The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

[5mn_Major]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Fox News CEO Roger Ailes: Fox And 'The Other Side' Need To Tone Down Rhetoric

Hmmm. If "Fox News" was "news" and "objective", it wouldn't have a "side" would it? So Roger Ailes just admitted that Fox News takes sides. Thank you.

"I told all of our guys, shut up, tone it down, make your argument intellectually," Ailes said. You don't have to do it with bombast. I hope the other side does that."

When it comes to understanding analysis like the Economist...Fox is pretty much 'illiterate'.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Not really a surprise I don't think.

Suspected Tucson gunman Jared Lee Loughner registered as an independent voter in Arizona in the fall of 2006, according to the Pima County Registrar of Voters.

Loughner registered to vote on Sept. 29, 2006, identifying himself as an independent. Records show he voted in the 2006 and 2008 elections but is current listed as "inactive" on the state's voter roles -- meaning that he did not vote in November.

Link.

 

[SteveP]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Just trying to inject a little levity into the midst of the debate after the crime in Tucson by asking....

...what the heck is Joe doing with that left hand??

<a href="http://www.flickr.com/photos/24577559@N05/5344358561/" title="Biden by steve2526, on Flickr"><img src="http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5085/5344358561_954d15e0d1.jpg" width="498" height="366" alt="Biden" /></a>

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Shows just how clueless the public is. A large chunk either don't know math, or ignore it.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Public-strongly-opposes-debt-rb-2526522239.html

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Shows just how clueless the public is. A large chunk either don't know math, or ignore it.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Public-strongly-opposes-debt-rb-2526522239.html

Well, the math works out if you believe that 90% of the budget is foreign aid.

I'd support making cuts at the exact rate of public support for cuts (which is not the same thing, of course, but hey, gotta start somewhere)

Cut:

24% of the education budget
21% of law enforcement
51% of military spending
45% of environment
53% of financial oversight (this alone would probably cost more than all the savings gained)
47% of the national park service
20% of social security benefits
24% of Medicare benefits
73% of foreign aid (saving about $8)
65% of the IRS budget (again, weird)

Military, Medicare and Social Security are the only line items above noise, but hey, it's a start.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Shows just how clueless the public is. A large chunk either don't know math, or ignore it.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Public-strongly-opposes-debt-rb-2526522239.html

An honest question: Is it literally impossible to cut enough to avoid raising the ceiling? I don't think I've seen anyone address that point.

 

[unofan]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

An honest question: Is it literally impossible to cut enough to avoid raising the ceiling? I don't think I've seen anyone address that point.

Technically, no. You could always shut down the federal gov't like they did in the 90's (and on The West Wing). Would make for interesting short term theater, though probably not result in any long term changes.

Realisticly, yes, it's impossible. Too many ongoing obligations to cut enough to magically turn the budget around on a dime. You can't stop a freight train this big instantaneously.

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

yah, you can't cut that much literally overnight. now, you certainly could if you did it when you first put together the budget at the beginning of the fiscal year. not that it will happen, as the unrealistic public would have a major tantrum. of course sooner or later it will have to happen, but the longer it's put off, the uglier it'll be.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

What I think is even more interesting about that poll is that they split the sample into two groups. One group was asked the question straight up, while the other was read this warning before being asked the question:

As you may know, not raising the debt limit would damage the US’ sovereign debt rating, which is like our
credit rating: it would seriously damage our credibility abroad, would make it much more difficult for us to
borrow in the future, and would likely push up interest rates.

The crazy thing is, each half of the sample, with explanation and without, had 71% opposing it. Makes you think that whatever justification is made for such a move in the coming months will fall on deaf ears.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

yah, you can't cut that much literally overnight. now, you certainly could if you did it when you first put together the budget at the beginning of the fiscal year.

Doesn't really make a difference, since cuts that start their way through the authorization-appropriations digestive tract in Year X get pooped out as actual expenditures around Year X+2.

 

[Priceless]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Hutchison won't seek reelection in 2012

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Doesn't really make a difference, since cuts that start their way through the authorization-appropriations digestive tract in Year X get pooped out as actual expenditures around Year X+2.

but if we actually someday had feds that cared about controlling the budget, you could have real cuts, at least I think. we've just never really had that type of folks running things so we've never seen it in action. not that I'm holding my breath, the way the moaning has already started about a rumored effort to cut $60 billion in spending when we're $1-1.5 trillion off.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

but if we actually someday had feds that cared about controlling the budget, you could have real cuts, at least I think. we've just never really had that type of folks running things so we've never seen it in action. not that I'm holding my breath, the way the moaning has already started about a rumored effort to cut $60 billion in spending when we're $1-1.5 trillion off.

Our "leaders" merely follow the public. If the electorate is willing to cut their own spending and raise their own taxes, then the feds will do so. But for one thing, many people believe in sacrifice only in the abstract, and for another, we've had talking heads drilling into our heads for two decades that any cutting of spending or raising of taxes is the boogeyman.

If a senator got up tomorrow and said "I support a 10% across the board cut in spending and a 10% across the board raising of taxes, no exceptions, no amendments, vote up or down" how much support do you think he would get, and how long do you think he'd last in the next election cycle?

Democracy is a very good system for almost everything and it's far preferable to any other system. But it sucks at making hard choices. The only time you can ever get a democratic people to sacrifice is during a war, because they're scared and pissed off and they can stop thinking about #1 for five seconds. There's no economic equivalent to that.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Our "leaders" merely follow the public. If the electorate is willing to cut their own spending and raise their own taxes, then the feds will do so. But for one thing, many people believe in sacrifice only in the abstract, and for another, we've had talking heads drilling into our heads for two decades that any cutting of spending or raising of taxes is the boogeyman.

If a senator got up tomorrow and said "I support a 10% across the board cut in spending and a 10% across the board raising of taxes," how long do you think he'd last?

Don't forget that when the government collects taxes from you they are stealing your money.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Don't forget that when the government collects taxes from you they are stealing your money.

And when government cuts spending they are starving crippled black Spanish-speaking gay children of single mothers, I know, I know. That's the whole problem. Each side has taken a matter of quantity, negotiation, and turned it into a matter of quality, principle. So they can't compromise without undercutting their drag act that they are doing battle with the forces of darkness.

Politics is about splitting the difference, but you can't split the difference with Hitler, that's appeasement. So both sides hunker in their bunkers and spout nonsense to cover the nonsense they spouted yesterday. And we let them, so it's on us. If a leader got up at a Tea Party rally or an AFT meeting and said, "wow -- we're really exaggerating for effect here! This is pretty stupid and it leads nowhere," I'm sure cool heads would nod and rethink their positions and come up with a mature new position.

Nobody taught the American people the third rule of negotiation. The first rule is "start with a ridiculous position (taxation is theft, program cuts kill babies)" the second is "act indignant when the other party tries to haggle you down (that's tyranny, that's Dickensian)." They've got both of those down solid. But the third rule is "don't leave the showroom without a deal unless you can afford to." We can't but we do. So we get exactly what we deserve.

 

[Bakunin]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Our "leaders" merely follow the public.

My congressional district gets < $0.50 back for every dollar collected in federal taxes here. If we can do it, the rest of you deadbeats can do it, too.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

My congressional district gets < $0.50 back for every dollar collected in federal taxes here. If we can do it, the rest of you deadbeats can do it, too.

Cut off the red states.

 

[joecct]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Our "leaders" merely follow the public. If the electorate is willing to cut their own spending and raise their own taxes, then the feds will do so. But for one thing, many people believe in sacrifice only in the abstract, and for another, we've had talking heads drilling into our heads for two decades that any cutting of spending or raising of taxes is the boogeyman.

If a senator got up tomorrow and said "I support a 10% across the board cut in spending and a 10% across the board raising of taxes, no exceptions, no amendments, vote up or down" how much support do you think he would get, and how long do you think he'd last in the next election cycle?

Democracy is a very good system for almost everything and it's far preferable to any other system. But it sucks at making hard choices. The only time you can ever get a democratic people to sacrifice is during a war, because they're scared and pissed off and they can stop thinking about #1 for five seconds. There's no economic equivalent to that.

Well, I've cut back my spending, and the government (in toto) raised my taxes. Am I a good boy?

 

[Priceless]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

Well, I've cut back my spending, and the government (in toto) raised my taxes. Am I a good boy?

No, you're supposed to spend more to stimulate the economy.

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: The 112th Congress - A Congress divided shall not cry!

No, you're supposed to spend more to stimulate the economy.

Yes, stop thinking selfishly of your own personal financial situation and what is responsible spending for you. Spend irresponsibly so the economy can hum short term.