Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Working security tomorrow. Flight number?
Working security tomorrow. Flight number?
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Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
- Thread starter Old Pio
- Start date
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Because by law they dont need probable cause to pull you over, they need reasonable suspicion. You know what the benchmark for that is...it is ridiculously low. It can be as little as driving on a street near bar close where people have been nailed recently for drunk driving. And it will hold up in any court if they catch someone using just that standard. Trust me on this I worked at a bar where this happened all the time. (and we often talked to the cops directly about it) Reasonable suspicion can be defined as almost anything.
That is the difference between a traffic stop and a true search. To invade my privacy to the point where they search me or my car or to give me a ticket for something they do need probable cause. To just pull me over and see whats up they just need a reason to believe something is going on.
Because by law they dont need probable cause to pull you over, they need reasonable suspicion. You know what the benchmark for that is...it is ridiculously low. It can be as little as driving on a street near bar close where people have been nailed recently for drunk driving. And it will hold up in any court if they catch someone using just that standard. Trust me on this I worked at a bar where this happened all the time. (and we often talked to the cops directly about it) Reasonable suspicion can be defined as almost anything.
That is the difference between a traffic stop and a true search. To invade my privacy to the point where they search me or my car or to give me a ticket for something they do need probable cause. To just pull me over and see whats up they just need a reason to believe something is going on.
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Oh great, first us righties implicitly suggest racial profiling. Now we're advocating discriminating against the intellectually challenged. Oh, the humanity!
Oh great, first us righties implicitly suggest racial profiling. Now we're advocating discriminating against the intellectually challenged. Oh, the humanity!
Patman
Rodent of Unusual Size
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
to be fair, after the attempted car-bombing in oregon last night by a somali teen which failed because the bomb didn't work, profiling stupid terrorists doesn't sound like a bad idea.
to be fair, after the attempted car-bombing in oregon last night by a somali teen which failed because the bomb didn't work, profiling stupid terrorists doesn't sound like a bad idea.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
It is her right to give up, to be honest it is none of your business. She is not speaking for anyone else or saying you have to do the same, but if she wants to and chooses o than the terrorists have NOT won. She is exercising her rights as an American...that is what this country is supposed to be all about. The terrorists dont want us free thinking, they want us group thinking because the group is way more dangerous and destructive than the individual. Group think nearly destroyed the Bill of Rights post 9/11, group think is why there is never change in Washington no matter who is in power. Group think is the true enemy of Democracy.
Nothing to be sad about man, you should be happy she made her choice and that you can do the same in that regard.
Posts like this make me sad. People willing to give up their rights so easily. Have the terrorists won already?
It is her right to give up, to be honest it is none of your business. She is not speaking for anyone else or saying you have to do the same, but if she wants to and chooses o than the terrorists have NOT won. She is exercising her rights as an American...that is what this country is supposed to be all about. The terrorists dont want us free thinking, they want us group thinking because the group is way more dangerous and destructive than the individual. Group think nearly destroyed the Bill of Rights post 9/11, group think is why there is never change in Washington no matter who is in power. Group think is the true enemy of Democracy.
Nothing to be sad about man, you should be happy she made her choice and that you can do the same in that regard.
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Wait 'til they start screening for butt bombs. You seem to have missed the point here. She won't be "giving" up anything, she has no choice. She may not CARE, and that's certainly her business, but she's made no choice. She has no rights whatsoever when it comes to submitting to the moronic dictates of TSA.
Notwithstanding your little exegesis about "group think," there is no "thinking" of any kind going on here. She either lets them take a nude picture or feel her up, or she doesn't fly.
Wait 'til they start screening for butt bombs. You seem to have missed the point here. She won't be "giving" up anything, she has no choice. She may not CARE, and that's certainly her business, but she's made no choice. She has no rights whatsoever when it comes to submitting to the moronic dictates of TSA.
Notwithstanding your little exegesis about "group think," there is no "thinking" of any kind going on here. She either lets them take a nude picture or feel her up, or she doesn't fly.
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P
Priceless
Guest
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Technically, she could decide to drive, take the train, bus or another mode of transportation. She still has those rights.
It's weird that for the past nine years you haven't commented on the erosion of our civil rights. If we had a "President McCain" in office I wonder if you would have started this thread, or left it to one of us terrorist sympathizers.
Either way, it's nice to see that those on the political right may finally be starting to see what some of us have been pointing out for the better part of the last decade.
And no, huskyfan, you aren't "safer" because they are screening you. What you have is the illusion of safety. We as a traveling public demand that the TSA and other alphabet soup groups in DC do "something" to "protect" us. What that "something" is gets pretty vague. So the government does stupid things - like spend DHS money protecting petting zoos instead of the Statue of Liberty. Terrorists have been hijacking planes for years, they didn't just discover the practice on 9/11. They will again, I guarantee it. They've already come close to blowing up a plane; and there are plenty of groups out there besides AQ that are trying to make a statement. That's the price we pay for living in a free society. What we as a nation need to decide is how much liberty are we willing to trade for safety. Personally, I think people are too freaking scared and need to get over it already.
Technically, she could decide to drive, take the train, bus or another mode of transportation. She still has those rights.
It's weird that for the past nine years you haven't commented on the erosion of our civil rights. If we had a "President McCain" in office I wonder if you would have started this thread, or left it to one of us terrorist sympathizers.
Either way, it's nice to see that those on the political right may finally be starting to see what some of us have been pointing out for the better part of the last decade.
And no, huskyfan, you aren't "safer" because they are screening you. What you have is the illusion of safety. We as a traveling public demand that the TSA and other alphabet soup groups in DC do "something" to "protect" us. What that "something" is gets pretty vague. So the government does stupid things - like spend DHS money protecting petting zoos instead of the Statue of Liberty. Terrorists have been hijacking planes for years, they didn't just discover the practice on 9/11. They will again, I guarantee it. They've already come close to blowing up a plane; and there are plenty of groups out there besides AQ that are trying to make a statement. That's the price we pay for living in a free society. What we as a nation need to decide is how much liberty are we willing to trade for safety. Personally, I think people are too freaking scared and need to get over it already.
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Second verse, same as the first. Hey, genius, I wasn't posting here nine years ago. But you go right ahead displaying your world class ignorance and prejudices, hear?
Second verse, same as the first. Hey, genius, I wasn't posting here nine years ago. But you go right ahead displaying your world class ignorance and prejudices, hear?
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WeWantMore
New member
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
It's crazy that so many people are still upset about the health care bill!
Oh, is that not what his reasoning was? I get all my terrorism news from Mike Bloomberg.
It's crazy that so many people are still upset about the health care bill!
Oh, is that not what his reasoning was? I get all my terrorism news from Mike Bloomberg.
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
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Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Is that the best you got, pinhead? I mokusatsu you. Share your moroic humor with the rest of the children, but I'm outta here.
Is that the best you got, pinhead? I mokusatsu you. Share your moroic humor with the rest of the children, but I'm outta here.
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
That's not the TSA's fault, it's John Q. Public's. When the DHS was created they did an initial list of the top thousand or so most likely/damaging civilian targets for terrorism in the US. They were nearly all in two places: New York City and DC. If the DHS had its way, the entire budget for civilian anti-terrorism would be spent in those two places. But once the public got wind of that, every Congressman in Oklahoma and Alabama got a call from yahoos blatting about protecting their DAR garden. So, the money got spread around everywhere, even though that was stupid. And as much as I'd like to blame that on idiots like Joe Leiberman, he doesn't have a lot of choice -- the boobocracy hath so decreed it.
Pretty much everything stupid that bureaucrats do isn't their idea and is in fact totally the opposite of the studies they've done, but they're forced to do it because of some numbskull with a flag lapel pin.
That's not the TSA's fault, it's John Q. Public's. When the DHS was created they did an initial list of the top thousand or so most likely/damaging civilian targets for terrorism in the US. They were nearly all in two places: New York City and DC. If the DHS had its way, the entire budget for civilian anti-terrorism would be spent in those two places. But once the public got wind of that, every Congressman in Oklahoma and Alabama got a call from yahoos blatting about protecting their DAR garden. So, the money got spread around everywhere, even though that was stupid. And as much as I'd like to blame that on idiots like Joe Leiberman, he doesn't have a lot of choice -- the boobocracy hath so decreed it.
Pretty much everything stupid that bureaucrats do isn't their idea and is in fact totally the opposite of the studies they've done, but they're forced to do it because of some numbskull with a flag lapel pin.
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eaglehockeyrules
BC '84, HES '97
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Do people really equate a TSA security screening with sexual assault?! Political correctness is overtaking commonsense.
Do people really equate a TSA security screening with sexual assault?! Political correctness is overtaking commonsense.
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
What do you call putting your hands on someone's genitals without permission? The political correctness here is not profiling passengers, out of fear of offending some of them.
What do you call putting your hands on someone's genitals without permission? The political correctness here is not profiling passengers, out of fear of offending some of them.
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P
Priceless
Guest
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
I'm willing to blame everyone. Darling may ask for the pony but it's the job of Mommy and Daddy to say no.
I'm willing to blame everyone. Darling may ask for the pony but it's the job of Mommy and Daddy to say no.
WeWantMore
New member
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
Exactly. It's an absolute cop out to say we can't blame them.
Exactly. It's an absolute cop out to say we can't blame them.
leswp1
New member
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
I am of 2 minds about whether the measures are useful or not but I don't get the bit about invading rights, etc. This is the thing that confuses me- Flying isn't a right or a requirement. No one is forcing people to chose to fly or preventing them from other modes of travel. I could understand if the gov't told people they were required to fly and then made rules but this isn't the case. The passengers voluntarily are purchasing a service with the knowledge that if they want to fly they need to pass thru certain screening. Legally, if they require something of every traveller can't they make what ever rules they want whether they are reasonable or not? People can vote with their feet if they don't like it (altho most people seem rather pragmatic about it). If you want to go on the bumper cars you need to meet certain requirements. They could set the bar at 6ft and no one would expect the rules to change, they just wish they were taller.
Well said.
Last I checked no one is holding anyone down or forcing them to do anything. This premise would make a great SNL skit tho.
I am of 2 minds about whether the measures are useful or not but I don't get the bit about invading rights, etc. This is the thing that confuses me- Flying isn't a right or a requirement. No one is forcing people to chose to fly or preventing them from other modes of travel. I could understand if the gov't told people they were required to fly and then made rules but this isn't the case. The passengers voluntarily are purchasing a service with the knowledge that if they want to fly they need to pass thru certain screening. Legally, if they require something of every traveller can't they make what ever rules they want whether they are reasonable or not? People can vote with their feet if they don't like it (altho most people seem rather pragmatic about it). If you want to go on the bumper cars you need to meet certain requirements. They could set the bar at 6ft and no one would expect the rules to change, they just wish they were taller.
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
4th amendment? And if you agree with the nonsense in Handyman's post, we really are too far apart to discuss this. The lady in question didn't give up her rights, she had them taken away from her. The fact did she did so with a smile is an entirely different matter. Once she was in the terminal, she had no choice. Why those thugs from TSA have threatened to arrest and fine people who want to leave the terminal once they've entered the vaunted "security zone,' which is one step (and a very small step) away from the twilight zone.
And that other nonsense about "you don't have to fly, you can roller skate, or jog or use an Irish mail" is codswallop. Americans have the right to fly and the government has intruded itself between those Americans and the airlines. And they insist they can either take a nude photo of you or grab your junk as a condition of exercising your right to fly. You may be of "two minds" about this, I'm not.
Actually I've made all the points relevant to me multiple times, so let's just say we disagree. I don't think it's a good idea to have government agents pawing children, the handicapped and women in the name of some egalitarian "security" principle where we treat everyone the same. America is the only major country that does that. I wonder why. Perhaps because it doesn't enhance security? Or because we're afraid to stand up to CAIR?
Can I assume you're looking forward to the day they begin searching body cavities? Because it will come just as soon as some Islamist tries it. Enjoy.
4th amendment? And if you agree with the nonsense in Handyman's post, we really are too far apart to discuss this. The lady in question didn't give up her rights, she had them taken away from her. The fact did she did so with a smile is an entirely different matter. Once she was in the terminal, she had no choice. Why those thugs from TSA have threatened to arrest and fine people who want to leave the terminal once they've entered the vaunted "security zone,' which is one step (and a very small step) away from the twilight zone.
And that other nonsense about "you don't have to fly, you can roller skate, or jog or use an Irish mail" is codswallop. Americans have the right to fly and the government has intruded itself between those Americans and the airlines. And they insist they can either take a nude photo of you or grab your junk as a condition of exercising your right to fly. You may be of "two minds" about this, I'm not.
Actually I've made all the points relevant to me multiple times, so let's just say we disagree. I don't think it's a good idea to have government agents pawing children, the handicapped and women in the name of some egalitarian "security" principle where we treat everyone the same. America is the only major country that does that. I wonder why. Perhaps because it doesn't enhance security? Or because we're afraid to stand up to CAIR?
Can I assume you're looking forward to the day they begin searching body cavities? Because it will come just as soon as some Islamist tries it. Enjoy.
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MinnesotaNorthStar
Minding the gap
Re: Take a Stand Against Sexual Assault: Resist the TSA
And who and when and how can they be denied that right without due process? Except when we're through the looking glass and Barney Fife rules the world.
And who and when and how can they be denied that right without due process? Except when we're through the looking glass and Barney Fife rules the world.
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