Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

[Jimjamesak]

So this thing in Oregon- am I reading/seeing it right that they are protesting access to public lands?

Land that all of us as tax paying citizens all own?

They want to be able to have their cattle graze on this public land that they do not own.

They want free food for their cattle.

How is that not giving them some kind of welfare?

They are willing to kill people so that they can feed their cattle for free and sell it for a profit. That's what they are saying. I don't think I want to share my portion of the land so that they can make money. But that's just me. Pay for the cattle feed, and don't start fires.

These people truly believe the Government shouldn't own any land and that the land their cattle graze on was "rightfully theirs." I know this because this sort of delusional thinking is, unfortunately, quite common here in Alaska.

 

[Jimjamesak]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

Interestingly, the father and son at the center of this whole thing have turned themselves in.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

These people truly believe the Government shouldn't own any land and that the land their cattle graze on was "rightfully theirs." I know this because this sort of delusional thinking is, unfortunately, quite common here in Alaska.

If they want to buy it, that's fine with me. But I don't see why I should subsidize their cattle.

 

[Jimjamesak]

If they want to buy it, that's fine with me. But I don't see why I should subsidize their cattle.

Agreed, but for these people "buying it" ain't happening. That'd be admitting the Government owned it rightfully instead of "stealing" the land from them.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

Interestingly, the father and son at the center of this whole thing have turned themselves in.

Even the Hammonds want nothing to do with those morons -- it's like the WBC coming to your town to "support" you. No thanks.

When Sovereign Citizen types think you're loony tunes, you might want to check yourself.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

These people truly believe the Government shouldn't own any land and that the land their cattle graze on was "rightfully theirs." I know this because this sort of delusional thinking is, unfortunately, quite common here in Alaska.

They're garden variety thieves. They've built a whole f-ckstick ideology around it, but at root it's just stealing.

 

[Jimjamesak]

They're garden variety thieves. They've built a whole f-ckstick ideology around it, but at root it's just stealing.

Up here its less to do with cattle and more to do with hunting and fishing but it's the same end game: theft.

 

[bigmrg74]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

Block off the access road to them. Give them a week for something else going on to distract the Media. Fly in a couple of drones with tranq darts loaded up in them and put em all down and out for a couple of hours. Sweep in really quick to snatch them all up quick to process them. Personally, I would set it up to make them all think that they are getting abducted by space aliens, complete with the anal probing. have them coming in and out with little green men around. And then drop em off about five miles from a town with their colon packed full of multi colored lube. That would really fix their wagons.

 

[Slap Shot]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

So when does Y'All Qaeda get the boot from the Fed building?

 

[Kepler]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

So when does Y'All Qaeda get the boot from the Fed building?

They're kinda perfect where they are right now. They're isolated so the odds are low they'll hurt anybody, and every day they're in the news they demonstrate the delusional nature of the sovereign citizen / Posse Comitatus movement. Moving against them just turns them into martyrs. Let them stay out there -- it's well below freezing. Also, right now their sister-wives (daughter-wives?) are getting a well-deserved rest. Imagine what it's like to live with these jackoffs night and day?

But I'm all for messing with their minds. Lay down some chemtrails and maybe bring HAARP back on line. Fly some experimental aircraft over their heads. Buzz them with Hueys playing the Muslim Call to Prayer instead of the Valkyrie. Make it an X Files adventureland.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

Well, this is really going to help the discussion of immigration.

The mayor of Cologne has summoned police for crisis talks after about 80 women reported sexual assaults and muggings by men on New Year's Eve.

The scale of the attacks on women at the city's central railway station has shocked Germany. About 1,000 drunk and aggressive young men were involved.
City police chief Wolfgang Albers called it "a completely new dimension of crime". The men were of Arab or North African appearance, he said.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

So when does Y'All Qaeda get the boot from the Fed building?

I was thinking last night:

Armed take over of a building, threatening violence if they don't get their ways.

How is that not terrorism?

For that matter, these guys are breaking a lot of laws- and if they don't get prosecuted for it, this opens the path to armed protests.

As for land owning...

They claim nobody owns the land, which means that we can all use the land as we please- which means that we all "own" the land. Therefore, the government runs it- since they are a representation of all of us. I wonder how they would feel if a band of 4 wheeler riders came in and started harassing their cattle. It's free land- so if they can get free food for their crop, I should get free land to drive my vehicles. I'll make sure to hit the plants that their cow like to eat.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

I was thinking last night:

Armed take over of a building, threatening violence if they don't get their ways.

How is that not terrorism?

For that matter, these guys are breaking a lot of laws- and if they don't get prosecuted for it, this opens the path to armed protests.

As for land owning...

They claim nobody owns the land, which means that we can all use the land as we please- which means that we all "own" the land. Therefore, the government runs it- since they are a representation of all of us. I wonder how they would feel if a band of 4 wheeler riders came in and started harassing their cattle. It's free land- so if they can get free food for their crop, I should get free land to drive my vehicles. I'll make sure to hit the plants that their cow like to eat.

They're only following the example of the public servants with their no knock raids and martial law threats.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

They're only following the example of the public servants with their no knock raids and martial law threats.

Which examples would those be?

And how does that not make what they are doing terrorism?

Forcing change via violence or threats of violence....

Considering the scorn we place on people who have non violent protests over excessive police violence, where's the scorn here?

 

[Gurtholfin]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

I'm thinking this would be a great time for a little drone demonstration.


Yeah neck, how'd you're little arsenal work out for ya?

 

[Gurtholfin]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

Pretty amazing that this is being allowed to happen.

I guess it's just aw shucks, (cow)boys will be (cow)boys.


It's absolutely true that this would be looked at and handled differently if these were blacks or muslims.

And I'd want it handled the same regardless of who it is.


These people are armed and illegally occupying property that isn't theirs. The kid gloves treatment is questionable at best.

Can't believe that the feds backed down last time (with pops) either.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

These people are armed and illegally occupying property that isn't theirs. The kid gloves treatment is questionable at best.

Can't believe that the feds backed down last time (with pops) either.

From a pragmatic point of view, it's good to have them all in one place and far away from sane people.

 

[joecct]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

Why does the Federal government own the land in the first place? Should we/they?

As to the group in OR. Nobody gets in and if somebody leaves, they don't get back in. Eventually they'll run out of provisions and surrender.

Charge them with trespassing and possession of firearms at a federal facility. Then fine them and ignore them.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

Why does the Federal government own the land in the first place? Should we/they?

Here's a start.

Numerous management authorities governing the use of the public lands and their resources accumulated from the early 1800s to the mid-1900s — in fact, there were thousands of them. These disparate authorities often resulted in fragmented, inefficient, and sometimes inconsistent resource management. These laws applied not only to grazing and land disposal, but also to mineral leasing and mining, timber harvesting, homesteading, and other subjects. The result was rapid economic development of the growing nation, but also some very obvious waste of resources.

By the 1870s, enough perceived problems had emerged with land disposition that the first moves toward public land retention were enacted by Congress. There was a growing sense that many lands, because of either their great public value (as in the case of the lands that would become Yellowstone National Park) or their remoteness and apparent lack of value, should be held in the public trust. This shift in attitude was based on the notion that there was a legitimate national interest in the remaining unsettled lands, and that this interest would be best served by Federal ownership. The reservation of Yellowstone National Park in 1872, and the 1891 General Land Reform Act that created the forest reserves, formally marked this change in public and Congressional thinking. The next four decades saw reservation (by various means, from Acts of Congress to Presidential Orders) from private ownership of essentially all of the Federal lands now in existence in the lower 48 states.

tl; dr: Policy has evolved throughout US history to different mixes of private, state and federal ownership, based on the evolution of the national interest. It's an ongoing evolution and in the future the mix will no doubt continue to change to meet new challenges and requirements.

But a bunch of yahoos who want to steal public land whose value has been protected by taxpayer money and use it to make their own private profits aren't "evolution," they're just robbers, so ef them.

 

[alfablue]

Re: Nice Planet XI: Stop the World, I Want to Get Off!

Why does the Federal government own the land in the first place? Should we/they?

Good question, but what are the alternatives? If the ranchers want to use the land, buy it. Or at least do the proper procedures to settle it.

But why should we, as a country, provide ranchers free food for their cows? Much like why should we as a country, allow loggers to just cut down trees in public land to profit from? Does that also mean that oil companies should be able to freely drill for oil on public land? Or miners get minerals? They profit when we all, as a whole, "own" it?

Charge them with trespassing and possession of firearms at a federal facility. Then fine them and ignore them.

That's it? They act like terrorists and just get trespassing and possession of firearms?

If a person threatens another person and the original person is armed, that's normally treated more dimly than what you suggest. And these guys are doing it in an organized manner.

They are no better than terrorists, and should be treated as such.

When it all started, the beef they had could be looked at honestly, as it was peaceful demonstration. But they took it beyond free speech.

If people came to demonstrations with obvious weapons, when protesting over excessive use of force from the police, I really doubt they would be treated the same.