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America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

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French Rage said:
Well fighting fire with fire may get you a result, and a result you "win", but in the end it's still not a result that does any good. There are a lot of concerned citizens out there with legitimate questions (and not just those opposed to the plan) and both they and the overall debate would gain from them getting a chance to ask those questions. Fighting fire with fire just gaurantees this escalates until it ends, and even if the pro-reform people somehow win that (I don't quite know how you judge the winner in a shouting match), in the end no one got their concerns answered, and probably a lot of people get pushed to one of the extremes when all they wanted was simple answers. You can point about who shot first but the result is still the same. I don't know what the magical middle line is between doing nothing on one hand or escalating the shouting match on the other, but I don't see the latter winning any more than the former.
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Point, French.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

French Rage said:
Well fighting fire with fire may get you a result, and a result you "win", but in the end it's still not a result that does any good. There are a lot of concerned citizens out there with legitimate questions (and not just those opposed to the plan) and both they and the overall debate would gain from them getting a chance to ask those questions. Fighting fire with fire just gaurantees this escalates until it ends, and even if the pro-reform people somehow win that (I don't quite know how you judge the winner in a shouting match), in the end no one got their concerns answered, and probably a lot of people get pushed to one of the extremes when all they wanted was simple answers. You can point about who shot first but the result is still the same. I don't know what the magical middle line is between doing nothing on one hand or escalating the shouting match on the other, but I don't see the latter winning any more than the former.
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I agree it should not be a shouting match, but quite frankly the amount of scare tactics and blatant lying that's involved in this debate is staggering.

That's ok though. That's what works. That's America today.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

ScoobyDoo said:
I agree it should not be a shouting match, but quite frankly the amount of scare tactics and blatant lying that's involved in this debate is staggering.
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Unfortunately, people tend to buy into negative ads more quickly than positive. Attack ads can be very effective in swaying opinion and/or distorting legitimate issues. All sides in this matter are culpable, and it's one more reason why the O-man should be taking a more decisive role in these debates and quit delegating his campaign promises to a bunch of congressional knuckleheads.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

Rimbaud said:
This just goes to show how great the health care is in this country! Imagine if we had adopted Obama's plan before this went down...this guy would still be in a wheel chair and probably on his way to the slaughter house to be put to rest.
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Actually, it turns out he doesn't have health insurance and is asking for donations. If only there were some sort of universal government program.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2009/...ttack-victim-has-no-health-insurance-(updated)

Wacky.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

When I think real news, I think DailyKos. Brilliant.

I can post somewhere that says he does have healthcare. But I won't, because it's from just as reliable a source as DailyKos.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

Red Cloud said:
When I think real news, I think DailyKos. Brilliant.

I can post somewhere that says he does have healthcare. But I won't, because it's from just as reliable a source as DailyKos.
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Good thing they linked to a legit paper then:

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/ne...7C2B91CFCB7B4D398625760D0008E6EA?OpenDocument

Brown finished by telling the crowd that Gladney is accepting donations toward his medical expenses. Gladney told reporters he was recently laid off and has no health insurance.
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Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

French Rage said:
Good thing they linked to a legit paper then:

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/ne...7C2B91CFCB7B4D398625760D0008E6EA?OpenDocument
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I guess that's why he was on the Dana Loesch show last night saying that he was covered under his wife's insurance.

Don't you just love half truths? THIS GUY HAS NO INSURANCE!

Shouldn't that possibly raise red flags? Someone who has no insurance isn't even in favor of the program? And yet, he was covered after all.

If he was in the purple shirt and was being beaten up by "the angry mob," Kenneth Gladney would be as famous as Rodney King today.
 
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Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

Red Cloud said:
I guess that's why he was on the Dana Loesch show last night saying that he was covered under his wife's insurance.

Don't you just love half truths? THIS GUY HAS NO INSURANCE!
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Well, you read the St Louis Dispatch article and tell me what conclusion you reach. He has no insurance himself and is accepting donations, that says to me he has no coverage; I don't automatically think "oh yeah his wife (because I automatically know he's married) has insurance!". Perhaps the St Louis Dispatch needs better reporters but I don't see anything remotely approaching attempt to mislead here.

Shouldn't that possibly raise red flags? Someone who has no insurance isn't even in favor of the program? And yet, he was covered after all.
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So no one has ever, in the history of politics, especially on the right, voted in a way that would seem contrary to their economic interest? I don't own a Ferrari; that doesn't mean I'm automatically in favor of a program to give me a free Ferrari.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

French Rage said:
Well, you read the St Louis Dispatch article and tell me what conclusion you reach.
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I once read in a newspaper that Dewey defeated Truman.

I once read in a newspaper that John Kerry was taking Dick Gephardt as his running mate.

I once heard on TV that Al Gore won Florida.

So no one has ever, in the history of politics, especially on the right, voted in a way that would seem contrary to their economic interest? I don't own a Ferrari; that doesn't mean I'm automatically in favor of a program to give me a free Ferrari.
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So if there were a program proposal like that, you'd probably be part of an angry mob financed by the auto dealers.

Please. I'm losing my faith in you.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

Red Cloud said:
I once read in a newspaper that Dewey defeated Truman.

I once read in a newspaper that John Kerry was taking Dick Gephardt as his running mate.

I once heard on TV that Al Gore won Florida.
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I'm sorry, I should have called up what's his face myself to see if he had any sort of coverage, because clearly him not having his own insurance and taking up a collection should have sent up a warning flag that a smoking gun was missing from the story.

So if there were a program proposal like that, you'd probably be part of an angry mob financed by the auto dealers.
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Huh? Yes, that's it, I don't agree with you so therefore I think everyone opposing the plan is a paid shill of the insurance industry. Thank you for completely missing my point that people can sometimes, for whatever reasons they choose, it's their opinion, have stances that seem to go against their economic interest.

Please. I'm losing my faith in you.
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Yeah, that'll happen when you make up stuff I never actually said.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

Overall this argument is a pretty pointless sidetrack based on one random comment that didn't relate that much to the main current of the thread. At the least the one in the other thread has some meat and potatoes in it.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

Another example of weasely knuckledraggers caught making up stories. I've got news for you righties. There's this thing out there called the In-ter-net. It even predates Al Gore! And on it, you see, people can quickly debunk BS and lies. That's why your party is swirling the bowl right now. :D

Red Cloud, I only hope you get paid for all this stupidity you post. :eek:
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

Red Cloud said:
This is awesome. Almost as awesome as that guy getting beat up.
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I don't find it awesome at all, it's endemic on the problems arising on both sides turning this whole debate into a trave-sham-mockery.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

Rover said:
Another example of weasely knuckledraggers caught making up stories. I've got news for you righties. There's this thing out there called the In-ter-net. It even predates Al Gore! And on it, you see, people can quickly debunk BS and lies. That's why your party is swirling the bowl right now. :D

Red Cloud, I only hope you get paid for all this stupidity you post. :eek:
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Quick run to the Daily Kos and get yer facts.
 
Re: America's Affordable Health Choices Act of 2009 - The USCHO debates

French Rage said:
Thank you. It's been my point the whole day.
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I guess that's why you're more concerned with the people who want to exercise their First Amendment rights without being worried about ending up in the hospital than with the ones who are causing that worry.

Rover, you are a pathetic piece of garbage. That is all I have to say to you. Pathetic.
 
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