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The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

Shirtless Guy said:
If a law abiding citizen had been carrying a gun this morning at that movie theatre, maybe only a couple people are dead and a dozen wounded instead of a dozen and 50. Keeping guns out of the hands of law abiding citizens who want to protect themselves is not a good thing. That sign that said that theater banned guns on the property really helped everyone in theatre 9 this morning didn't it?
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Has a concealed gun ever stopped a rampaging gunman? Ever?

The only time that someone claimed to take action in a public shooting was in Rep Gifford's case...and the only outcome was that the guy nearly killed an innocent.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

5mn_Major said:
Has a concealed gun ever stopped a rampaging gunman? Ever?

The only time that someone claimed to take action in a public shooting was in Rep Gifford's case...and the only outcome was that the guy nearly killed an innocent.
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Happens on 394 every day...

To be fair to SG...he did say "maybe". Nobody knows what would have happened.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

The premise that concealed guns stop crimes and specifically violent shootings is false.

FreshFish said:
Yes, I've seen several stories about off-duty police officers doing exactly that.
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Here's my article showing how that whole thing can backfire: Tucson shooting fires up gun debate: A bystander with a Ruger intent on ending the violence almost shot the wrong guy. http://articles.latimes.com/2011/jan/14/nation/la-na-zamudio-shooting-20110115

Do you have any major examples that show how an average person with a concealed gun stopped a major shooting spree?

In the end pretty much every police and justice organization DO NOT recommend using concealed weapons to stop a violent criminal. The strongly recommended course of action is to stay low, do what is asked, remember what you saw and report it to the authorities. Who says that using concealed weapons against armed gunmen is smart or advocated by police?

The SCOTUS may decide that conceal and carry is in the Constitution, but that doesn't mean that there are any real benefits for society. Frankly, the only reason its legal today is due to special interest lobbying.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

So if I'm in a "kill zone" and come across another hunter, I can shoot him?
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

Due to the efforts of lobbyists...its the average vacationers responsibility to know when hunting season is, where it applies, what precautionary steps to take and what to wear. And very few know any of that. Its a rare situation when society is fully responsible for accomodating of the actions of a small group.

As far as zones go...

If families know that they are at risk of facing people shooting guns in a certain area...they won't go there. And for everyone/everything else...enter at your own risk.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

We already have them. They're called "Parks" and also include any private land that is "Posted" as you can't hunt there either.

Your ignorance on this topic is immense and annoying. Why don't you go back to anecdotally attacking SYG laws?
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

If my ignorance is so immense...take a simple 30 secs and copy paste anything that 'educates' me on the topic (or we can drop it). I would guess there's a chance that I know more than you may think.

In the end, my intent is not to be annoying. I just have always thought that safety of society in concert with the constitution should be the top priority...and thanks to a powerful special interest group, its not.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

5mn_Major said:
If my ignorance is so immense...take a simple 30 secs and copy paste anything that 'educates' me on the topic (or we can drop it). I would guess there's a chance that I know more than you may think.

In the end, my intent is not to be annoying. I just have always thought that safety of society in concert with the constitution should be the top priority...and thanks to a powerful special interest group, its not.
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I honestly don't see how there shouldn't be responsibility on the hunter to make sure what he's shooting at is what he's hunting for but it also pretty silly to think that people can be so ignorant not to notice the GIANT signs at just about every bar that says WELCOME HUNTERS in blaze orange. Being aware of your surroundings in nature is quite important. No one should go out in the woods camping or whatever without being aware of hunting seasons. That doesn't give a hunter an excuse to shoot someone because it is their responsibility be sure of their target AND BEYOND. That's what I've always been taught. If you can't be certain that no one is behind the deer you're trying to shoot, you shouldn't take a shot...especially with a rifle.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

Shirtless Guy said:
I honestly don't see how there shouldn't be responsibility on the hunter to make sure what he's shooting at is what he's hunting for but it also pretty silly to think that people can be so ignorant not to notice the GIANT signs at just about every bar that says WELCOME HUNTERS in blaze orange. Being aware of your surroundings in nature is quite important. No one should go out in the woods camping or whatever without being aware of hunting seasons. That doesn't give a hunter an excuse to shoot someone because it is their responsibility be sure of their target AND BEYOND. That's what I've always been taught. If you can't be certain that no one is behind the deer you're trying to shoot, you shouldn't take a shot...especially with a rifle.
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Back when I was in college a woman in Bangor was shot in her garden when a hunter mistook her for a deer. People and deer looking so much alike, and all. It went to court because A) the hunter was hunting in a residential area and B) HE KILLED A PERSON. The result: Acquitted on all charges because the woman was wearing white gloves, and the hunter saw the flash of white, assumed it was a deer and took the shot. Never mind that he wasn't even supposed to be hunting there, or that he discharged his firearm without being sure of what he was targeting and did I mention that HE KILLED A PERSON? Cleared of all charges because the jury had the IQ of a rock - or the jury foreman was an NRA lobbyist. But you go on believing that it's the hunter's responsibility.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

Priceless said:
Back when I was in college a woman in Bangor was shot in her garden when a hunter mistook her for a deer. People and deer looking so much alike, and all. It went to court because A) the hunter was hunting in a residential area and B) HE KILLED A PERSON. The result: Acquitted on all charges because the woman was wearing white gloves, and the hunter saw the flash of white, assumed it was a deer and took the shot. Never mind that he wasn't even supposed to be hunting there, or that he discharged his firearm without being sure of what he was targeting and did I mention that HE KILLED A PERSON? Cleared of all charges because the jury had the IQ of a rock - or the jury foreman was an NRA lobbyist. But you go on believing that it's the hunter's responsibility.
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Just because a jury was dumb enough to acquit that person doesn't mean a good hunter shouldn't be responsible for his actions. What happens in a jury trial of your peers and what you have to live with as a human being are 2 different things. I was brought up to treat a gun with respect and always treat it as if it were loaded. That moron gives the rest of us who are responsible a bad name. I have passed on shots at deer before because I could not be positive it was a deer or it would not be safe because I would be shooting towards a road, or I wouldn't be shooting down hill knowing that my bullet from my rifle couldn't go god knows how far compared to the deer 150 yards away.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

Shirtless Guy said:
Just because a jury was dumb enough to acquit that person doesn't mean a good hunter shouldn't be responsible for his actions. What happens in a jury trial of your peers and what you have to live with as a human being are 2 different things. I was brought up to treat a gun with respect and always treat it as if it were loaded. That moron gives the rest of us who are responsible a bad name. I have passed on shots at deer before because I could not be positive it was a deer or it would not be safe because I would be shooting towards a road, or I wouldn't be shooting down hill knowing that my bullet from my rifle couldn't go god knows how far compared to the deer 150 yards away.
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Ah, a good hunter...
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

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Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

all well and good shirtless and certainly agree on some points, but how can we as a society justify legal assault weapons. I just don't get it. they are just not hunting weapons, never were, never will be.
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

manurespreader said:
all well and good shirtless and certainly agree on some points, but how can we as a society justify legal assault weapons. I just don't get it. they are just not hunting weapons, never were, never will be.
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How am I supposed to hunt birds without a surface-to-air missile?
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

manurespreader said:
all well and good shirtless and certainly agree on some points, but how can we as a society justify legal assault weapons. I just don't get it. they are just not hunting weapons, never were, never will be.
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Fine. Define "assault weapon".
 
Re: The Most Serious [x] Problem We Face Today

We should outlaw having kids because Casey Anthony was able to kill hers and get away with it.
 
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