The end of leagues as we know?

[MichFan]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Looks like Motel 6 could still be Super 8...

This interview with Western Michigan's AD makes clear that they want to follow Notre Dame. Could be the new conference, could even be HE...

http://www.mlive.com/broncos/index.ssf/2011/07/wmu_unshaken_as_wcha_crumbles.html

 

[co14ers]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Oh by no means, but it's still a rather suspicious conspiracy.

For the record and although I'm a DU fan doesn't mean that I'm a fan of all that what has transpired in the last week. However, I have not seen anything that supports many peeps accusations that DU lead this effort. Whether the admin at DU did or not, I'm saddened by result. I assign blame to the creation of the Big 10 hockey conference creation. Alvarez is the a-hole I direct my venom toward. But, I do support my school's reaction to it as it was in the best interest of the program I support. That said, I am not em sad about this whole thing. It sucks balls.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

For the record and although I'm a DU fan doesn't mean that I'm a fan of all that what has transpired in the last week. However, I have not seen anything that supports many peeps accusations that DU lead this effort. Whether the admin at DU did or not, I'm saddened by result. I assign blame to the creation of the Big 10 hockey conference creation. Alvarez is the a-hole I direct my venom toward. But, I do support my school's reaction to it as it was in the best interest of the program I support. That said, I am not em sad about this whole thing. It sucks balls.

I'm still not convinced that's true...

 

[co14ers]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I'm still not convinced that's true...

For us, I think it is, albeit the future is uncertain. I may be wrong and if Notre Dame doesn't join our mix, you may be right. But, I think the risk is worth it and time will tell. Personally, I would have played it more safely and stayed in the WCHA. To me, this is a hero or goat scenario for DU.

 

[ecbrevik]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I DONT BLAME UNO, UMD, or CC. As I've said before, they really didn't have a choice, say yes or be left behind. DU wanted this, UND helped push it along. The blame for everything that is unfolding lays at the feet of Terry Pegula and the University of North Dakota.

That is a really naive view. DU and UND can't form a new conference all by themselves. They can't announce to UNO, UMD, and CC that they are leaving, and hockey is over for those schools if they don't follow. DU and UND may have pushed this new conference. But without willing followers, it doesn't go anywhere. If the other schools were truly devoted to the greater good of college hockey, they could have said no and this new conference never forms. But UNO, UMD, CC, and Miami saw what they believe to be a chance to look out for their own interests, and they took it. If there is any blame in this, it is shared by all six.

For the record and although I'm a DU fan doesn't mean that I'm a fan of all that what has transpired in the last week. However, I have not seen anything that supports many peeps accusations that DU lead this effort. Whether the admin at DU did or not, I'm saddened by result. I assign blame to the creation of the Big 10 hockey conference creation. Alvarez is the a-hole I direct my venom toward. But, I do support my school's reaction to it as it was in the best interest of the program I support. That said, I am not em sad about this whole thing. It sucks balls.

I agree with you in that I am saddened by recent events. I had hoped that the "big" schools remaining in the WCHA and CCHA would remain behind and form the pillars of their newly rearranged conferences. I think that would have been the best move for college hockey as a whole, certainly over the next few years.

I disagree that this new conference is in the best interests of the schools who are forming it. The five schools coming out of the WCHA would have been favored to be the WCHA's top 5 in many seasons post 2013. UND and DU would have been favored as the new WCHA's major powers. Assuming that Notre Dame goes to either the new conference or HE, the removal of Miami and Notre Dame from the CCHA removes the two programs that would have been favored as the CCHA's new major powers. UND, DU, Miami, and Notre Dame would have been expected to make most NCAA tourneys in the coming years. The wins these programs would have likely racked up would have kept fans in he stands and money flowing through the gates.

These teams have traded in their front-runner status for a major gamble. They have put at least six of the current power programs in college hockey into a single conference. That number may become as high as eight. For all eight of those programs, the road to the NCAA tournament just got much harder. If any of these programs should slip in this new power conference, and become the new doormat instead of one of the new WCHA/CCHA powers, the seats in the arenas may not host as many fans. Maybe other revenues will make up for that, maybe not. But this new conference is a major gamble for every program that moves into it.

This move is sort of like taking SEC football, dumping the bottom half, and replacing that bottom half with a couple of power teams from the Big 12 as a response to competetion from the Big 10 and Pac 10 (or whatever the numbers are these days ). They may all be great programs today, but someone HAS to lose and finish last. Its the nature of sports.

 

[leswp1]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

...These teams have traded in their front-runner status for a major gamble. They have put at least six of the current power programs in college hockey into a single conference. That number may become as high as eight. For all eight of those programs, the road to the NCAA tournament just got much harder. If any of these programs should slip in this new power conference, and become the new doormat instead of one of the new WCHA/CCHA powers, the seats in the arenas may not host as many fans. Maybe other revenues will make up for that, maybe not. But this new conference is a major gamble for every program that moves into it.

This move is sort of like taking SEC football, dumping the bottom half, and replacing that bottom half with a couple of power teams from the Big 12 as a response to competetion from the Big 10 and Pac 10 (or whatever the numbers are these days ). They may all be great programs today, but someone HAS to lose and finish last. Its the nature of sports.

This.

I haven't been following this closely (and am guilty of not reading back) but I am not sure what the bonus ball is to belong to a conference where you aren't the guaranteed powerhouse. UML was top of the game in DII. Since going D I we are still scrambling many yrs later. How are all these schools going to deal with the Bandwagon Fans that love to brag/ go to a winning game but have no heart for losing? Didn't the liklihood of getting to the F4 just drop for all those teams? Out here when BC is winning all the little kids wear the BC stuff and follow. A few yrs ago they were not doing as well- poof!- we saw BU stuff. Cynical (and probably ignorant) view on my part I am sure.

 

[HarleyMC]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I don't like loose ends. I don't like suspense. Make a decision. Make an announcement. Someone of note, just say something.

I agree, the few press releases by new conference spokespersons have created somewhat of a "cloak and dagger" feel to the process and that has resulted in some criticism. Apparently no mention was made of the possibility of this happening in the official WCHA meetings in April. I assume the initial selection committee from UND and DU in concert with other invited WCHA ADs also decided not to deliberate too long with the initial conference formation, which could have resulted in periodic leaks to the press and severe backlash from fanbases and sports gurus over a more extended period of time.

The WCHA imposes a financial penalty on teams that withdraw without at least a one year advance notice. Next offseason would have been too late for the conference and teams to make adjustments anyway, so if they were going to do it...it's now.

With all the negative feedback among fans (I'm sure there are many players who don't like it either) from schools that didn't make the cut, one has to wonder what additional motivation there may be to pound the hell out of the defected teams when they come to town over the next two seasons.

McLeod seems to indicate the negative feedback and "cloak and dagger" method in which this all came about will be hard to swallow for a while:

As time goes on and circumstances like this arise and it's clear that the impetus is coming from a couple of schools in the WCHA they seem to be driving this train and pushing it down the track the erosion of what we've had, the erosion of the relationships that we've had and the erosion in the trust that we've had in one another gets to be more apparent. That is one of the concerns in the long run, even if we don't stay together.

There's going to be some awful, awful hard feelings, and that will be reflected in scheduling prerogatives for all of the institutions involved, et cetera. So it's not going to be an easy road here for the next couple of years, that's for sure.

 

[dggoddard]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Northern Michigan University is going to "aggressively pursue" its conference strategy. Sounds like they might like to jump to the WCHA. That would give the "new" WCHA six teams; UAA, MSU-M, SCSU, MTU, NMU & BSU. If the compact six-team WCHA could get some sort of a scheduling agreement with the Big Ten Hockey Conference, maybe four, six or eight games with some guaranteed visits, it could work.

http://www.miningjournal.net/page/content.detail/id/564479/-Cats-going-all-in.html?nav=5010

 

[giwan]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

McLeod should be embarrassed of how little he knew and shows even more how little he has done for the conference.

 

[geezer]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I know. They should get every D1 team in the country together, and throw sticks.
No, but what happened to Canadian schools joining D1 hockey? Will this create room for them?

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Above the board or not, the unanimous vote to destroy what's left of the CCHA would have had the same consequences for FSU, LSSU etc. as what you ALL find yourselves now dealing with.

You cannot claim the moral high ground for your school if you are a supporter of the left-behinders in the WCHA.

You're missing the point. Sure, there have been great rivalries with other schools in the WCHA. Maybe this is not the case for you...but I have nearly always rooted for a WCHA sweep in the NCAAs. One of the coolest moments was a few years back when the WCHA had all four teams in the FrozFour. Amazing.

But then again, I have always been a WCHA guy as that's my family. Strangers are strangers...but unlike others here, for me its a high priority to not hurt family. I guess as with any divorce...sometimes behavior shows that other family members are not worth a reconcilliation efffort.

 

[joecct]

I know. They should get every D1 team in the country together, and throw sticks.
No, but what happened to Canadian schools joining D1 hockey? Will this create room for them?

Canadian schools are D-II. No more play-ups per 2010-100. That's why we need to make it a D-I/II National Collegiate Championship.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Looks like Motel 6 could still be Super 8...

This interview with Western Michigan's AD makes clear that they want to follow Notre Dame. Could be the new conference, could even be HE...

http://www.mlive.com/broncos/index.ssf/2011/07/wmu_unshaken_as_wcha_crumbles.html

Everything WMU is saying makes sense. Even thought they are not saying so...they're in panic mode. And they're trying to hold on to the primary card they're left holding...the mirage of some tie to Notre Dame due to this realignment. I got news...I wouldn't put to much stock in Notre Dame looking out for WMU.

NMU's stance of we're taking quick action shows that they're holding better cards...and smartly are taking no chances by playing them quickly. To me the statement of taking action in the next two weeks says their looking closely at realigning with remaining WCHA powers. NMU has a handful of advantages in aligning with some more solid schools in the west including...history in the WCHA, relationships with MTU and being on the right side of Lake Michigan. I suspect they'll be joining with MTU, SCSU and Mankato to ensure their programs health. But unless Notre Dame really wants a nearby school in HE...I think they won't be so lucky.

 

[Osorojo]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Will the ever more popular one-and-done participation in "super-school" hockey programs carry over into the duration of their conference membership?

 

[Gurtholfin]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

You're missing the point. Sure, there have been great rivalries with other schools in the WCHA. Maybe this is not the case for you...but I have nearly always rooted for a WCHA sweep in the NCAAs. One of the coolest moments was a few years back when the WCHA had all four teams in the FrozFour. Amazing.

But then again, I have always been a WCHA guy as that's my family. Strangers are strangers...but unlike others here, for me its a high priority to not hurt family. I guess as with any divorce...sometimes behavior shows that other family members are not worth a reconcilliation efffort.

I think you missed my point(s).

I feel (felt) the same way about the WCHA although I'd be dishonest to say that I rooted for ALL of our conference mates.

All I'm saying is that the Tech, Mavs, UAA and SCSU fans who are accusing the big schools of bad behavior are on shaky ground with their own schools trying, but ultimately failing, to do the same thing.

You're not saying that it was all okay because the schools that would have been hurt are from the CCHA, are you? Their not "family," so screw them?

 

[CHFAN222]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Canadian schools are D-II. No more play-ups per 2010-100. That's why we need to make it a D-I/II National Collegiate Championship.

Incorrect. Since there is no D-II championship in ice hockey Canadian schools would be allowed to field a D-1 Mens ice hockey team right away. UBC though recently declined to join the NCAA.

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/ends+plans+join+NCAA/4679110/story.html

 

[Gurtholfin]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

For the record and although I'm a DU fan doesn't mean that I'm a fan of all that what has transpired in the last week. However, I have not seen anything that supports many peeps accusations that DU lead this effort. Whether the admin at DU did or not, I'm saddened by result. I assign blame to the creation of the Big 10 hockey conference creation. Alvarez is the a-hole I direct my venom toward. But, I do support my school's reaction to it as it was in the best interest of the program I support. That said, I am not em sad about this whole thing. It sucks balls.

As a Badger fan having to live here under his boot for almost 20 years now, I support venom directed his way.

But to blame him for all that has happened in college hockey might just be the silliest, most naive and simplistic explanation in the history of explanations. Unless Barry bankrolled PSU, you cannot blame him.

Whether he was vocal or not, as soon as there were 6 division 1 college hockey programs in the Big 10, there was going to be a conference. If you don't understand, you're not paying attention to MAJOR college athletics or the Big 10.

Hate Barry all you want. Most of us do. But he's not the monster under the bed.

 

[Patman]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

Incorrect. Since there is no D-II championship in ice hockey Canadian schools would be allowed to field a D-1 Mens ice hockey team right away.

No they won't. There are a few schools playing DII right now.

 

[BC/HE]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

I don't want to be the bearer of bad news for Western Michigan but there is very little chance that they come along with Notre Dame to Hockey East. Even bringing Miami with them would not not have been the reason to take in Notre Dame. Notre Dame stands alone and there are plenty of choices for a 12th team on the Hockey East doorstep most notably RPI if they want to come in with Notre Dame. There is even much thought that Notre Dame is too far from the footprint so unless you are a perennial top 10 team I don't think you would even be considered.

 

[CHFAN222]

Re: The end of leagues as we know?

No they won't. There are a few schools playing DII right now.

Yes but I believe they have the option of playing up to D-1 if they choose to. The only door that has been permanently closed is D-III moving up to play in D-1.