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POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

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Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

SJHovey said:
You guys sit here and post about "punishing" a corporation for it's wrongdoing, like it's a dog that just pizzed on the floor but will learn it's lesson when you punish it. Do you think the class actions are going to teach a corporation anything? How does that work exactly? Human beings have the ability to learn. Corporations can't learn or be taught anything.

If you extract $30 million from Wells Fargo in a class action, did somehow the "corporation" learn anything? It just comes out of corporate profits, to the extent they don't get that money back from you in other fees. You punish wrong behavior by punishing the human beings who implemented it. You think the class action is going to name all the local account execs as defendants?

Again, that's the real fraud here. The fraudulent idea that the class actions are going to compensate the victims. The fraudulent idea that we'll punish the corporation like a scolded dog.
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It's also about changing behavior. Technically, McDonalds was not breaking the law. But their policy was harming their customers for a long time. The class action was punishment to direct them to change their behavior.

Again, it's a great idea to have a regulatory agency that will enforce laws. But they haven't been effective for a long, long time. There were actual laws broken in the lead up to the '08 crash, but nobody went to prison. And there's a big outcry against regulations, as if they somehow harm businesses, when the reality is that they are there to protect the rest of the public from them. So in the absence of real laws and enforcements, the public is left to suing.

Ask BP is they learned anything from their penalty. Or VW. The rest of their industry sure did.
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

St. Clown said:
The head of Community Banking "retired," as did the then-CEO, Jon Stumpf. Changes to banker compensation policies changed, including the removal of new account quotas.

The entity didn't learn anything from the lawsuit, but actions were taken to punish the two fall guys. One likely knew the details, the other likely did not, but should have had suspected something was amiss. Three members of the Board of Directors "left" the company, too. There is new employee training in place, mandated for all employees, even those without customer contact.

The harm suffered by WF won't be in the lawsuit payout. That'll be a pittance compared to revenue and profit, both measuring in the tens of billions. The harm is in the brand taking a hit. Wells Fargo had been the largest by, by market capitalization, in the USA. That's no longer the case as the market's good will premium evaporated since last year.
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So why is that a good reason why people can't sue their banks in a class action?

Pretty much every single every other industry is liable to class action lawsuits. Why should the banking industry get singled out as not liable to that? That also makes no sense.
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

alfablue said:
So why is that a good reason why people can't sue their banks in a class action?

Pretty much every single every other industry is liable to class action lawsuits. Why should the banking industry get singled out as not liable to that? That also makes no sense.
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I never made that argument.
 
alfablue said:
So why is that a good reason why people can't sue their banks in a class action?

Pretty much every single every other industry is liable to class action lawsuits. Why should the banking industry get singled out as not liable to that? That also makes no sense.
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Because they have a long drawn out arbitration process that ensures nothing gets done. The system works!
 
alfablue said:
So why is that a good reason why people can't sue their banks in a class action?

Pretty much every single every other industry is liable to class action lawsuits. Why should the banking industry get singled out as not liable to that? That also makes no sense.
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Banks aren’t treated specially. I bet you’ve agreed to a mandatory arbitration clause, and one that forbids class actions and you don’t even know it.
 
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Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

jerphisch said:
It wasn't even this. It was that the coffee was that hot and MANY people had been burned just as badly, and McDonalds completely ignored multiple orders to reduce the temperature to a safe level. That lady hit the jackpot simply by luck of timing. The court was not rewarding her, they were punishing McDonalds for their repeated and willful negligence.
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Uh, not quite.

unofan said:
Maybe because it wasn't about merely hot coffee, but coffee so hot and well above accepted industry standards, that she got third degree burns in less than 5 seconds.
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She literally almost died from those burns.
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

SJHovey said:
Hey, I have an idea. If it's about punishing corporations and the individuals who work for them, we should set up a court system for doing that. Maybe call it something like "the criminal justice system" or something catchy like that. We'd have to come up with a catchy name for the people who actually prosecute the cases, but I'm sure we could do it.

Do we take the position it's not a crime to falsify credit applications or bank account applications or the like? Is there some reason we can't put these people in jail as a form of "punishment" and to deter future little fraudsters from copying their methods?

The civil justice system is for compensating people who have been wronged. Using it as a cudgel to prosecute criminal behavior is silly.
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Who you going to charge? Prosecuting corporations is rather difficult because there is a lot of bureaucracy. We going to charge the CEOs? How about the board of directors? Please or wise one tell us who is to blame.

Let me guess you probably think that when a company steals a billion dollars fining them a million is an actual deterrent dont you...

BTW arbitration is a joke. Do a little research into the process it is as one sided as a kangaroo court.
 
Handyman said:
Who you going to charge? Prosecuting corporations is rather difficult because there is a lot of bureaucracy. We going to charge the CEOs? How about the board of directors? Please or wise one tell us who is to blame.
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How about we start with the people who filled out the fraudulent bank documents, and the people who permitted it. That has to be a felony. We prosecuted the peanut guys, why not these guys?
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

I mean I know trump is an idiot, but it still blows my mind that after simply stating “I’m declaring the opioid crisis to be a national emergency” he just kicked back, put his tiny hands behind his head and said “welp, that was easy!” Without a single bit of strategy, guidance, funding, goal setting, or anything else.
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Anyone who has to regularly assure you they went to some "name brand" elite school, is typically among the least deserving to have attended it.
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

Good lord reading people talk about the Uranium One "scandal" will literally make you want to bash your head into a wall. These people make Flaggy sound sane. Apparently that is the new Watergate and the Trump Russia scandal is BS. Oh and Robert Mueller is some sort of liberal spy along with Comey despite them being Republicans...

I say we are about 2 days away from Sicatoka "just asking the question" of whether this is real or not then telling us how this made us less secure which makes him mad. Then when he is asked about all the stuff he ignores he will "be on the road" or some such nonsense again :p
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

So there was the witch hunt for DA EMAILZ from St Hillary. Now, there is the FUNDZ FROM DNC about Trump/Russia.

Who will cave first? Same underhanded stuff. And this is why I hate politics.
 
Brenthoven said:
So there was the witch hunt for DA EMAILZ from St Hillary. Now, there is the FUNDZ FROM DNC about Trump/Russia.

Who will cave first? Same underhanded stuff. And this is why I hate politics.
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Serious question, wasn’t it known from Day 1 that the Russian file resulted from paid oppo research by the Dems? Why is it back in the headlines?
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

geezer said:
Serious question, wasn’t it known from Day 1 that the Russian file resulted from paid oppo research by the Dems? Why is it back in the headlines?
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I honestly don't know.
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

busterman62 said:
I'm sorry I misconstrued your original question. I thought you were comparing GWB vs. BO. My bad. It's hard to concentrate appropriately when one is dodging moving goalposts.
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Are you being intentionally obtuse? It went from 1.2% to nearly 10% during Bush back down to 2.1% under Obama.
 
Re: POTUS 45.21 STAND for our great National Anthem

geezer said:
I mean I know trump is an idiot, but it still blows my mind that after simply stating “I’m declaring the opioid crisis to be a national emergency” he just kicked back, put his tiny hands behind his head and said “welp, that was easy!” Without a single bit of strategy, guidance, funding, goal setting, or anything else.
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just say no
 
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