Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
Both. He had an unhealthy, obsessive hatred of her.
Both. He had an unhealthy, obsessive hatred of her.
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Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
- Thread starter Old Pio
- Start date
Proud2baLaker
Master of Science
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
I actually know a few women who were huge supporters of Hillary Clinton then when she didnt win the nom and McCain picked Palin they suddenly wanted McCain/Palin. And these women are fairly far to the left typically. It was rather discouraging to see people swing that far for what appeared to be no other reason than the plumbing.
I actually know a few women who were huge supporters of Hillary Clinton then when she didnt win the nom and McCain picked Palin they suddenly wanted McCain/Palin. And these women are fairly far to the left typically. It was rather discouraging to see people swing that far for what appeared to be no other reason than the plumbing.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
He gave the GOP response to something one night and it was one of the worst speeches I've ever heard.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0209/19283.html
Found it. 2010 State of the Union.
He gave the GOP response to something one night and it was one of the worst speeches I've ever heard.
http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0209/19283.html
Found it. 2010 State of the Union.
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
That's what I was remembering, too.
Well, that and his exorcism.
But we'll see. God knows the GOP could use a little diversity. And if he really is going to be a contender, I'd much prefer a smart competitor to a dumb one, given the high stakes and since with Dubya the country showed it is perfectly capable of electing a president whose belt doesn't go through all the loops.
That's what I was remembering, too.
Well, that and his exorcism.
But we'll see. God knows the GOP could use a little diversity. And if he really is going to be a contender, I'd much prefer a smart competitor to a dumb one, given the high stakes and since with Dubya the country showed it is perfectly capable of electing a president whose belt doesn't go through all the loops.
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Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
But: Does his inability to speak publicly really mean he's a "moron" or the "least intelligent" politician out there? Slick Willie could talk MTU into winning a hockey game, but I wouldn't call him highly intelligent.
But: Does his inability to speak publicly really mean he's a "moron" or the "least intelligent" politician out there? Slick Willie could talk MTU into winning a hockey game, but I wouldn't call him highly intelligent.
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
You wouldn't?
I'd put Clinton at the top of the list of modern presidents both for intellect and amorality. Beating out Nixon on either count really says a lot.
Very good point on public speaking vs intelligence, however. Reagan and all.
You wouldn't?
I'd put Clinton at the top of the list of modern presidents both for intellect and amorality. Beating out Nixon on either count really says a lot.
Very good point on public speaking vs intelligence, however. Reagan and all.
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Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
OK, bad example. But verbose and intelligent are different things. We were discussing whether or not Jindal is one of the least intelligent politicians ever, or could be fairly labelled a "moron", and the point was brought up that he can't give a speech. Which is irrelevant.
He's unelectable, but not stupid.
(unelectable to national office, that is. He does make a good small state governor from what I've heard)
OK, bad example. But verbose and intelligent are different things. We were discussing whether or not Jindal is one of the least intelligent politicians ever, or could be fairly labelled a "moron", and the point was brought up that he can't give a speech. Which is irrelevant.
He's unelectable, but not stupid.
(unelectable to national office, that is. He does make a good small state governor from what I've heard)
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Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
That combination happens a lot, unfortunately.
Why is he unelectable? I mean, he makes Dennis Kucinich look smooth, but a little makeup and partisan glasses can turn anybody into a he-man.
That combination happens a lot, unfortunately.
Why is he unelectable? I mean, he makes Dennis Kucinich look smooth, but a little makeup and partisan glasses can turn anybody into a he-man.
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
I can't think of the word right now, but nobody wants to go out for a beer with this guy. Plus, he's short, has no sense of style and can't do public speaking. It just would never happen.
I can't think of the word right now, but nobody wants to go out for a beer with this guy. Plus, he's short, has no sense of style and can't do public speaking. It just would never happen.
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
The wimpier-looking guy has lost almost every election since TV (which is a problem, since the wimpier-looking guy is usually the smarter one). Remember what TV did to Dukakis? It's probably cost plenty of excellent candidates who haven't even bothered to enter the ring. The old saw about FDR in a wheelchair.
The last guy who looked really awful on TV and actually managed to perversely use it to his advantage that I can remember is Paul Tsongas.
Kucinich sort of manages, too, but that's because we all want to jump his wife.
The wimpier-looking guy has lost almost every election since TV (which is a problem, since the wimpier-looking guy is usually the smarter one). Remember what TV did to Dukakis? It's probably cost plenty of excellent candidates who haven't even bothered to enter the ring. The old saw about FDR in a wheelchair.
The last guy who looked really awful on TV and actually managed to perversely use it to his advantage that I can remember is Paul Tsongas.
Kucinich sort of manages, too, but that's because we all want to jump his wife.
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Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
ew. Was she starring in a zombie flick here, or does she always look like her disease-ridden corpse was recently freed from an icy underwater tomb?
and could this thread get any further off track?
ew. Was she starring in a zombie flick here, or does she always look like her disease-ridden corpse was recently freed from an icy underwater tomb?
and could this thread get any further off track?
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
Zombie may get us back on track.
Too soon?
(I keeeed, I keeeed. Please don't accuse me of inciting violence...)
Zombie may get us back on track.
Too soon?
(I keeeed, I keeeed. Please don't accuse me of inciting violence...)
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
I take a brief break to steal some candy from babies and we wind up talking about Bobby Jindal. The question about his intelligence has been answered--one of the brightest guys around. As to that speech, it WAS horrible. But let's at least pretend to be fair. It was his first appearance on the national stage. Try to imagine how you'd react to making a speech for the first time, under those circumstances, on nationwide TV.
However, I recall an unknown governor of a southern state who made such a hash of his speech at a national convention it became somethng of a national joke--so much so that Carson invited him to appear on the "Tonight Show" to complete the speech and take some good natured ribbing about it. I'm sure many Americans, me included, figured this guy was "not ready for prime time." His name was Bill Cllinton and we sorta got HIM wrong. So be careful of writing Jindal off. This is a guy who got elected in Louisiana, for cripes sake, not exactly a bastion of progressive thought "well, I SUPPOSE ending slavery was a good thing." A state that repeatedly elected that charming rogue Edwin Edwards. A state that elected David Duke to the legislature. A state where David Duke ran for governor (and got hundreds of thousands of votes). A state with the most corrupt government this side of Albania.
Yet this brown skinned dude was able to be elected and has taken dead aim at the institutionalized corruption of that state and made some significant progress. I'm not predicting anything, he might be an interesting choice for VP (Cain/Jindal?) in '12, but that's about it. If he has national aspirations, he'd almost certainly have to run for the Senate because the MSM only cover hurricane stories out of Louisiana. But he's smart, honest, and gives off a sort of "Mr. Smith" vibe.
All I'm saying is don't underestimate this guy. He's already accomplished a great deal, and far exceeded the "conventional wisdom."
I take a brief break to steal some candy from babies and we wind up talking about Bobby Jindal. The question about his intelligence has been answered--one of the brightest guys around. As to that speech, it WAS horrible. But let's at least pretend to be fair. It was his first appearance on the national stage. Try to imagine how you'd react to making a speech for the first time, under those circumstances, on nationwide TV.
However, I recall an unknown governor of a southern state who made such a hash of his speech at a national convention it became somethng of a national joke--so much so that Carson invited him to appear on the "Tonight Show" to complete the speech and take some good natured ribbing about it. I'm sure many Americans, me included, figured this guy was "not ready for prime time." His name was Bill Cllinton and we sorta got HIM wrong. So be careful of writing Jindal off. This is a guy who got elected in Louisiana, for cripes sake, not exactly a bastion of progressive thought "well, I SUPPOSE ending slavery was a good thing." A state that repeatedly elected that charming rogue Edwin Edwards. A state that elected David Duke to the legislature. A state where David Duke ran for governor (and got hundreds of thousands of votes). A state with the most corrupt government this side of Albania.
Yet this brown skinned dude was able to be elected and has taken dead aim at the institutionalized corruption of that state and made some significant progress. I'm not predicting anything, he might be an interesting choice for VP (Cain/Jindal?) in '12, but that's about it. If he has national aspirations, he'd almost certainly have to run for the Senate because the MSM only cover hurricane stories out of Louisiana. But he's smart, honest, and gives off a sort of "Mr. Smith" vibe.
All I'm saying is don't underestimate this guy. He's already accomplished a great deal, and far exceeded the "conventional wisdom."
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Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
Illinois on line 1. They do not sound happy.
It's way too early to write anybody off. It's even too early to write off challenges to Obama from the left (and given the experience of Carter and Johnson, they will be strongly encouraged and maybe even materialize). The Republicans are in a position to have a very strong field because 1) it's anybody's ballgame, 2) Obama is perceived by them as a do-able target, 3) interesting things are happening inside the party as the Neocons give up the ghost, and 4) anything would be an improvement on last time.
Illinois on line 1. They do not sound happy.
It's way too early to write anybody off. It's even too early to write off challenges to Obama from the left (and given the experience of Carter and Johnson, they will be strongly encouraged and maybe even materialize). The Republicans are in a position to have a very strong field because 1) it's anybody's ballgame, 2) Obama is perceived by them as a do-able target, 3) interesting things are happening inside the party as the Neocons give up the ghost, and 4) anything would be an improvement on last time.
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
Yeah, Reagan was dumb enough to win in 93 states in two runs for the presidency. Another example of how easily bamboozled the American people are. You guys never understood him and never will. Besides, as we now know, he wasn't exactly all that stupid. Not as brainy as that insipid wimp Dukakis, but smart enough.
Yeah, Reagan was dumb enough to win in 93 states in two runs for the presidency. Another example of how easily bamboozled the American people are. You guys never understood him and never will. Besides, as we now know, he wasn't exactly all that stupid. Not as brainy as that insipid wimp Dukakis, but smart enough.
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ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
You've obviously never watched American Idol.
You've obviously never watched American Idol.
Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
Reagan was a masterful public speaker and that wasn't just the script that was put in front of him, it was him. He wasn't by any means dumb -- he was in fact extremely sly -- but he was intellectually lazy and incurious. I would kill for him to coach my football team, but I wouldn't let him write a book report for a junior high school class.
But nobody is allowed to say a word against The One, we know that. Conservajesus gave his life for us, you know?
Reagan was a masterful public speaker and that wasn't just the script that was put in front of him, it was him. He wasn't by any means dumb -- he was in fact extremely sly -- but he was intellectually lazy and incurious. I would kill for him to coach my football team, but I wouldn't let him write a book report for a junior high school class.
But nobody is allowed to say a word against The One, we know that. Conservajesus gave his life for us, you know?
XYZ
Smoking in the selection room.
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
Correct. He's beyond adamant. Absolutely convinced she will win Iowa and never look back. I contend that not only will she not win but that she'll fade faster then people expect. She's a lightning rod as is from what really amount to a smattering of comments...now take that and it expand it exponentially once she has to speak all day every day in situations that are all under the highest scrutiny. So far everyone on the right is her friend, but that changes the day campaign season begins and she'll get horribly exposed. Will never hold up -- even with GOP primary voters.
Correct. He's beyond adamant. Absolutely convinced she will win Iowa and never look back. I contend that not only will she not win but that she'll fade faster then people expect. She's a lightning rod as is from what really amount to a smattering of comments...now take that and it expand it exponentially once she has to speak all day every day in situations that are all under the highest scrutiny. So far everyone on the right is her friend, but that changes the day campaign season begins and she'll get horribly exposed. Will never hold up -- even with GOP primary voters.
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
You have a point about Illinois. I grew up in the Chicago 'burbs and wound up working in Baton Rouge after the AF. I felt quite at home. But the corruption in Louisiana, in many cases, is written into state law. And Edwin Edwards made no secret of his corruption. Before becoming governor he was a congressman from Crowley, in rice growing country. He was up to his neck in "ricegate" with a South Korean lobbyist named Tonsung Park. At one point Edwards, with a straight face, said he just couldn't remember a $5.000 cash bribe wrapped up in silk, that Park had given him (apparantly there were so many silk wrapped bribes he couldn't keep them straight). On "60 Minutes" Edwards was asked about the charge that he had offered to sell a seat on the state highway commissiion for 10 grand, he told Ed Bradley as he recalled it was only 5 grand. Finally, Edwards ramrodded a massive expansion of Tiger Stadium through the legislature (using general operating funds of the state--where else would THAT happen?) explaining that young LSU graduates needed a chance to get season tickets. Once the expansion was approved, Edwards' legislative honcho announced that as part of the deal, every state legislator had been given an option on 100 of those seats (translation: bribe). When asked about his many statements about helping out young LSU grads the guy said: "I lied."
When I was working in Red Stick the sheriff of West Baton Rouge parish (directly across the river from East Baton Rouge parish) was a repulsive, corrupt pig. In the real world this guy couldn't get a job shoveling sh*t. During one campaign he plastered the parish with billboards that said: "Jobs." He wasn't referring to jobs he had or would bring to the parish. He was refering to "Your" job, which you're going to lose if I'm voted out of office. Charming.
In Louisiana if you called the agriculture department for advice on what kind of tomatoes to grow in your garden, instead of sending you a pamphlet, you'd get five guys in a state truck lead by an agronomist, doing soil samples, water table measurements and other calculations. THEN they'd give you the pamphlet. Huey Long really set the standard here. He even ran the state when he went to Washington. O.K. Allen follwed Huey as governor and the joke was he was so under Huey's control that one day a leaf blew in the window and landed on his desk--and Allen signed it. Perhaps the textbook example of Louisiana corruption was the Sunshine bridge across the Mississippi during the administration of Jimmy Allen( who wrote "You are my Sunshine") a considerable engineering accompishment given that the river is a mile wide at that point, and the bridge connected two dirt roads.
It's a close call, but I'd say Louisiana wins.
Illinois on line 1. They do not sound happy.
It's way too early to write anybody off. It's even too early to write off challenges to Obama from the left (and given the experience of Carter and Johnson, they will be strongly encouraged and maybe even materialize). The Republicans are in a position to have a very strong field because 1) it's anybody's ballgame, 2) Obama is perceived by them as a do-able target, 3) interesting things are happening inside the party as the Neocons give up the ghost, and 4) anything would be an improvement on last time.
You have a point about Illinois. I grew up in the Chicago 'burbs and wound up working in Baton Rouge after the AF. I felt quite at home. But the corruption in Louisiana, in many cases, is written into state law. And Edwin Edwards made no secret of his corruption. Before becoming governor he was a congressman from Crowley, in rice growing country. He was up to his neck in "ricegate" with a South Korean lobbyist named Tonsung Park. At one point Edwards, with a straight face, said he just couldn't remember a $5.000 cash bribe wrapped up in silk, that Park had given him (apparantly there were so many silk wrapped bribes he couldn't keep them straight). On "60 Minutes" Edwards was asked about the charge that he had offered to sell a seat on the state highway commissiion for 10 grand, he told Ed Bradley as he recalled it was only 5 grand. Finally, Edwards ramrodded a massive expansion of Tiger Stadium through the legislature (using general operating funds of the state--where else would THAT happen?) explaining that young LSU graduates needed a chance to get season tickets. Once the expansion was approved, Edwards' legislative honcho announced that as part of the deal, every state legislator had been given an option on 100 of those seats (translation: bribe). When asked about his many statements about helping out young LSU grads the guy said: "I lied."
When I was working in Red Stick the sheriff of West Baton Rouge parish (directly across the river from East Baton Rouge parish) was a repulsive, corrupt pig. In the real world this guy couldn't get a job shoveling sh*t. During one campaign he plastered the parish with billboards that said: "Jobs." He wasn't referring to jobs he had or would bring to the parish. He was refering to "Your" job, which you're going to lose if I'm voted out of office. Charming.
In Louisiana if you called the agriculture department for advice on what kind of tomatoes to grow in your garden, instead of sending you a pamphlet, you'd get five guys in a state truck lead by an agronomist, doing soil samples, water table measurements and other calculations. THEN they'd give you the pamphlet. Huey Long really set the standard here. He even ran the state when he went to Washington. O.K. Allen follwed Huey as governor and the joke was he was so under Huey's control that one day a leaf blew in the window and landed on his desk--and Allen signed it. Perhaps the textbook example of Louisiana corruption was the Sunshine bridge across the Mississippi during the administration of Jimmy Allen( who wrote "You are my Sunshine") a considerable engineering accompishment given that the river is a mile wide at that point, and the bridge connected two dirt roads.
It's a close call, but I'd say Louisiana wins.
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Kepler
Cornell Big Red
Re: Arizona Congressman Gabrielle Giffords Apparantly Survives Assassination Attempt
Yeah, that's her real problem. For now, any time she's tripped up lying or showing off her lack of knowledge she cries for the right wing wahmbulance and they all come running. But the day that other righties want to drink her milkshake, her whole "stop the lefties from attacking me" persecution act is done.
I still think she can be a force because she has such a large number of purely blind followers. It's not that the guy thinks she could win the nomination that I find bizarre, but that he thinks it's a slam dunk. Hillary was 100x the candidate she is, and we saw what happened there.
Yeah, that's her real problem. For now, any time she's tripped up lying or showing off her lack of knowledge she cries for the right wing wahmbulance and they all come running. But the day that other righties want to drink her milkshake, her whole "stop the lefties from attacking me" persecution act is done.
I still think she can be a force because she has such a large number of purely blind followers. It's not that the guy thinks she could win the nomination that I find bizarre, but that he thinks it's a slam dunk. Hillary was 100x the candidate she is, and we saw what happened there.