2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

[jmh]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

That rules out Clarkson & North Dakota making the Frozen Four.

Don't worry, it's not like Clarkson was going to win a championship anyway.

 

[pgb-ohio]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

I can't emphasize enough how much fun San Antonio would be. Though travel would be an issue - it's not driveable for anyone really and it's surprisingly more difficult than one would think to get a direct flight.

Strongly agree with each of these points. Unfortunately the travel issues are very real and would appear to outweigh the potential fun. Repeating from an early post: Let's see how Tampa goes before we commit to another foray into the sunbelt.

There is the possibility they put it in the Alamodome and set it up as they did for basketball at the end of the field so no one would be that far away.

Another football stadium? Let's see how the FFFF goes next April before we commit to that.

IF both 2010 & 2012 yield fully satisfactory results, then MAYBE we're ready to take on the challenges posed by having the tournament in SA.

 

[moose97]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

The reason those seats are not available is because they're obstructed view - it's the same basic configuration as the New Orleans arena.

San Antonio's only realistic shot to get at the seating threshold is to hold the game in the Alamodome.

Here's the ATT Center for hockey:

All arenas these days can at least accommodate a 200 x 85 surface, as that's the standard for rock concerts, etc. But the ones built with basketball in mind first do not feel the need to have all the seats getting good views of the ice, since rarely would hockey tenants get that kind of attendance.

Hence, those arenas are non-starters.

Not. Going. To. Happen.

Exactly. You really can't just say {insert city} has an arena, how 'bout there? You have to know if it's a hockey arena, rather than a basketball arena. As an example, you couldn't pay me to go to the Gopher series at Target Center this season, as it is a basketball arena - and suffers from the same problems documented here - the ends of the rink will be shoved into the lower-bowl, and sight-lines will generally suck.

This, of course, greatly limits the available hockey rinks with a capacity the NCAA is looking for to host the FF. With that said, check out this (older - May 2009) blog post from CHN on the subject, evaluating just about every city possible.

 

[blockski]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

Exactly. You really can't just say {insert city} has an arena, how 'bout there? You have to know if it's a hockey arena, rather than a basketball arena. As an example, you couldn't pay me to go to the Gopher series at Target Center this season, as it is a basketball arena - and suffers from the same problems documented here - the ends of the rink will be shoved into the lower-bowl, and sight-lines will generally suck.

This, of course, greatly limits the available hockey rinks with a capacity the NCAA is looking for to host the FF. With that said, check out this (older - May 2009) blog post from CHN on the subject, evaluating just about every city possible.

Moose, it's not fair to lump the Target Center in with places like the AT&T Center.

Target Center doesn't have great sight lines for hockey, to be sure - but it's not nearly as egregious as the places like Conseco or AT&T where they essentially write off the upper deck.

 

[goldy_331]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

Moose, it's not fair to lump the Target Center in with places like the AT&T Center.

Target Center doesn't have great sight lines for hockey, to be sure - but it's not nearly as egregious as the places like Conseco or AT&T where they essentially write off the upper deck.

Yeah, Target is more like the Kohl.

 

[Greyeagle]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

Yeah, Target is more like the Kohl.

 

[BC/HE]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

The NCAA clearly has as it's first priority making money and keeping liability at a minimum. That being said we are confined to seeing the event being held in major or mid-major cities that have arenas big enough. Some of the largest cities even though they may be great to visit are expensive and the event would get lost in them. Unless they are desperate, planners in those places have other options to fill the seats and hotels. If a cornfield had a 20,000 seat arena they would go there because costs are low and selling out does not seem to be a problem with the 1 year in advance lottery system. But there are no such places. 18,500 looks like a minimum size to me. Slightly smaller in a low cost smaller city if the city is willing to make a lot of concessions. Hub cities for airlines such as Pittsburgh, Dallas, Denver, Atlanta, Minn-St.Paul and Chicago have an advantage as they offer nonstop service and cheaper airfares. Buffalo offers the most people a chance to drive and has very reasonable local bus service including express service to Niagara Falls for about $2.50. Who says the NCAA could keep most of the revenue if it were in Canada? They most certainly can't bring it all back across the border so as nice as Toronto or Montreal sound they may not be the revenue producer the NCAA wants. The only other driving force for the NCAA would be prestige and that is why NYC can have it if they want but not at any price. Boston which is a natural and is now spruced up a lot simply may not want it enough to put it's best offer forward. That is why as much as it should be in Boston it may not be. The east is long overdue for at least one and probably two of the bids.

So my quess: Pittsburgh 2013, Denver 2014 and either Buffalo or NYC in 2015

 

[dogs2012]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

You HE people amaze me. How the crap do you think that Pittsburg and Buffalo are centrally located cities? or the 58 or whatever D-1 hockey programs, almost half are west of Ohio. Stop thinking so single-mindedly and selfish and think about the reality of it. Yes, Chicago is a great idea. It's centrally located for EVERYONE. Not to mention the WCHA's average attendance for our 7th and 8th most attended teams is higher than your HE's best. Chicago, milwaukee, and places like Indianapolis would make good centrally located cities. Stop complaining about your 8 hour drive to Pittsburg. It would be at least 16 for us, who would produce more fans anyways.

 

[ScottK]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

You HE people amaze me. How the crap do you think that Pittsburg and Buffalo are centrally located cities? or the 58 or whatever D-1 hockey programs, almost half are west of Ohio.

33 out of 58 are located in PA, NY, NJ or New England. That's 57% right there.
I count 15 west of Ohio, 3 in Ohio, and 7 in Michigan, which is neither west nor east of Ohio. That's not "almost half".

So yes, for college hockey, Pittsburgh and Buffalo ARE centrally located.

 

[slurpees]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

Another football stadium? Let's see how the FFFF goes next April before we commit to that.

IF both 2010 & 2012 yield fully satisfactory results, then MAYBE we're ready to take on the challenges posed by having the tournament in SA.

Well my suggestion with respect to the alamodome would be to put the rink on the end of the football field so the back seats aren't as far away. Example:
http://rushthecourt.net/mag/wp-content/uploads/2009/03/alamodome.jpg
The sightlines for basketball were surprisingly good.

 

[Handyman]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

33 out of 58 are located in PA, NY, NJ or New England. That's 57% right there.
I count 16 west of Ohio, 3 in Ohio, and 6 in Michigan, which is neither west nor east of Ohio. That's not "almost half".

So yes, for college hockey, Pittsburgh and Buffalo ARE centrally located.

They probably don't teach geography or stats at UMDuh

Serious question...would Philly work in the same way Pittsburgh would?

 

[slurpees]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

You HE people amaze me. How the crap do you think that Pittsburg and Buffalo are centrally located cities? or the 58 or whatever D-1 hockey programs, almost half are west of Ohio. Stop thinking so single-mindedly and selfish and think about the reality of it. Yes, Chicago is a great idea. It's centrally located for EVERYONE. Not to mention the WCHA's average attendance for our 7th and 8th most attended teams is higher than your HE's best. Chicago, milwaukee, and places like Indianapolis would make good centrally located cities. Stop complaining about your 8 hour drive to Pittsburg. It would be at least 16 for us, who would produce more fans anyways.

1. Learn to spell the names of major cities before you go spewing BS.
2. You are aware Pittsburgh is significantly more centrally located to CCHA teams, and the drive from Boston is 550-600 miles, right? Not to mention from New Hampshire or Maine.
3. The ease of flying from Minneapolis to Pittsburgh and from Boston to Pittsburgh is virtually the same since PIT is a USAir hub.

 

[cetihcra]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

You HE people amaze me. How the crap do you think that Pittsburg and Buffalo are centrally located cities? or the 58 or whatever D-1 hockey programs, almost half are west of Ohio. Stop thinking so single-mindedly and selfish and think about the reality of it. Yes, Chicago is a great idea. It's centrally located for EVERYONE. Not to mention the WCHA's average attendance for our 7th and 8th most attended teams is higher than your HE's best. Chicago, milwaukee, and places like Indianapolis would make good centrally located cities. Stop complaining about your 8 hour drive to Pittsburg. It would be at least 16 for us, who would produce more fans anyways.

The geographic center of the D1 College Hockey Universe is located in Lake Huron, near Kincardine, Ontario....which, longitudinally, isn't very far from Pittsburgh, and slightly further from Buffalo -- basically due north of Cleveland:

Fun Link

r

 

[Red Cloud]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

The geographic center of the D1 College Hockey Universe is located in Lake Huron, near Kincardine, Ontario....which, longitudinally, isn't very far from Pittsburgh, and slightly further from Buffalo -- basically due north of Cleveland:

r

It's way easier to break down than that. Much like the North/South divide, historically, was the Mason-Dixon line separating Pennsylvania from Maryland, the division between East and West in college hockey is the border between Pennsylvania and Ohio. Call it the Mason-Parker line.

 

[mookie1995]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

I'd we can play a football house, f sa- it's NO or bust!!!

 

[cetihcra]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

It's way easier to break down than that. Much like the North/South divide, historically, was the Mason-Dixon line separating Pennsylvania from Maryland, the division between East and West in college hockey is the border between Pennsylvania and Ohio. Call it the Mason-Parker line.

haha, yeah -- it just so happens that the Mason-Parker Line (who plays left wing on that line!?!?) almost exactly aligns with said geographic center.



r

 

[CHFAN222]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

Let's just do it at Carrier dome in Syracuse.

 

[Nick Papagiorgio]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

Not to mention the WCHA's average attendance for our 7th and 8th most attended teams is higher than your HE's best.

If you add them together it is. Boston College and UNH both had more than the 6th best WCHA team in average home attendance.

NICE TRY, though, clownshoe. EAT IT!

 

[blockski]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

If you add them together it is. Boston College and UNH both had more than the 6th best WCHA team in average home attendance.

NICE TRY, though, clownshoe. EAT IT!

So, your best effort is good for the bottom half of the WCHA. Got it.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: 2013, '14, '15 Frozen Four Sites

Yeah, Target is more like the Kohl.

Oh, Lord...

I'm convinced that the third tier at the Kohl is the MAIN reason that there aren't more sellouts in Madison. Everyone who's been to a game up there knows it, and I won't buy a ticket to a Badger game unless I'm in the first two tiers.

If it weren't for the atmosphere, the Kohl Center would be in the running for one of the worst hockey venues I've ever been to. The situation with the corner seating is just as egregious.