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Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

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Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

dxmnkd316 said:
How can that possibly be a war crime to refuse to honor the checkpoint?
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As I understand it, the war crime would be putting up any type of barrier or checkpoint on the border between Northern Ireland and Ireland. That is a key part of the Good Friday Agreement. There is also the argument that the UK would be unilaterally denying access to the European Court of Justice and freedom of movement for all the citizens of NI that consider themselves Irish citizens. That was also part of the GFA. Citizens of NI were able to get a passport from Ireland (not a big deal since they were all Europeans) and this act would end that. The freedom of movement might be allayed if you have an Irish passport (applications for passports more than trebled in the 12 months after the referendum) but they would still be denied access to the Court.

No deal Brexit violates UK law, European treaties and the Good Friday Agreement (a legally binding international law) which is quite a trifecta. And BoJo and his pals are about to do it.

Kepler said:
What's the DUP switch about? Did they get a little sumthin sumthin under the table?
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I doubt it. They desperately want a deal - any deal - that they can at least claim abides by the Good Friday Agreement. As Juncker said yesterday, the risk of a no deal Brexit is palpable. If that happens not only will the island descend into chaos as The Troubles Part II kick off, but you're essentially jump starting the Unite Ireland referendum years earlier than it would otherwise happen. It is inevitable, but the current leadership of the DUP would prefer it happen on someone else's watch.
 
Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

ticapnews said:
As Juncker said yesterday, the risk of a no deal Brexit is palpable. If that happens not only will the island descend into chaos as The Troubles Part II kick off
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Why is this inevitable? Did the Irish get tired of having their children grow up with all their limbs?

Can't every woman in Ireland say, "We know you lads are morons but you're not getting another sniff, ever, if you start your bullsh-t again. So help me I'll pull the Polish plumber if it comes to it, and nár chuire Dia ar do leas thú."?
 
Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

Kepler said:
Why is this inevitable? Did the Irish get tired of having their children grow up with all their limbs?

Can't every woman in Ireland say, "We know you lads are morons but you're not getting another sniff, ever, if you start your bullsh-t again. So help me I'll pull the Polish plumber if it comes to it, and nár chuire Dia ar do leas thú."?
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"Some men just want to watch the world burn."

Or to quote another film: Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with guns.

If the checkpoints return, the UK will have to also build walls. Those walls will have to be guarded by men with guns - and targets on their backs.

Let's put it this way. Imagine you're a citizen of New York. How would you feel if one morning you woke up and there was suddenly a checkpoint between you and your job and that checkpoint was manned by members of the Alabama National Guard? And to make sure you had to go through that checkpoint, a giant wall had been erected.

Now, I suppose the UK and EU could decide not to build checkpoints and walls and have men with guns, but what's the point of a border if people and goods can just cross it freely? I guess both sides could decide to forgo the tax revenue they would collect when goods move from one entity to the other, but considering one of the main goals of Brexit is to abolish EU standards in the UK, it doesn't make any sense for the EU to have an open border with the UK that allows - for instance - chlorinated chicken onto the continent when it has been banned.

It sounds like the DUP is willing to accept a border in the North Irish Sea instead of between Ireland and NI - a move that was previously unacceptable because it would break NI from the rest of the UK when it comes to trade, freedom of movement, etc. But it would be preferable to a hard border on the island.
 
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Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

Sounds like things are not going well in court for BoJo and the Government.
 
Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

Day Three

Lawyers for former Conservative Prime Minister John Major will say the court shouldn’t believe Johnson’s public comments on his reasons for proroguing Parliament, even going so far as to say the court would be “naive” to do so. Johnson, who leads the same party, has long argued that he suspended Parliament to kick off a new domestic agenda, while his legal opponents say he did it to stymie the legislature ahead of Brexit.

In documents prepared for trial, Major’s lawyer, Edward Garnier, focused on the lack of a government witness statement to support its position -- something the judges have also questioned.

“The court is under no obligation to approach this case on the artificially naive basis that the handful of disclosed documents, the contents of which nobody has been prepared to verify with a statement of truth, should nevertheless be assumed to be entirely accurate and complete,” he wrote.
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The Lib Dems are now ahead of Labour.

The Liberal Democrats leapfrogged the main opposition Labour Party in a poll of voting intention published late Wednesday.

The party, which held its conference this week, has agreed to revoke Article 50 -- blocking Brexit -- if it wins the next election.

The YouGov survey for the Times newspaper saw Boris Johnson’s Conservatives unchanged on 32% of the vote, the Liberal Democrats on 23% -- up four points on the week before -- and Labour down two points on 21%.
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Even if the Court acts, BoJo says he may just prorogue Parliament again.

The government told the Supreme Court that it would still consider suspending Parliament a second time -- even if it loses the current case.

“Depending on the court’s reasoning it would still either be open or not open to the prime minister to consider a further prorogation,” according to the document, which was tweeted by opposition lawyer Jolyon Maugham.

This is a question that has been repeatedly put to government lawyers over the last two days. The government also said that it can’t reveal its position until the court has given a full ruling.
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EU negotiator Barnier to meet with Labour

EU chief negotiator Michel Barnier will meet Labour MPs Stephen Kinnock and Caroline Flint in Brussels on Thursday, after he asked to discuss their cross-party campaign to get a Brexit deal through Parliament.

“Despite the political rhetoric, much of the withdrawal agreement is not contentious, it was the lack of clarity over the future relationship which was the sticking point,” Kinnock said in a statement. Theresa May’s deal with the EU “provides a solid and realistic basis on which to build in order to reach a compromise that can pass in the Commons and avert a catastrophic no-deal crash-out.”

The politicians, who lead the “MPs for a Deal” group in Parliament, say they want the U.K. to leave with a divorce agreement and are trying to help broker one that can pass through the House of Commons.
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Expect a ruling from the Court next week

The Supreme Court will aim to announce its ruling on Boris Johnson’s suspension of Parliament “early next week,” President Brenda Hale said at the close of three days of hearings.

“None of this is easy,” she said. “We will have to decide what the answer is and we will have to decide one way or the other what the consequences are.”
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Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

Jimjamesak said:
Sounds like things are not going well in court for BoJo and the Government.
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It is becoming clear they have a tinpot dictator on their hands. The queen might have to step in because he might ignore Parliament AND the Courts.

Fortunately the queen has experience fighting dictators.
 
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Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: Unicorns aren't real.
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: How about a pony?
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: A white one, then?
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: Look, do you want a pony or not?
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: *sigh*
 
Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

ticapnews said:
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: Unicorns aren't real.
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: How about a pony?
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: A white one, then?
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: Look, do you want a pony or not?
UK: We want a unicorn!
EU: *sigh*
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Is this yours? It's great.
 
Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

ticapnews said:
It is becoming clear they have a tinpot dictator on their hands. The queen might have to step in because he might ignore Parliament AND the Courts.

Fortunately the queen has experience fighting dictators.
Click to expand...

Can she help us with ours?
 
Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

If you thought the Tories were split on Brexit, they got nothin' on Labour. It's pretty much a Civil War at this point. Deputy Leader Tom Watson narrowly kept his job yesterday when party leaders tried to oust him for saying the Labour Party was a Remain party. Leadership is very much a Brexit party, with most rank and file members wanting a new referendum. The next 24 hours has the potential to be explosive.

The only party that is united and sends a clear message to voters is the Lib Dems. Both Labour and the Tories are being ripped to shreds.
 
Re: Brexit - Should I stay or should I go??

Labour voted down the Remain option at the conference. It's bizarre. Speaker after speaker railed against Brexit and were applauded by the delegates, who then turned around and overwhelmingly voted to support "Leave with a deal"

So Labour still want that unicorn...
 
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