Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

So the world championship gets more interesting, doesn't it?

Vettel started from pole, Weber next to him- and after an hour delay for rain, Weber quickly is out.

Vettel drove well, but reliablity bit him, HARD.

And Alonso takes full advantage of it, now firmly in the championship lead. And with Hamilton surviving into second, he's doing ok. Far behind Fernando- 24- but closer to Weber.

Quite the season.

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

so Andretti cuts ties to Kanaan. this is going to be a really interesting off-season for the IRL.

F1 - great season thusfar. I must admit I'm pulling for Weber now. I like the underdog on this one.

any thoughts on whether Schumi has straight away lost it, too old, or is the theory on tires believable?

 

[MattS]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

so Andretti cuts ties to Kanaan. this is going to be a really interesting off-season for the IRL.

F1 - great season thusfar. I must admit I'm pulling for Weber now. I like the underdog on this one.

any thoughts on whether Schumi has straight away lost it, too old, or is the theory on tires believable?

I can't believe that Andretti can't find a sponsor for TK. Personally I am wondering that once Seven-Eleven left if TK just didn't want to leave. It is painfully obvious that Andretti favors Marco and Danica, so why stay and do all of the work for two mediocre (at best) drivers.

I just read this morning that Indycar lost the Edmonton race for next year. What a mess that series is.



F1 is much more interesting than I thought it would be back in the summer. That RB has not run away from the field shows how dysfunctional the team is and how immature Vettel is.

Schumi....I think he has lost a step or two, but I think the real issue is that the Mercedes was not designed for his style and he needs some time to get adjusted to being back in the car. Remember that when he left the car still had traction control and treaded tires (yes, he's driven with TC and on slicks earlier in his career), plus lots of other aero differences. I think his improvement over the season has shown that he still has enough to be competitive.

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

I can't believe that Andretti can't find a sponsor for TK. Personally I am wondering that once Seven-Eleven left if TK just didn't want to leave. It is painfully obvious that Andretti favors Marco and Danica, so why stay and do all of the work for two mediocre (at best) drivers.

I just read this morning that Indycar lost the Edmonton race for next year. What a mess that series is.



F1 is much more interesting than I thought it would be back in the summer. That RB has not run away from the field shows how dysfunctional the team is and how immature Vettel is.

Schumi....I think he has lost a step or two, but I think the real issue is that the Mercedes was not designed for his style and he needs some time to get adjusted to being back in the car. Remember that when he left the car still had traction control and treaded tires (yes, he's driven with TC and on slicks earlier in his career), plus lots of other aero differences. I think his improvement over the season has shown that he still has enough to be competitive.

I had forgotten how much has changed in just the few years Michael was gone. I'm still hoping he can challenge for a title somehow some way in 2011.

and I agree this F1 season has been way more interesting (and fun) then I had anticipated going in.

Question on Vettel. Is it the consensus that he is better than Weber? or should I say better than weber in a Schumi vs. all his teammates at Ferrari and Benetton?

IRL - agreed on Kanaan. If Michael Andretti got his head out of it he'd have made TK, and Hunter-Reay top priorities. then he'd have to choose Marco as the 3rd. Danica at this point should be w/another team. no way in hell she's better than TK, and I'd argue she'd be the 4th best of the 4 that were on this team. *maybe* tied for 3rd w/marco

Edmonton is a big blow but I thought they were trying something different w/race sanction fees??? Edmonton organizers were put off for the request for more $

honestly, this shouldn't hurt them. if they want to be out west try Vancouver, or Portland again. or how about Seattle??? anything there? build an airport course?

 

[MattS]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Question on Vettel. Is it the consensus that he is better than Weber? or should I say better than weber in a Schumi vs. all his teammates at Ferrari and Benetton?

IRL - agreed on Kanaan. If Michael Andretti got his head out of it he'd have made TK, and Hunter-Reay top priorities. then he'd have to choose Marco as the 3rd. Danica at this point should be w/another team. no way in hell she's better than TK, and I'd argue she'd be the 4th best of the 4 that were on this team. *maybe* tied for 3rd w/marco

I don't Vettel is that much better than Weber. Better but not in the Schumi way.

One of the reasons I like AJ is he had no problem firing anyone if they weren't performing including if their name was Foyt. Michael could learn from that. TK and RHR were the best drivers on that team, hands down. If Andretti team was bad last season they are going to be much worse with out TK! Bank on it.

 

[Timothy A]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Edmonton gone....don't the promotors, the location/track and the IRL sign iron clad contracts? The IRL is totally nust if they are announcing a schedule based on handshakes between promotors and tracks. Just another tally in the "IRL is dying" column. I'm sure Bernard didn't schedule PBR events based on handshakes.

On top of that, Edmonton was a well attended, interesting track. Another tally in the "IRL is dying" column.

Schumi....He will be much better next year. His first year at Ferrari sucked too. His talent in the design/development of cars is not to be questioned. This year he hopped in a car developed for Button. Button is no Schumi.

TK....I read somehwere he's got a very solid deal brewing; he'll be back next year. Andretti Autosports was really dragging him down last year. Andretti should have cut Danica loose (she'll be leaving anyway), and kept TK. But anything to make anyone named Andretti look bad is ok with me. Keep it up Mikey.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Not sure what to make of Indycar, the business. They keep trying, but unless there's a major "reset"- it's too expensive for what you seem to get.

Which leads to Andretti Racing- the sad fact seems to be that Danica and Marco bring in money that Tony and RHR don't. I'm a huge RHR fan (for some reason- I'm really not sure why...), but his sellability seems to be limited. Great driver, though. But it's clear that Mike isn't Roger or Chip WRT bringing money to the team. So you got to stick with the drivers that pay the bills the best.

Vettel vs Weber. Vettel is a faster driver, but Weber is a better racer. I think.

Schumacher? Hard to tell- it does take him a while to adjust to the situation, and he's not getting any younger.

But these last two races should be good. IF Masa is in front of Alonso this Sunday, will he let Fernando by on his OWN TRACK? Do RBR and Ferrari have enough engines left to be competetive? Can Hamilton crawl his way back into the race after giving up so many points in previous races? Oh, go Lewis!!!!

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

holy chit. Abu Dhabi is going to kill. F1 hasn't been this good since the days of Senna/Prost/Mansell.

Button was eliminated but that's fine. We have 4 guys with chance
01 Fernando Alonso 246
02 Mark Webber 238
03 Sebastian Vettel 231
04 Lewis Hamilton 222

but given the points I think Alonso and Webber are the only ones w/a realistic chance. Vettel and Hamilton would have to hope Webber and Alonso crash out I think.

more F1 - have you seen these? Senna movie http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rn2AlUtiP8&feature=rec-LGOUT-exp_stronger_r2-2r-29-HM

Senna Top Gear episode
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_rJH9XVIQA part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kC9ZeCr5bEA&feature=related part 2

IRL -

I hear Vegas is now a done deal. I really hope they can come back and take some momentum from a flagging nascar. I'm starting to see empty seats and a level of abivalence toward taxicar now

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

What was interesting about the order, had Vettel and Weber swapped places, it would have given Weber a better chance of winning, but because of how they finish, if it's Weber/Vettel/Alonso in that order, Alonso wins. So Fernando is 3rd or better to clinch.

He's also got a freshish motor.

Hamilton has to pray for first corner carnage. Or some serious reliability problems. Which is too bad, since he threw the championship via some poor decisions...

And all this in a week!!!

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

What was interesting about the order, had Vettel and Weber swapped places, it would have given Weber a better chance of winning, but because of how they finish, if it's Weber/Vettel/Alonso in that order, Alonso wins. So Fernando is 3rd or better to clinch.

He's also got a freshish motor.

Hamilton has to pray for first corner carnage. Or some serious reliability problems. Which is too bad, since he threw the championship via some poor decisions...

And all this in a week!!!

now that I see the points again...Hamilton's only chance is for Alonso to fnish out of the points and Hamilton to win to give him 247 points. Red Bull would have to have an atrocious day as well. Too bad because Lewis is everybit as good as the rest of the top 3.

question: how many drivers have won WDC's with multiple teams? off the top of my head I can think of Schumacher, Prost?, ...Senna was all w/Mclaren, correct?

Alsono would join some heady company if he wins A. F1 title #3, and B. F1 Title's with 2 different teams

 

[Runsub5]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Exciting finish next week. Congratulations to Red Bull for winning the Constructors Championship. Niko Hulkenberg on the pole today! He did a very nice job of getting away at the start but unfortunately was holding up Fernando.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

question: how many drivers have won WDC's with multiple teams? off the top of my head I can think of Schumacher, Prost?, ...Senna was all w/Mclaren, correct?

Well, the obvious is il Maestro- Fangio. Alfa, Ferrari, Maserati, and Mercedes.

 

[Timothy A]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

I am amazed Red Bull didn't get Webber in front of Vettel somehow. I know they care about the constructor's title and not the driver's title, but all the crazed fans care about is the driver's title. That's all anyone remembers when it all said and done.

 

[Runsub5]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

I am amazed Red Bull didn't get Webber in front of Vettel somehow. I know they care about the constructor's title and not the driver's title, but all the crazed fans care about is the driver's title. That's all anyone remembers when it all said and done.

I think the driver's title really needs to be earned by the driver without the interference of team orders. Of course this assumes a level "playing field" (each driver is given a car capable of winning).

Anyone have any more info on the "holdups" in Sao Paulo? Really bizarre.

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

I think the driver's title really needs to be earned by the driver without the interference of team orders. Of course this assumes a level "playing field" (each driver is given a car capable of winning).

Anyone have any more info on the "holdups" in Sao Paulo? Really bizarre.

no information other than Jenson Button's car being threatened or something about him and 2 others escaping armed men.

bear in mind we have little info but I have 2 concurrent thoughts on this one

#1 - that's just utterly embarrassing to Brasil. Bernie should come out and say a boycot will ensue if security demands cannot be met
#2 - given our little information is it possible Button went to a **** part of town or his driver got lost? (if this is the case #1 goes right out the window)

 

[Timothy A]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

So SPEED is reporting Chevy will be getting into the IRL. Hopefully Penske doesn't go with them, I am severely anti GM. If that goes through, it would be a boost. Ford is doing quite a bit of great work on engines lately, I'd love to see them get involved. I'm severely pro Ford. But when Penske had GM and Newman-Haas had Ford, I was still a Penske guy.

 

[MattS]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

I hope GM (or anyone) comes on board with more engine choices.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Some interesting news about Lotus- http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/88127

Especially if you liked the LPS livery.

But, apparently the whole Lotus thing is very, very up in the air- between Group Lotus- the Proton owned car company, and Team Lotus/Lotus Racing- who were always the racing arm which was separate from the car company. Neither of which are the current Lotus F1 team- they have an agreement with one of the two for the name.

Well, apparently, the real owners of Team Lotus/Lotus racing have agreed to terms with I *think* the current F1 team, while Group Lotus wants to field the Reanult team- being Lotus/Renault. So, next season will be VERY interesting. Well- the off season will at least.

 

[MattS]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

So SPEED is reporting Chevy will be getting into the IRL. Hopefully Penske doesn't go with them, I am severely anti GM. If that goes through, it would be a boost. Ford is doing quite a bit of great work on engines lately, I'd love to see them get involved. I'm severely pro Ford. But when Penske had GM and Newman-Haas had Ford, I was still a Penske guy.

From the early reports it looks like you are going to have to suck it up and root for a Penske/GM partnership!

It's official...

Chevy to supply Indycar engines

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Thus endeth the 2010 Open Wheel Racing season!

Vettel took the win from pole, Hamilton took second, and Button 3rd.

IMHO, Ferrari blew the tire change call for Alonso, costing him the championship. He should have waited, and made sure he was far enough ahead of Rosberg and Petrov. Instead, he languished too far back to do anything that he had to do- remember, a 4th place finish (where he was before pitting) would have won it for him. And Vettel, Hamilton, and Button all managed to do that.

Hamilton didn't have anything more to win it- even though he had his times that he was faster than Vettel- IMHO, he wasn't going to pass Sebastian. And that SC restart was interesting- Vettel slowed so much to force Lewis to go off, and then he took off and was clear by 1.5 seconds at the restart. Oh, well- turned out not to matter anyway. In the post race interviews- you could see how dissappointed Lewis was, I think, and he saw how those two pad choices really runined the effort. Coulda, woulda, shouda.

Heck of a season. And now we get to look forward to next year.

I'm sure we'll keep this thread for the off season news. Of which I expect a lot from both F1 and IndyCar.