is 100 times smarter than Flag, Flag is right. Flag's craziness is not his Manicheanism. It's that he's got the two sides exactly reversed.
Because the Republicans are no longer only the party of low taxes for the rich. There is a small zealot group that is the party of ending government.
The "moderate" GOP wants to continue to use government as a coercive force to protect the rich while they exploit everyone else. That's Reaganism. But that's not enough for the radical GOP, who wants to end government so that there is no countervailing mechanism for the people to use to limit the predations of the rich. Conservatives call the latter group "idealists."
Fish and Flag are exemplars of each respective group. Fish is the Old Useful Idiot. He has been trained to run interference for the rich using sophistry and casuistry and keeping attention focused on DC, while the .01% raids the treasury and stashes the loot in the Caymans. Their masterpiece was the Bankster Heist.
Flag, OTOH, is the New Useful Idiot. He has been trained to deride not just government but the Enlightenment and western liberal values. His assumption is there is a deliberate world historical struggle that over-determines all other issues: race, gender, class etc are all just expressions of the fight between The Good trying to escape the clutches of The Bad.
The great irony is that while Fish is 100 times smarter than Flag, Flag is right. Flag's craziness is not his Manicheanism. It's that he's got the two sides exactly reversed.
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Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
My take is the Freedumb Caucus and FalseFlagDude get something that most people, from lefties to the media to corp righties to Trump loons don't. What they understand is having a majority does no good if you're never putting in place permanent change that conforms to your agenda. Otherwise, what's the point? 8 years of GWB with approx. 4 1/2 of total govt control gave us one lasting legislative impact - the Iraq War.
His tax cuts and defense buildup got reversed and NCLB is either gutted or on its way out.
So, if knucks' aren't going to get rid of the very liberal Obamacare legislation (more on that in a bit) when they have total control of the govt, score one for the Obama admin leaving a permanent legacy where the Bush II admin did not. To that end, I can see Trump's lasting legacy being kicking all illegal immigrants out and building a stupid wall, and not much else.
Regarding the ACA, I would hope my lefty friends now appreciate the legislation much more than they have in their previous commentary out here instead of calling it conservative lite or other such nonsense. A set of requirements that all insurance has to cover. Insurers can't discriminate against people with pre existing conditions. Medicaid expansion. Insurance co's have to spend 80% of revenue on care. Can't charge older people more than 3 times the rate of young people. All these are highly progressive concepts that the true conservatives were hell bent on getting rid of. Anyone who still thinks the ACA is actually a right leaning bill needs to be beaten senseless.
My take is the Freedumb Caucus and FalseFlagDude get something that most people, from lefties to the media to corp righties to Trump loons don't. What they understand is having a majority does no good if you're never putting in place permanent change that conforms to your agenda. Otherwise, what's the point? 8 years of GWB with approx. 4 1/2 of total govt control gave us one lasting legislative impact - the Iraq War.
His tax cuts and defense buildup got reversed and NCLB is either gutted or on its way out. So, if knucks' aren't going to get rid of the very liberal Obamacare legislation (more on that in a bit) when they have total control of the govt, score one for the Obama admin leaving a permanent legacy where the Bush II admin did not. To that end, I can see Trump's lasting legacy being kicking all illegal immigrants out and building a stupid wall, and not much else.
Regarding the ACA, I would hope my lefty friends now appreciate the legislation much more than they have in their previous commentary out here instead of calling it conservative lite or other such nonsense. A set of requirements that all insurance has to cover. Insurers can't discriminate against people with pre existing conditions. Medicaid expansion. Insurance co's have to spend 80% of revenue on care. Can't charge older people more than 3 times the rate of young people. All these are highly progressive concepts that the true conservatives were hell bent on getting rid of. Anyone who still thinks the ACA is actually a right leaning bill needs to be beaten senseless.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
So?
It was a rightie bill. Period. We can't help it that the right is no longer in the center sphere. The bill was a massive compromise all over the place. Giving up the public option, for example, made the bill massively small "c" conservative.
My take is the Freedumb Caucus and FalseFlagDude get something that most people, from lefties to the media to corp righties to Trump loons don't. What they understand is having a majority does no good if you're never putting in place permanent change that conforms to your agenda. Otherwise, what's the point? 8 years of GWB with approx. 4 1/2 of total govt control gave us one lasting legislative impact - the Iraq War.
So, if knucks' aren't going to get rid of the very liberal Obamacare legislation (more on that in a bit) when they have total control of the govt, score one for the Obama admin leaving a permanent legacy where the Bush II admin did not. To that end, I can see Trump's lasting legacy being kicking all illegal immigrants out and building a stupid wall, and not much else.
Regarding the ACA, I would hope my lefty friends now appreciate the legislation much more than they have in their previous commentary out here instead of calling it conservative lite or other such nonsense. A set of requirements that all insurance has to cover. Insurers can't discriminate against people with pre existing conditions. Medicaid expansion. Insurance co's have to spend 80% of revenue on care. Can't charge older people more than 3 times the rate of young people. All these are highly progressive concepts that the true conservatives were hell bent on getting rid of. Anyone who still thinks the ACA is actually a right leaning bill needs to be beaten senseless.
So?
It was a rightie bill. Period. We can't help it that the right is no longer in the center sphere. The bill was a massive compromise all over the place. Giving up the public option, for example, made the bill massively small "c" conservative.
Re: The PPACA Thread Part IV - Repeal & Replace, or Something...
Scoobs, you need to be beaten senseless.
Seriously though, I think you're missing an important point. Single payer was never going to happen 7 years ago when bill was passed. As in, it had zero chance. So, do you keep the system as it was? Do you propose a bill with no chance of being enacted (see Ryan, Paul and AHCA)? Or do you do what was done, which is pass into law a bill with core liberal concepts that the American people are now apparently all in on, especially given their reaction when these things were about to be taken away?
I've said this before about Dodd-Frank and the ACA. Conservatives hate both because its a victory for liberalism. If the liberals themselves are also trashing the legislation, are they not playing right into the hands of the conservatives? No wonder lefties don't vote.
Scoobs, you need to be beaten senseless.
Seriously though, I think you're missing an important point. Single payer was never going to happen 7 years ago when bill was passed. As in, it had zero chance. So, do you keep the system as it was? Do you propose a bill with no chance of being enacted (see Ryan, Paul and AHCA)? Or do you do what was done, which is pass into law a bill with core liberal concepts that the American people are now apparently all in on, especially given their reaction when these things were about to be taken away?
I've said this before about Dodd-Frank and the ACA. Conservatives hate both because its a victory for liberalism. If the liberals themselves are also trashing the legislation, are they not playing right into the hands of the conservatives? No wonder lefties don't vote.
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