P
Priceless
Guest
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
Be sure to mention that to the pro-NRA gun nuts.
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2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
- Thread starter joecct
- Start date
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Even those idiots would show more respect to the firefighters than you did.
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
Exactly how did I disrespect firefighters? I pointed out that even if they'd been armed to the teeth, they were still ambushed and would have been shot. Real disrespectful...
Exactly how did I disrespect firefighters? I pointed out that even if they'd been armed to the teeth, they were still ambushed and would have been shot. Real disrespectful...
mookie1995
there's a good buck in that racket.
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
being glib isn't exactly the tone one expects to see. "Merry Christmas"
being glib isn't exactly the tone one expects to see. "Merry Christmas"
Glib and political, even the NRA went silent for a few days after the SHES shooting out of respect for the people involved.
The tone of your post was more about making a political point than demonstrating any concern for the people dead or wounded. The offhand "oh yeah they'd still be shot" attitude warranted a response, in my estimation.
Since you felt it was fine to make the comment in the first place I wouldn't expect you to care about some feedback.
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
Good Lord, you people have been at this all week? If you'd have gone on a holiday long bender like I did, you'd be a lot happier right now.
But, lets recap the week that was...
1) Don't know if this is enough for a new show called Mormons Behaving Badly, but it looks like yet another Idaho Senator got lugged. At least this one wasn't trying to pick up men in the airport bathroom, but a DUI arrest seems strange for a man who proclaims to not drink because it violates his faith. Could we be seeing the umpteenth social conservative Republican hypocrite who talks the talk but can't walk the walk (at least not according to the arresting officers)? Nahhh....
http://theweek.com/article/index/238203/sen-mike-crapos-dui-arrest-the-fallout
2) Next, we can chalk up this week as the time when the House Speaker became officially useless. Now the orange skinned freak expects the Senate to take action, when in fact revenue items must originate in the House. If The Boner can't get it together and carry out the basic fundamentals to do his job, he needs to resign. Nothing would be funnier than seeing Cantor or Ryan have to swallow a tax hike that gets forced down their throat thanks to a previously GOP written law.
3)Finally, despite some wimpiness out of people like Sen Conrad who long for the country club Senate of yonder years where deals are made over a couple of rounds of golf and a couple more rounds of martinis, looks like Dems are forcing Obama to hold firm on tax policy. Furthermore, even idiot Harry Reid seems to have figured out the GOP's game, and refuses to bring up a bill unless the GOP Senate stops their whining and backs it too. As I said before, the GOP has no leverage. Come Jan 1st, the deficit is projected to go down trillions of dollars as tax hikes and sequestration kick in. Obama needs to insist on a stand alone bill if he wants rates for $250K and below to stay the same. That nets him about 2T in tax increases to lower deficit. Then I'd trade The Boner's offer of 800Bn in broadening the tax base for spreading around some of the defense cuts. That takes it up to $4T in deficit reduction on top of $1T already agreed upon from the previous round. Last bill trades entitlement reform for debt ceiling extention. Should be able to find another trillion there.
Good Lord, you people have been at this all week? If you'd have gone on a holiday long bender like I did, you'd be a lot happier right now.
But, lets recap the week that was...
1) Don't know if this is enough for a new show called Mormons Behaving Badly, but it looks like yet another Idaho Senator got lugged. At least this one wasn't trying to pick up men in the airport bathroom, but a DUI arrest seems strange for a man who proclaims to not drink because it violates his faith. Could we be seeing the umpteenth social conservative Republican hypocrite who talks the talk but can't walk the walk (at least not according to the arresting officers)? Nahhh....
http://theweek.com/article/index/238203/sen-mike-crapos-dui-arrest-the-fallout
2) Next, we can chalk up this week as the time when the House Speaker became officially useless. Now the orange skinned freak expects the Senate to take action, when in fact revenue items must originate in the House. If The Boner can't get it together and carry out the basic fundamentals to do his job, he needs to resign. Nothing would be funnier than seeing Cantor or Ryan have to swallow a tax hike that gets forced down their throat thanks to a previously GOP written law.
3)Finally, despite some wimpiness out of people like Sen Conrad who long for the country club Senate of yonder years where deals are made over a couple of rounds of golf and a couple more rounds of martinis, looks like Dems are forcing Obama to hold firm on tax policy. Furthermore, even idiot Harry Reid seems to have figured out the GOP's game, and refuses to bring up a bill unless the GOP Senate stops their whining and backs it too. As I said before, the GOP has no leverage. Come Jan 1st, the deficit is projected to go down trillions of dollars as tax hikes and sequestration kick in. Obama needs to insist on a stand alone bill if he wants rates for $250K and below to stay the same. That nets him about 2T in tax increases to lower deficit. Then I'd trade The Boner's offer of 800Bn in broadening the tax base for spreading around some of the defense cuts. That takes it up to $4T in deficit reduction on top of $1T already agreed upon from the previous round. Last bill trades entitlement reform for debt ceiling extention. Should be able to find another trillion there.
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
Ignore him. He's as bad as it gets when it comes to political discussions. No real substance, just smartass comments that gain us nothing. Even the hard left and hard right members of this board provide some intelligent discussion. Priceless offers none of that.
Ignore him. He's as bad as it gets when it comes to political discussions. No real substance, just smartass comments that gain us nothing. Even the hard left and hard right members of this board provide some intelligent discussion. Priceless offers none of that.
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
I'm sure Priceless is merely expressing the frustration that many people are, which is an inability for sensible stuff to get done because politicians are beholden to a relatively tiny interest group. You might think the NRA was some sort of kingmaker in US politics when in reality I'm guessing Obama didn't earn their support yet won the last two elections.
I'm sure Priceless is merely expressing the frustration that many people are, which is an inability for sensible stuff to get done because politicians are beholden to a relatively tiny interest group. You might think the NRA was some sort of kingmaker in US politics when in reality I'm guessing Obama didn't earn their support yet won the last two elections.
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
Wrong. The NRA is a relatively enormous (I'm assuming your comparison is to other political interest groups) interest group, in fact there is one theory that they may have cost Albert Gore Jr. the presidency by advertising against him heavily in TN and FL which turned out to be important states in 2000. They should not be dismissed or even taken lightly as far as special interest groups go. They have quite a bit of clout.
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
I sympathize with the knee-jerkers who just hate guns and want to ban them from sight whenever something goes wrong. It seems like a no-brainer if you never stop to think about what actually results. For a real-life test, see Australia or England (or even the Vancouver Asian-Canadian drug wars) for the horrible violence and crime waves that never stop growing once gun ownership is limited for the law-abiding people.
For a smaller real-world experiment, check out in the U.S. whether more mass shootings over the last 20 years have happened at sportsman's clubs/gun ranges, or at "gun-free zones" like, for example, schools. Get back to me when you find the answer.
I'll leave you with one clue: where do you think the murderers will find less armed resistance: at the sportsman's club or the school? The same thing results state or country-wide.
There's an old Louis L'amour saying from the 60's: "If guns are outlawed, only the outlaws will have guns." Still very true, as evidenced by the school shooting massacres we've seen result directly from "gun-free zones" around schools.
I sympathize with the knee-jerkers who just hate guns and want to ban them from sight whenever something goes wrong. It seems like a no-brainer if you never stop to think about what actually results. For a real-life test, see Australia or England (or even the Vancouver Asian-Canadian drug wars) for the horrible violence and crime waves that never stop growing once gun ownership is limited for the law-abiding people.
For a smaller real-world experiment, check out in the U.S. whether more mass shootings over the last 20 years have happened at sportsman's clubs/gun ranges, or at "gun-free zones" like, for example, schools. Get back to me when you find the answer.
I'll leave you with one clue: where do you think the murderers will find less armed resistance: at the sportsman's club or the school? The same thing results state or country-wide.
There's an old Louis L'amour saying from the 60's: "If guns are outlawed, only the outlaws will have guns." Still very true, as evidenced by the school shooting massacres we've seen result directly from "gun-free zones" around schools.
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
Would agree with this. The NRA punches way above its weight due to the fact that guns are the #1 issue for 10% (or whatever) of the US population...and that it can be easily legislated. Unfortunately this is just the scenario where the wishes of a small minority can overwhelm the wishes of the larger majority who are either nonpolitical or who place their top priority elsewhere.
Would agree with this. The NRA punches way above its weight due to the fact that guns are the #1 issue for 10% (or whatever) of the US population...and that it can be easily legislated. Unfortunately this is just the scenario where the wishes of a small minority can overwhelm the wishes of the larger majority who are either nonpolitical or who place their top priority elsewhere.
walrus
Wind up workin' in a gas station
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
I thought it was 4 million members but apparently quite a few sympathizers
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
So if you aren't a member, you disagree with them?
So if you aren't a member, you disagree with them?
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
Good point. They're advocating a majority position: That the U.S. Constitution properly grants the right to bear arms. There has never been a time when this was a minority view. I'm not a member of the NRA myself, but definitely would be again if I thought that right were in actual danger.
Good point. They're advocating a majority position: That the U.S. Constitution properly grants the right to bear arms. There has never been a time when this was a minority view. I'm not a member of the NRA myself, but definitely would be again if I thought that right were in actual danger.
This is stupid on multiple levels. For starters, wasn't there a shooting at Fort Hood a couple of years ago? Following your dumb theory, that shouldn't have happened, no?
Next, a 4M member large group shouldn't have most of Congress in its pocket. The NRA is a paper tiger. Give it a push and they'll fall over. It reminds me of the mythical all powerful tobacco lobby from a few generations ago.
They key to "gun control" or better stated, reducing gun related crimes (as opposed to accidental shooting which is a whole other discussion) is to give the professionals in law enforcement the tools to do their jobs. What does that mean? More cops in dangerous areas for one. As the 1990's experience of Boston and New York under Dem and GOP mayors respectively has shown, having police out on patrol cracking down on crime is the way to keep shootings down. Next, background checks on all gun sales and criminal penalties for illegal sales and possession. If you keep getting caught with illegal guns (which, before some idiot suggests it, doesn't only occur after a mass shooting. Timothy McVeigh was picked up on a gun posession charge right after the OKC bombing) you get serious mandatory time. Lastly, diagnosed mentally ill people lose all rights to purchase or possess guns. I'm not trying to criminalize mental illness by any stretch but unfortunately the stakes are too high now.
The assault weapons ban expired, it wasn't lifted by an act of Congress. The problem was the most corrupt Congress we've ever seen, the debacle that was the Tom DeLay run outfit that coincided with the atrocious Bush II Presidency, pandered to their special interest friends. For the record, even Bush II came out for the extension although one has to wonder how hard he lobbied for it.
The NRA reminds me a lot of the tobacco lobby. Banning smoking was "un-American" (sound familiar). Adults can do what they want, people will smoke anyway, blah blah blah. All this was propped up by the idea that anybody opposing them would be crushed politically. Well, it took awhile but where is the tobacco lobby today? As I think JFK once said, the enemy of the truth isn't the lie, its the myth. Back when the state of Mass was first considering banning smoking in bars and restaurants, the mythmakers were out in force, saying that all of these places would go out of business because most of their clientel were smokers. There were vision of stampedes of youngsters heading up to that hot spot of fun and late night activity - New Hampshire!
What happened? State banned smoking and business went up! Why? Because most people don't like breathing in deadly fumes and coming home smelling like @ ss because a few dorks wanted to smoke a pack in a desperate attempt to look cool.
So, with the NRA, all of the same mythmaking is there. 1) Don't oppose us politically. If they were so powerful, why do Dem Presidents keep getting elected? 2) People will get guns anyway. No doubt some will, but since we don't legalize murder because some people do it, why doesn't the same logic apply to illegal guns? 3) More guns is the solution. Why then is gun crime so much less in England which has banned them? Why is crime so high in Texas where presumably the gun culture dominates and so low in Mass where it doesn't?
dxmnkd316
Lucia Apologist
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
Lulz. You truly are hilarious.
Of course it expired, but why didn't they pass it again? Because the NRA had the political strength to make it unappealing to the Democrats in Congress.
The NRA doesn't care if Democrats are elected. They care about guns. Until they see a threat, they aren't going to oppose it.
Lulz. You truly are hilarious.
Of course it expired, but why didn't they pass it again? Because the NRA had the political strength to make it unappealing to the Democrats in Congress.
The NRA doesn't care if Democrats are elected. They care about guns. Until they see a threat, they aren't going to oppose it.
Re: 2012 Presidential Election - The Day after the Aftermath...
As usual, we've all retreated to our bunkers on this issue. I would offer one observation: the Constitutiion does not "grant" the right to bear arms, it recognizes it. The rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights are "inalienable," not gifts from government.
As usual, we've all retreated to our bunkers on this issue. I would offer one observation: the Constitutiion does not "grant" the right to bear arms, it recognizes it. The rights enumerated in the Bill of Rights are "inalienable," not gifts from government.
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