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World Soccer XXX: We Have Men Too!

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Jimjamesak said:
I don’t think these games were meant to instill confidence. I think it was more about trying out players who may have to be backups in case of injury between now and the World Cup while getting some minutes to others.

I honestly don’t blame them on this one though. The referee didn’t do anything to stop the Saudis from hacking down US players so the US players stopped trying to dribble through players about 30 minutes in. By the time Yedlin was taken out 60 minutes in you could clearly see them go “fuck this, I’m not missing the World Cup because I got hurt in a friendly.”
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And that may be...but it's still a bad look to score 0 against both. And while the other teams in our group have issues as well....Berhalter hasn't instilled confidence for a while. I get he wants possession and breaking down of the defense...but we seem to play much better and score more when we counter attack.
 
First Time said:
And that may be...but it's still a bad look to score 0 against both. And while the other teams in our group have issues as well....Berhalter hasn't instilled confidence for a while. I get he wants possession and breaking down of the defense...but we seem to play much better and score more when we counter attack.
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I don't get all this Berhalter hate, is it his fault that most of the better players have either gotten injured or fallen off the cliff form wise? Reyna and Pulisic are supposed to be the star players yet can't seemingly play more than two weeks at a time without getting hurt, Musah is the most important player in the midfield but is injured, Dest and McKennie have been terrible if they even get on the field, Miles Robinson was the best defender but blew out his knee, none of the goalies can seemingly get regular playing time, and Adams and Aaronson don't have any consistent performances week to week. Yet somehow it's all Berhalter's fault so let's fire him two months before the World Cup, that'll work out well!

Most of the players are under 25. They're kids, they're going to be inconsistent, especially as the coaching staff tries to piece together a lineup between all the injuries.
 
I never blamed him for injuries. I said the style he wants doesn't suit this team. They are much better and score more when they counter attack than when they try to play possession and break down the D. Yet it seems he keeps trying to force a possession game. I also never said he needed to be fired now...just that I don't have confidence in him doing much if he continues to force a style that doesn't fit these players.
 
First Time said:
I never blamed him for injuries. I said the style he wants doesn't suit this team. They are much better and score more when they counter attack than when they try to play possession and break down the D. Yet it seems he keeps trying to force a possession game. I also never said he needed to be fired now...just that I don't have confidence in him doing much if he continues to force a style that doesn't fit these players.
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So, again, I’ll say why is everyone complaining about “forcing a style” when for 10+ years everyone complained about the US “not having a defined style like other countries” and “we shouldn’t just be countering all the time”? Go back and look at the 2010 postmortem articles and you’ll see it all over the place. Now, the USSF has been implementing this for years (this isn’t just a Berhalter thing) and everyone complains that we should go back to the old style!

Look, the team is young and this World Cup should never have had high expectations for them. I get that people are still burned about 2018 but it’s a process and things are going to take time. Maybe don’t throw the baby out with the bath water because of results in friendlies.
 
Jimjamesak said:
So, again, I’ll say why is everyone complaining about “forcing a style” when for 10+ years everyone complained about the US “not having a defined style like other countries” and “we shouldn’t just be countering all the time”? Go back and look at the 2010 postmortem articles and you’ll see it all over the place. Now, the USSF has been implementing this for years (this isn’t just a Berhalter thing) and everyone complains that we should go back to the old style!

Look, the team is young and this World Cup should never have had high expectations for them. I get that people are still burned about 2018 but it’s a process and things are going to take time. Maybe don’t throw the baby out with the bath water because of results in friendlies.
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So we can't complain about anything...got it.
 
cF[Authentic said:
;n3758530]

They're the only one allowed to have thoughts on US soccer, because they reffed some games once.
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God forbid that some of us have watched the games and then look at the numbers and see that when they counter attack and lose the possession battle they actually do better, score more goals and create more chances. But no..we should keep forcing a style because in 2010 people wanted us to come up with a permanent one. Who cares if it works ..we have the built in excuse of being young
 
They start counter attacking and in three months everyone will complaining about them always counter attacking. Nothing will ever make the USMNT fan base happy, they could win the World Cup and people will find something to complain about.

They’re in a transition to a different style and it takes time. There’s no sense in abandoning it considering how well it’s working at the youth levels (or frankly the results even at the senior level). Yeah it may effect 2022 but has the potential to pay off huge in 2026. Be patient and stop looking at the micro level.
 
Jimjamesak said:
They start counter attacking and in three months everyone will complaining about them always counter attacking. Nothing will ever make the USMNT fan base happy, they could win the World Cup and people will find something to complain about.

They’re in a transition to a different style and it takes time. There’s no sense in abandoning it considering how well it’s working at the youth levels (or frankly the results even at the senior level). Yeah it may effect 2022 but has the potential to pay off huge in 2026. Be patient and stop looking at the micro level.
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I don't agree. It doesn't work with these players.
 
First Time said:
I don't agree. It doesn't work with these players.
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Ok, let’s completely throw out everything that’s been worked on for the last three years a week before the World Cup because it clearly isn’t working. It wasn’t working when they won the Nations League. It wasn’t working when they won the Gold Cup. It wasn’t working when they qualified for the World Cup.

Yup, let’s throw out three years of work because the internet didn’t like the results of two friendlies.
 
Jimjamesak said:
Ok, let’s completely throw out everything that’s been worked on for the last three years a week before the World Cup because it clearly isn’t working. It wasn’t working when they won the Nations League. It wasn’t working when they won the Gold Cup. It wasn’t working when they qualified for the World Cup.

Yup, let’s throw out three years of work because the internet didn’t like the results of two friendlies.
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It's not just two friendlies but go on with yourself again acting like you know everything on the soccer board and anybody else who has a disagreeing opinion with you is not allowed to have one.
 
First Time said:
It's not just two friendlies but go on with yourself again acting like you know everything on the soccer board and anybody else who has a disagreeing opinion with you is not allowed to have one.
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I'd be more inclined to listen to someone disagree if they offered something more than "I don't think it's working."
 
Jimjamesak said:
I'd be more inclined to listen to someone disagree if they offered something more than "I don't think it's working."
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Well I'd find the stat again if I could but I'm not able to...but it was something like they score a goal+ more and create two to three more chances per game when counter attacking vs this possession and break down style.
So the counter attack works better...yet he's force feeding this style and doesn't seem to have a plan B when it doesn't work...and I'm sorry...these players don't look good enough to play the way he wants to. I also don't agree that this Cup cycle should just be punted because we host in 2026.
None of these guys look like they're playing with any kind of confidence in either the system or anything they're doing right now. So when you no longer have any games before the cup starts where is that confidence going to come from? Where are these guys going to get the form and the trust In what Berhalter is doing if they can't show it here against teams that aren't likely to get out of their group?
ESPN had a stat that in the last 7 games against World Cup bound teams... We Have one win and have been shut out in the other six.
We have failed to score in open play in 8 of 12 games in 2022 and out of the 10 goals we have from open play...8 are against Grenada and Panama.
We're at our best when we use our athleticism to get behind the defense and create free kicks and dead ball situations...that's where we score and the system he's using is not set up to do that.
The big problem for me is a massive lack of confidence in these players and where they can get that from and a seeming willingness to force feed this and not change into a plan B when it's not working.
 
First Time said:
Well I'd find the stat again if I could but I'm not able to...but it was something like they score a goal+ more and create two to three more chances per game when counter attacking vs this possession and break down style.
So the counter attack works better...yet he's force feeding this style and doesn't seem to have a plan B when it doesn't work...and I'm sorry...these players don't look good enough to play the way he wants to. I also don't agree that this Cup cycle should just be punted because we host in 2026.
None of these guys look like they're playing with any kind of confidence in either the system or anything they're doing right now. So when you no longer have any games before the cup starts where is that confidence going to come from? Where are these guys going to get the form and the trust In what Berhalter is doing if they can't show it here against teams that aren't likely to get out of their group?
ESPN had a stat that in the last 7 games against World Cup bound teams... We Have one win and have been shut out in the other six.
We have failed to score in open play in 8 of 12 games in 2022 and out of the 10 goals we have from open play...8 are against Grenada and Panama.
We're at our best when we use our athleticism to get behind the defense and create free kicks and dead ball situations...that's where we score and the system he's using is not set up to do that.
The big problem for me is a massive lack of confidence in these players and where they can get that from and a seeming willingness to force feed this and not change into a plan B when it's not working.
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How much of that is actual counter attacking though? Most of the time they were "counter attacking" it was still off of a build up out of the back with multiple passes through the middle. And frankly, setting up to counter attack won't mean a thing when teams set themselves up in deep blocks like both Iran and Wales are almost certain to do. I mean, unless you want 90 minutes of "no, you have the ball" back and forth and a 0-0 tie.

And this isn't a style that only Berhalter wants, it's a style US Soccer wants. This goes all the way up to GM Brian McBride and Technical Director Earnie Stewart and all the way down to the youth levels around the whole country where the build out line exists (so yeah, "I have reffed a couple of games" actually gives me a sense of "I know what the fuck I'm talking about").

As for player confidence, one of the biggest things that frustrates me about USMNT discussions is that Berhalter is blamed for seemingly everything and no one ever blames the players. Maybe players shouldn't be keeping themselves in terrible club situations where they don't get any playing time. Maybe players should be held responsible for lack of fitness and/or form. Maybe players should be held responsible for doing stupid stuff on the field. Everyone is always quick to blame "the system" and no one ever seems to say "maybe our players are in terrible form because it was working a year ago".

For the goal scoring, this isn't a new problem and so many solutions have been tried yet nothing seems to be working outside of a mini good form run by Pepi and Pulisic finally waking up for a match. The strength of the team has always been defense and the injury to Miles Robinson has absolutely affected that.

Look, I can agree that things aren't going great and there are absolutely concerns, but I disagree that blowing up three years of work literally weeks before the World Cup is a good idea.
 
I'm sorry but what's the manager's job? Is it not to help get guys confidence and inform when their club levels aren't necessarily working out the way they're supposed to? A lot of players don't start for their club teams and end up on the national teams, I'd be willing to bet most players don't play the same style or position sometimes that they're going to play on the national team. Yes the players do have some responsibility for their form but if they also don't have confidence in the style they're going to be playing with the national team that's on the manager's it's not just the players.
And I'm not saying again for like the fourth time to just blow up everything and God forbid someone at US soccer actually comes up with a plan B in case the first one doesn't work...who cares if it's been 3 years. And your whole thing of... well it was working last year...great it was working last year against concacaf opponents, this is not concacaf anymore.
But when the numbers and the form bears out that this team right now plays better counter-attacking and off dead ball situations and you don't set them up to actually play that way and get results that way that's on the manager.
And of course Iran and Wales are going to park the bus they were going to do that anyway...it's up to the manager and US soccer to come up with a plan that's going to work against it... And when these guys right now can't break down a Saudi Arabia team that was playing second division players from Saudi Arabia... How are the players supposed to have any confidence that it's going to work against their group?
If you want to keep playing this position style and trying to get these guys to do that for 2026 fine... but you spent 3 years for this world cup cycle for a tournament that starts in 2 months and it doesn't work right now so come up with something else. You don't have to blow up 3 years of work for everything else if this is how you wanted to actually eventually play... But for this tournament it doesn't look like it's going to work so come up with a plan B for this tournament. That's not punting 3 years of work that's admitting that what you're doing isn't ready right now and it's not working right now. It's called having a plan B and not force feeding things and just going into a world Cup going it doesn't matter because it does
 
Personal favorite comments seen online:

”Berhalter should’ve been using the same starting lineup every game to allow them to gel!” with ”Gio Reyna has a strain and will be out 7-10 days” immediately below it.


Also, “players like Gareth Bale will absolutely torch our MLS defenders!” (Bale plays for LAFC and has two goals in 11 appearances this season).
 
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