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The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

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Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

Keep in mind that there's nothing about the formula that should result in anything exponential, so a logarithmic scale is probably misleading in some respect or another.


Powers &8^]
 
LtPowers said:
Keep in mind that there's nothing about the formula that should result in anything exponential, so a logarithmic scale is probably misleading in some respect or another.


Powers &8^]
Click to expand...

Thanks for the plots, much as I thought. I am not so sure about your take on the points formula, as it seems to be heavily weighted on participating in and winning the FF. Looks like a really smooth exponential except for teams 5 through 8?
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

Snively65 said:
Thanks for the plots, much as I thought. I am not so sure about your take on the points formula, as it seems to be heavily weighted on participating in and winning the FF. Looks like a really smooth exponential except for teams 5 through 8?
Click to expand...

Yes, and I think that's misleading. On the logarithmic plot, it appears that the distance between, say, 8 and 9 is similar to the distance between 51 and 52. On a percentage basis, that's true, but points are awarded on a set scale, not a sliding scale. So #52 would have to do a lot less than #9 would to move up a rank. The only reason they appear similar on the log plot is because #52 hasn't done much in the past while #9 has.


Powers &8^]
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

LtPowers said:
Yes, and I think that's misleading. On the logarithmic plot, it appears that the distance between, say, 8 and 9 is similar to the distance between 51 and 52. On a percentage basis, that's true, but points are awarded on a set scale, not a sliding scale. So #52 would have to do a lot less than #9 would to move up a rank. The only reason they appear similar on the log plot is because #52 hasn't done much in the past while #9 has.
Click to expand...

It would be more work, but it would be interesting to see what long-term trends you've seen in the different strata and be able to intuit how good of a run that you'd have to go up 5 spots, etc. But I don't know off-hand how I'd model that.

GFM
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

gfmorris said:
It would be more work, but it would be interesting to see what long-term trends you've seen in the different strata and be able to intuit how good of a run that you'd have to go up 5 spots, etc. But I don't know off-hand how I'd model that.

GFM
Click to expand...

I am thinking that Quinnipiac will move up three spots (31st to 28th) after their NC game this past April.

Omaha moved up six places with their FF appearance the year before (45th to 39th), and Minnesota State moved up six places over the past two years (46th to 40th). So, it is no doubt easier to move up multiple places from the bottom third of the list, although BU and PC jumped three places in 2015 (7th to 4th, and 24th to 21st, respectively).
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

LtPowers said:
Winning the AHA tournament and beating #1 overall seed Mankato in 2015 still only got us 1.87 points. It's a huge uphill battle; there's a ton of points awarded for beating good teams in the regular season.


Powers &8^]
Click to expand...
Neither team won 20 games, which I think is also part of the formula. RIT will have a chance to pick up wins over former champs this year with all but UConn being former champ as a non-conference game. I think this year's edition will have a chance for 20 wins and getting a win or two in that category.
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

Siouxfaninseattle said:
#33– BROWN BEARS

Points: 22.68181 Points
Points earned in 2015-2016: -0.0017 Points
Points earned in past five seasons: 4.18201 Points
Last Season Ranking: #33
Click to expand...

I guess I haven't been following close enough - how is it possible to lose points? That part of the forumula bothers me - I feel as long as you're playing you should at least be holding steady.

So, if NoDak or Denver would decide to drop the sport tomorrow - how far would they drop in the formula next year (or would they be dropped completely since no longer active)?
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

LordofBrewtown said:
I guess I haven't been following close enough - how is it possible to lose points? That part of the forumula bothers me - I feel as long as you're playing you should at least be holding steady.

So, if NoDak or Denver would decide to drop the sport tomorrow - how far would they drop in the formula next year (or would they be dropped completely since no longer active)?
Click to expand...
It would appear dropped off completely.
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

LordofBrewtown said:
I guess I haven't been following close enough - how is it possible to lose points? That part of the forumula bothers me - I feel as long as you're playing you should at least be holding steady. So, if NoDak or Denver would decide to drop the sport tomorrow - how far would they drop in the formula next year (or would they be dropped completely since no longer active)?
Click to expand...

Notice there are only active programs on the list, if a program stops to exist it is dropped.

I believe you can lose points if you play and lose to a team lower on the list.
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

giwan said:
Notice there are only active programs on the list, if a program stops to exist it is dropped.

I believe you can lose points if you play and lose to a team lower on the list.
Click to expand...

A bad season will net you negative points.
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

LordofBrewtown said:
I guess I haven't been following close enough - how is it possible to lose points? That part of the forumula bothers me - I feel as long as you're playing you should at least be holding steady.

So, if NoDak or Denver would decide to drop the sport tomorrow - how far would they drop in the formula next year (or would they be dropped completely since no longer active)?
Click to expand...

See the responses below:

giwan said:
Notice there are only active programs on the list, if a program stops to exist it is dropped.
Click to expand...

This is correct. In LordofBrewtown's example, North Dakota and Denver would be dropped from the formula and no longer ranked. Of course, if North Dakota and Denver drop hockey, my guess is there wouldn't be maybe more than 3-4 programs left (if that).

komey1 said:
A bad season will net you negative points.
Click to expand...

I would only add that the formula does not permit a team to drop below zero total points. So, if a team had 0 points, and went 0-34-0, they would likely stay at 0 points.
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

#30 – COLGATE RAIDERS

Points: 32.28072 Points
Points earned in 2015-2016 0.0028 Points
Points earned in past five seasons: 4.31532 Points
Last Season Ranking: #29

The ’15-’16 season was a disappointing one for the Raiders. They finished the year 11-23-2 after coming off two consecutive years of 20+ wins and a trip to the national tournament. There is a great deal of excitement for the upcoming season – Colgate will start play in the soon-to-be completed Class of 1965 Arena, a state-of-the-art 2100 seat facility.
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

#29 – FERRIS STATE BULLDOGS

Points: 36.12688 Points
Points earned in 2015-2016 3.2099 Points
Points earned in past five seasons: 27.74738 Points
Last Season Ranking: #28

The Bulldogs had a very successful ’15-’16 season, going 20-15-6, winning the WCHA playoffs and a regional game before falling one game short of the Frozen Four. Their drop in the rankings is due to another soon to be named program that had a huge rise after last season.
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

Fighting Sioux 23 said:
This is correct. In LordofBrewtown's example, North Dakota and Denver would be dropped from the formula and no longer ranked. Of course, if North Dakota and Denver drop hockey, my guess is there wouldn't be maybe more than 3-4 programs left (if that).
Click to expand...
If you called this list/thread "The Greatest All-Time Current Programs" I could see you dropping teams, but you have called it "The Greatest Programs of All-Time." Just because a school dropped the sport doesn't mean that the history of that team suddenly disappears. In the case of North Dakota and Denver it would likely take many decades for most of the teams on the list to pass them in all-time greatness (if they ever did pass them). And of course there is also the question of when "All-Time" starts. ;)

I understand not having records for every school that has had a varsity program is problematic for including them in the current list, but that should not prevent programs that you do have complete records for being on the list, even if they are now defunct. Also, there is a lot of information available for programs that have been dropped, especially for those that started playing after 1952 and most likely they could be added to your list with enough effort.

Sean
 
Re: The Greatest Programs of All-Time: #1-#59

Lots of armchair quarterbacks on here ready to tell FS23 how it should be done... it must be nice to have all that help.
 
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