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College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

bronconick said:
Here's a take from a former Texas walk-on on how compliance is supposed to work.

http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2011/05/31/texas-football-and-institutional-control/
Click to expand...

Good to hear it put that way...I agree with the sentiment that it isn't impossible to monitor 85 people and it starts from the top. I have no idea if Texas is as clean as this guy says it is/was, but there are some basic aspects of leadership that you hear throughout the article that ring true. Expectations and accountability are not that hard to implement...if you have the desire to do so.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

Kepler said:
That's Oregon.
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There are probably more scholarship athletes in MAC football than men's and women's XC at every school in the country, so the money in total is not comparable...but you are right, for those who can earn it, a 4 year XC scholarship is worth $100-200k and Oregon, for some crazy reason, happens to attract a lot of them.;)

Typically, XC money is partial and often on a year by year basis...given the injury factor and the easily measured worthiness, a lot of kids don't see four years of XC scholarship money.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

Coach-in-waiting thing: Not a good idea.

The closest it's come to working was at Florida State, and that still had a year long battle over who got to pick the next DC since Andrews wanted out and ended up with Andrews' worst defense in 30 years and the 2nd winningest coach of all time responsible for +90% of winning seasons in school history being forced out in a public bloody mess because he was finally going to be classified as the figurehead he had been for most of the previous decade.

NCAA: Changed the rules to classify a HCIW as a head coach and limited their access to recruits to equal that of a head coach instead of an assistant
Texas, Maryland: Lost their HCIW's to other schools.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

pirate said:
Good to hear it put that way...I agree with the sentiment that it isn't impossible to monitor 85 people and it starts from the top. I have no idea if Texas is as clean as this guy says it is/was, but there are some basic aspects of leadership that you hear throughout the article that ring true. Expectations and accountability are not that hard to implement...if you have the desire to do so.
Click to expand...

I think one of the comments put it best in that you can't expect to stop the $50 handshakes between boosters and players or even the $500 ones, or if they get 15 wings at the bar for the price of 5. But cars, rent, guys claiming they were working and getting paid for it when they were actually in the gym? That stuff ought to be fairly easy to monitor.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

bronconick said:
I think one of the comments put it best in that you can't expect to stop the $50 handshakes between boosters and players or even the $500 ones, or if they get 15 wings at the bar for the price of 5. But cars, rent, guys claiming they were working and getting paid for it when they were actually in the gym? That stuff ought to be fairly easy to monitor.
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$500 is prostitution. An $85 dinner is a nice date and we'll see what happens.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

bronconick said:
Here's a take from a former Texas walk-on on how compliance is supposed to work.

http://barkingcarnival.fantake.com/2011/05/31/texas-football-and-institutional-control/
Click to expand...

I've got a couple of issues with his take on things.

They aren't just tracking 85 players. They're tracking several hundreds. It's not just football, but all NCAA sports at the school.

And most schools don't have 5 compliance people total, let alone 5 devoted solely to football. Either Texas is an outlier, or he was exaggerating for effect with that line. My guess is that most schools have an associate AD in charge of compliance, and one or two fulltime workers behind him, with 1 or 2 interns as well.

Edit: Texas appears to have 10 people in the compliance office - none of which say they're devoted solely to football. And a few of their titles suggest they aren't anything more than your typical 1-2 year "interns."

That said, i'm amazed by the size of their SID office. That's insane - they have separate photography and graphic design offices apart from the primary SID staff.
 
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Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

unofan said:
I
That said, i'm amazed by the size of their SID office. That's insane - they have separate photography and graphic design offices apart from the primary SID staff.
Click to expand...

Wow, you aren't kidding.

25 person SID staff is unreal.

We have four at the school I work at and that's unheard of for D-III for the most part.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

PrezdeJohnson09 said:
Wow, you aren't kidding.

25 person SID staff is unreal.

We have four at the school I work at and that's unheard of for D-III for the most part.
Click to expand...

We had 5 at Dartmouth - the head person, 2 fulltime assistants, an intern, and the administrative assistant who pretty much acted like a 5th SID on top of everything else. That was pretty typical for the Ivy League. Everyone helped out with football, otherwise we all had our own primary sport for each season and everyone was expected to help out with the ongoing ones (track, swimming, golf, tennis). Photography was almost always farmed out to 1 or 2 local photographers. The printing was farmed out as well, though we did most of our own layout and design. We did all our own website stuff.

I can't imagine a 25 person staff. I know most places have a person devoted to football and both basketballs - but Texas has a guy just for the football coach, and it looks like 4-5 others solely devoted to football. That's freaking insane.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

"I was disappointed, I was surprised and I felt badly about it," Delany said. "But I kind of reserve anger for my dog. I try not to get terribly angry.
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Not that I already didn't think Delany was a self-serving piece of ****, but there you go. Stop beating your dog because OSU cheats, *******.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

unofan said:
I've got a couple of issues with his take on things.

They aren't just tracking 85 players. They're tracking several hundreds. It's not just football, but all NCAA sports at the school.

And most schools don't have 5 compliance people total, let alone 5 devoted solely to football. Either Texas is an outlier, or he was exaggerating for effect with that line. My guess is that most schools have an associate AD in charge of compliance, and one or two fulltime workers behind him, with 1 or 2 interns as well.

Edit: Texas appears to have 10 people in the compliance office - none of which say they're devoted solely to football. And a few of their titles suggest they aren't anything more than your typical 1-2 year "interns."

That said, i'm amazed by the size of their SID office. That's insane - they have separate photography and graphic design offices apart from the primary SID staff.
Click to expand...

I would think the size of the compliance office would be the school's choice. Amherst may need fewer than USC...if a school's excuse is that 5 people can't do the job then they should hire more people, regardless of what the NCAA does or says. If your company makes paper plates and mine makes ammunition, I suspect I should have more quality control people. Maybe the big schools should have fewer people doing SID and marketing and more checking on who owns that 350Z.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

pirate said:
I would think the size of the compliance office would be the school's choice. Amherst may need fewer than USC...if a school's excuse is that 5 people can't do the job then they should hire more people, regardless of what the NCAA does or says. If your company makes paper plates and mine makes ammunition, I suspect I should have more quality control people. Maybe the big schools should have fewer people doing SID and marketing and more checking on who owns that 350Z.
Click to expand...

How much work does basic large item compliance have to be? I was just a regular student and had to register my car's make and model for a parking pass. They probably have special passes to get into the athletic building parking lots themselves. Get the list of athletes who have cars from that department, look for new cars on the list compared to the previous list you had, contact them and ask for documentation on how it was paid for. You don't need two dozen people working 40 hours a week to do that. Same with finding out where players off campus are living and working and how they're paying rent and how much they're being paid.

The NCAA only really punishes when you get to "Huh, so and so has a brand new $30,000 car, lives in an apartment that costs $1,800 a month, and his mom works in a grocery store and his dad is a steel worker." and the school takes zero interest in how that happens. They'll hit you on the nose with a newspaper and say No! for the little stuff, not actually do anything to your program.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

unofan said:
We had 5 at Dartmouth - the head person, 2 fulltime assistants, an intern, and the administrative assistant who pretty much acted like a 5th SID on top of everything else. That was pretty typical for the Ivy League. Everyone helped out with football, otherwise we all had our own primary sport for each season and everyone was expected to help out with the ongoing ones (track, swimming, golf, tennis). Photography was almost always farmed out to 1 or 2 local photographers. The printing was farmed out as well, though we did most of our own layout and design. We did all our own website stuff.

I can't imagine a 25 person staff. I know most places have a person devoted to football and both basketballs - but Texas has a guy just for the football coach, and it looks like 4-5 others solely devoted to football. That's freaking insane.
Click to expand...

That's slightly more than we had at Maine 20 years ago.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

bronconick said:
How much work does basic large item compliance have to be? I was just a regular student and had to register my car's make and model for a parking pass. They probably have special passes to get into the athletic building parking lots themselves. Get the list of athletes who have cars from that department, look for new cars on the list compared to the previous list you had, contact them and ask for documentation on how it was paid for. You don't need two dozen people working 40 hours a week to do that. Same with finding out where players off campus are living and working and how they're paying rent and how much they're being paid.

The NCAA only really punishes when you get to "Huh, so and so has a brand new $30,000 car, lives in an apartment that costs $1,800 a month, and his mom works in a grocery store and his dad is a steel worker." and the school takes zero interest in how that happens. They'll hit you on the nose with a newspaper and say No! for the little stuff, not actually do anything to your program.
Click to expand...

I don't disagree, my point is that I don't care if it is a lot of work, the school can't claim that it is too big of a job to do well. If 5 isn't enough then they should hire more...the idea that there are too many athletes is a copout, they know how many there will be, they can outline what their processes should be (how much you wanna bet these compliance people go to plenty of conferences and summits where they are supposed to be learning best practices?). I agree some of it seems like a repetitive task worthy of a work study checking a few computer printouts...regardless, if you are OSU and making tens of millions of dollars off football, you'd think you'd be able to hire enough people to make sure you don't go on the death penalty list.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

bigblue_dl said:
Good news! Every big10 fail is a win for all that is good in this world.
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icon14.png
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

RaceBoarder said:
Well, the B1G Ten effed up their conference title game... It'll be indoors at Indianapolis... Lame...

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=6628913
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Yeah, I can see the wisdom of having the first couple of years of it at Indy, but heck, they should at least give the game a few years and in a few other locations first before naming Indy to be the perminate host. Heck, if they wanted to just rotate it around indoor stadiums, there's at least 3 good locations for them to pick from, and 4 if you wanna stretch St. Louis in there and hope that Nebraska is good that year. Still, there's plenty of other good NFL stadiums that you could throw in there that would give you neutral site games. Green Bay, Chicago, Cleveland, Pittsburg, and even Cincinatti, Philly and Kansas City if you really want to stretch it out some.
 
Re: College Football V: Bowls Are Done; Carry On My Wayward Sons

bigmrg74 said:
Yeah, I can see the wisdom of having the first couple of years of it at Indy, but heck, they should at least give the game a few years and in a few other locations first before naming Indy to be the perminate host. Heck, if they wanted to just rotate it around indoor stadiums, there's at least 3 good locations for them to pick from, and 4 if you wanna stretch St. Louis in there and hope that Nebraska is good that year. Still, there's plenty of other good NFL stadiums that you could throw in there that would give you neutral site games. Green Bay, Chicago, Cleveland, Pittsburg, and even Cincinatti, Philly and Kansas City if you really want to stretch it out some.
Click to expand...

I don't think Indy is totally permanent, just 5 years.
 
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