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Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Thus endeth the 2010 Open Wheel Racing season!

Vettel took the win from pole, Hamilton took second, and Button 3rd.

IMHO, Ferrari blew the tire change call for Alonso, costing him the championship. He should have waited, and made sure he was far enough ahead of Rosberg and Petrov. Instead, he languished too far back to do anything that he had to do- remember, a 4th place finish (where he was before pitting) would have won it for him. And Vettel, Hamilton, and Button all managed to do that.

Hamilton didn't have anything more to win it- even though he had his times that he was faster than Vettel- IMHO, he wasn't going to pass Sebastian. And that SC restart was interesting- Vettel slowed so much to force Lewis to go off, and then he took off and was clear by 1.5 seconds at the restart. Oh, well- turned out not to matter anyway. In the post race interviews- you could see how dissappointed Lewis was, I think, and he saw how those two pad choices really runined the effort. Coulda, woulda, shouda.

Heck of a season. And now we get to look forward to next year.

I'm sure we'll keep this thread for the off season news. Of which I expect a lot from both F1 and IndyCar.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

I'm elated with the F1 season, and intrigued w/Indycar's future.

F1 - great season but of the 4 contender's I'd have chosen Vettel 4th. I just think he's an arrogant and I don't like the way RBR favored him over Webber.

Hamilton...what could have been. Alonso...a real shot at history there. I hope he can get that 3rd title.

in the lead-up to this race and w/the news of the Senna movie I watched a ton of Senna tributes etc...

I'd like to ask the F1 afficioado's here...

what is/was the final conclusion on his accident?

in the early 90's I wasn't paying as close attention as I should have

I had thought there was a mechanical failure but the in-car gets cut-off and up to the point it cuts off you don't really see anything change in the car

there is the notion out there somehow that he commited suicide...I'd NEVER heard that theory put forth before...but some links I found recently people speculate that was the outcome, something he said over the radio just prior????

anyone who has read up on this more and can comment that would be great.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

solovsfett said:
in the lead-up to this race and w/the news of the Senna movie I watched a ton of Senna tributes etc...

I'd like to ask the F1 afficioado's here...

what is/was the final conclusion on his accident?

in the early 90's I wasn't paying as close attention as I should have

I had thought there was a mechanical failure but the in-car gets cut-off and up to the point it cuts off you don't really see anything change in the car

there is the notion out there somehow that he commited suicide...I'd NEVER heard that theory put forth before...but some links I found recently people speculate that was the outcome, something he said over the radio just prior????

anyone who has read up on this more and can comment that would be great.
Click to expand...

As far as I know, it's not actually setteled. The offical word, still, from Williams, is that he bottomed out on low pressure tires, and the broken steering shaft was from the accident. OTOH, the Italian prosecutor still maintains that a poorly welded steering shaft caused the problem, and still want to prosecute the Williams team.

But that's honestly the first I've ever heard of suicide.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Totally disappointed on the outcome of today's race. If it couldn't be a Ferrari win why did it have to be Vettel? Ugh. I think he acts like a cross between an arrogant SOB and a spoiled child. Heck, I would have much rather had Hamilton win the championship and I don't like him either but at least he act respectful and appreciative.

Can't wait for next season!!! Both in IRL and F1.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

alfablue said:
As far as I know, it's not actually setteled. The offical word, still, from Williams, is that he bottomed out on low pressure tires, and the broken steering shaft was from the accident. OTOH, the Italian prosecutor still maintains that a poorly welded steering shaft caused the problem, and still want to prosecute the Williams team.

But that's honestly the first I've ever heard of suicide.
Click to expand...

I'll have to dig around again for that link, it was some blog (from 2008??maybe) or something on youtube where the speculation was that the Senna family did not sue F1 due to the bloggers belief that it was intentional on Senna...I'd never heard that speculated anywhere else before. I remember he/she said something about the footage cutting out and some radio communication but like everything else like this it's something to be taken w/a huge grain of salt I suppose.

I think the link below is what started it and I started going to different sites based on that

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnGk19zVVRY&feature=related
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

MattS said:
Totally disappointed on the outcome of today's race. If it couldn't be a Ferrari win why did it have to be Vettel? Ugh. I think he acts like a cross between an arrogant SOB and a spoiled child. Heck, I would have much rather had Hamilton win the championship and I don't like him either but at least he act respectful and appreciative.

Can't wait for next season!!! Both in IRL and F1.
Click to expand...

100% agree. Just imagine what an insufferable *rick Vettel will be now. If Webber wasn't a #2 driver all-season due to favoritism he will most definitely be #2 for 2011.

let's get this silly season going!

Trulli to Nascar? Senna to Lotus? Kanaan to De Ferran racing? Rahal???
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

it appeared that the performance of the Ferrari cars of Alonso and Massa were not able to compete with Red Bull and Renault late in the season (especially Massa's). Hard to believe that Alonso finished so far back (7th?).
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Runsub5 said:
it appeared that the performance of the Ferrari cars of Alonso and Massa were not able to compete with Red Bull and Renault late in the season (especially Massa's). Hard to believe that Alonso finished so far back (7th?).
Click to expand...

It was the bad decision on when to change tires that mired Alonso that far back. He didn't have a big enough lead over the Renaults and Nico when he came in to pit. Then Petrov did a great job of keeping at bay.

As for the silly season...read this morning that Hulkenberg is out at Williams. My guess is that he doesn't have enough sponsor money to keep his ride.

I keep reading over and over that Rahal is going to get a "really good" ride for next season. Whom that it is for I haven't a clue.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

MattS said:
It was the bad decision on when to change tires that mired Alonso that far back. He didn't have a big enough lead over the Renaults and Nico when he came in to pit. Then Petrov did a great job of keeping at bay.

As for the silly season...read this morning that Hulkenberg is out at Williams. My guess is that he doesn't have enough sponsor money to keep his ride.

I keep reading over and over that Rahal is going to get a "really good" ride for next season. Whom that it is for I haven't a clue.
Click to expand...

the new rumor on Rahal is a 3rd car at Ganassi and that Chevy has something to do w/it...pushing american drivers or at least that was on indystar blog
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

MattS said:
Totally disappointed on the outcome of today's race. If it couldn't be a Ferrari win why did it have to be Vettel? Ugh. I think he acts like a cross between an arrogant SOB and a spoiled child. Heck, I would have much rather had Hamilton win the championship and I don't like him either but at least he act respectful and appreciative.

Can't wait for next season!!! Both in IRL and F1.
Click to expand...

I'm not totally disappointed with Vettel winning it all. I am of very German decent, so I root for my fellow Krauts on the F1 circiut. That's the only reason I started rooting for Schumi years ago, that andthe fact he had a Ford engined car, for a few years anyway.

Penske/Chevy - Ugh. After the bailout, my comtempt for GM rose to new levels, of which I did not know existed. I do think it's really good for the IRL to be able to have Honda vs Chevy.

I think it's great the 2 open wheel series went down to the last race to decide the title (yet again), but crapcar has to have a contrived system to artificially create suspense and excitement.

I agree Ferarri really screwed up Alonso. They know it's hard enough to pass, and teams with the F-duct were going to be impossible to pass on that track. To dump him that far back into the pack was suicide.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

solovsfett said:
the new rumor on Rahal is a 3rd car at Ganassi and that Chevy has something to do w/it...pushing american drivers or at least that was on indystar blog
Click to expand...

Dang. That would be a great ride for him! One would assume that Ganassi would be switching to Chevy's in 2012 then.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

MattS said:
Dang. That would be a great ride for him! One would assume that Ganassi would be switching to Chevy's in 2012 then.
Click to expand...

I doubt Ganassi would want the same package as Penske. And I doubt Penske would strongly encourage GM to get back in, then give his biggest rival the same package.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Timothy A said:
I doubt Ganassi would want the same package as Penske. And I doubt Penske would strongly encourage GM to get back in, then give his biggest rival the same package.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't think that Ganassi and Penske would not want to run the same package either, but according to the new rules all of the engines and chassis have to be available to all teams at the same cost. So theoretically Ganassi and Penske could run the exact same car. If Graham is going to come on board with Chevy backing as solovsfett stated then Ganassi certainly wouldn't run a Honda for him if he's still there in 2012.
 
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Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Timothy A said:
I doubt Ganassi would want the same package as Penske. And I doubt Penske would strongly encourage GM to get back in, then give his biggest rival the same package.
Click to expand...

I think Ganassi may be following Penske's lead a bit on this ...he (Penske) encouraged GM to hop in and will go w/their engines. I'm guessing Ganassi doesn't want to look foolish out of the gate if GM somehow ends up building a better engine (and Ilmor will be building them, forcing Honda to build in-house so that may be part of it)

again this was just speculation on indystar.com but quite a few of their rumors have turned out to be right on in the last few years.

btw - I also share your contempt for GM as far as the bailouts are concerned

that aside I'm betting Ford/Cosworth takes a look at this down the road, if anything just due to their rivalry w/GM and...weren't most of their most innovative ideas that wound up in production cars tested w/open wheel race cars first?

the 3rd manufacturer looking at this as a 2012 possibility is FIAT under either the Maserati or Ferrari name. now...FERARRI at Indy?!?!?!? posthumously realizing Enzo's dream???
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

MattS said:
I wouldn't think that Ganassi and Penske would not want to run the same package either, but according to the new rules all of the engines and chassis have to be available to all teams at the same cost. So theoretically Ganassi and Penske could run the exact same car. If Graham is going to come on board with Chevy backing as solovsfett stated then Ganassi certainly wouldn't run a Honda for him if he's still there in 2012.
Click to expand...

I don't understand the logic that Ganassi would add a 3rd car for Rahal if it forces him to use an engine he doesn't want to use. He really doesn't need Rahal, and with cost reductions that are coming in 2012, he really doesn't need GM's $$$ unless Target is telling him they are scaling back in 2012. I think Ganassi uses GM in crapcar, so it isn't like this is out of left field. I just can't believe Chip would want the same engine as Penske, unless of course he's convinced it will be the best option, as Solovsett has pointed out.

I don't think Maseratti/Fiat does ANYTIHNG for the series; in fact to me those names imply cheap ugly european crap. The pracing horse, on the other hand, would be HUGE for the series, mega-huge.
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Timothy A said:
I don't understand the logic that Ganassi would add a 3rd car for Rahal if it forces him to use an engine he doesn't want to use. He really doesn't need Rahal, and with cost reductions that are coming in 2012, he really doesn't need GM's $$$ unless Target is telling him they are scaling back in 2012. I think Ganassi uses GM in crapcar, so it isn't like this is out of left field. I just can't believe Chip would want the same engine as Penske, unless of course he's convinced it will be the best option, as Solovsett has pointed out.
Click to expand...

I think you are making too big a deal out of this. Remember back in the 90's both Ganassi and Penske used the same engine a lot (Chevy). My guess is that they would rather run the same engines and clearly be the top two teams fighting it right down to the wire for the championship, than running different engines and one of them be significantly better than the other.

I am guessing the solovsfett was correct and that with Ilmor leaving the Honda partnership that teams are worried about Honda's engine being not as good. It's not like Honda's F1 engine was anything good in the last few years in that series.

Timothy A said:
I don't think Maseratti/Fiat does ANYTIHNG for the series; in fact to me those names imply cheap ugly european crap. The pracing horse, on the other hand, would be HUGE for the series, mega-huge.
Click to expand...

I'm not sure if Fiat does anything for the series, but when the series is on life support they should take anything they can get. With that being said it does make some sense for Fiat to be interested given their ownership of Chrysler.

I think Ferrari coming into Indycar is a very long shot, but if it does happen....WOW it would be absolutely gigantic!! :eek:
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

Timothy A said:
I'm not totally disappointed with Vettel winning it all. I am of very German decent, so I root for my fellow Krauts on the F1 circiut. That's the only reason I started rooting for Schumi years ago, that andthe fact he had a Ford engined car, for a few years anyway.

Penske/Chevy - Ugh. After the bailout, my comtempt for GM rose to new levels, of which I did not know existed. I do think it's really good for the IRL to be able to have Honda vs Chevy.

I think it's great the 2 open wheel series went down to the last race to decide the title (yet again), but crapcar has to have a contrived system to artificially create suspense and excitement.

I agree Ferarri really screwed up Alonso. They know it's hard enough to pass, and teams with the F-duct were going to be impossible to pass on that track. To dump him that far back into the pack was suicide.
Click to expand...

The lack of a lead by Ferrari over the Renault's before the tire change was certainly a factor. However, Alonso was not capable of passing Petrov. He didn't have the car to do it. If he was capable of passing, he would have been making moves on Petrov. He showed no indication of having that ability. Felipe Massa's car was even worse. You may be correct in attributing the F-duct but I think it was more than that. I believe the F-duct is gone next year?
 
Re: Open Wheel Racing 2010...He's baaack...He's gone...

well this came out of left field


http://www.indystar.com/article/20101117/SPORTS01/101117023/Lotus-will-be-next-IndyCar-Series-engine-maker?odyssey=mod|newswell|text|Sports|p

Lotus?


....now I had been wondering who would stay w/Honda due to their having to build engines on their own now (which really may be a bigger change than some outside of indy think) but throwing Lotus in at the last minute here really throws "the monkey and the wrench" to quote mr. willis

this is awesome and perplexing simultaneously. I just don't know how Randy Bernard could have concealed any talks w/lotus this well...???

I'd heard rumblings of Fiat (as maserati, ferrari or dodge) then ford or audi but...


good job Randy B, that's all I can say right now!
 
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