Wisconsin Hockey 24-25 Improving With All Due Haste.

[srkbadger]

Hastings comes to Wisconsin and in his second season he's going to have to pull a rabbit out of his hat to have a winning season. He didn't all of a sudden forget how to coach hockey. There are serious issues with this team.

 

[digitalbooya]

UW is a second rate university for sports. Depressing.

 

[srkbadger]

UW is a second rate university for sports. Depressing.

The ladies' hockey and volleyball team would disagree.

 

[digitalbooya]

The ladies' hockey and volleyball team would disagree.

Sorry, Wisconsin is a second rate university for MEN'S sports. Better?

 

[solovsfett]

Jesus Christ. Honestly, the cupboard was NOT bare here. WTF is the problem?

 

[srkbadger]

As I said, Hastings hasn't forgotten how to coach. Things started to disintegrate in the post season last year. Some players jumped ship and I hoped some issues went with them. It seems it didn't. There are more than a few players that need to take a hard look in the mirror. I cannot understand why the success they had up until the last month of last season did not cement buy in with Hastings' system. What we're seeing this season wouldn't have been unusual to see at the start of last year. I really don't get it.

 

[solovsfett]

As I said, Hastings hasn't forgotten how to coach. Things started to disintegrate in the post season last year. Some players jumped ship and I hoped some issues went with them. It seems it didn't. There are more than a few players that need to take a hard look in the mirror.

Things disintegrated before that. Sometime After Milwaukee it appeared some players just straight up stopped buying in.

regardless, Hastings is getting paid handsomely not to go 1-5 with a ton of good players. It’s on him to figure this out quickly. I have a feeling this will be his first losing season. Which, if it comes to fruition it will be interesting to see how reacts to that.

 

[srkbadger]

They were vastly exceeding expectations up to that point. What could have possibly convinced them that they shouldn't keep following Hastings' lead and it would be better to start doing their own thing?

 

[WiscTJK]

Things disintegrated before that. Sometime After Milwaukee it appeared some players just straight up stopped buying in.

regardless, Hastings is getting paid handsomely not to go 1-5 with a ton of good players. It’s on him to figure this out quickly. I have a feeling this will be his first losing season. Which, if it comes to fruition it will be interesting to see how reacts to that.

Unfortunately with the Big7 teams this year being deep, I'm afraid you're right and this likely is his first losing season. I'm unsure what's going on, but this is getting uglier by the game.

 

[solovsfett]

They were vastly exceeding expectations up to that point. What could have possibly convinced them that they shouldn't keep following Hastings' lead and it would be better to start doing their own thing?

I wish we knew. Certainly the coaches will never divulge (as they shouldn’t) but damn…how terribly disappointing.

 

[solovsfett]

Unfortunately with the Big7 teams this year being deep, I'm afraid you're right and this likely is his first losing season. I'm unsure what's going on, but this is getting uglier by the game.

I hope I’m wrong but something has felt very off now for about 20 games or so (Milwaukee games forward to today)…it’s a tough job walking into a new job/place and bringing a new style
of play and bringing 4-5 of “your” guys with. Hastings has to not just navigate a new situation ( new city, new state, new school, etc) he has to play personality manager/psychologist with how he deals with the mix of players (his guys vs Granato’s, new style of play vs. old, etc)…I hope he can solve this. If he can’t, we’ll have to wait until the roster is 100% his which will be when? 2026?

 

[digitalbooya]

Jesus Christ. Honestly, the cupboard was NOT bare here. *** is the problem?

He did well with the full cupboard. Unfortunately, the cupboard left in the offseason. Five of the top 10 producers from last year either transferred or turned pro. This included the entire top line of Lucius-Silye-DSP and the top goal scorer (Bantle).

Before the “end of last season they played the same way” excuse bs goes too far, they were 9-5-2 after the Kwik Trip Holiday faceoff to the end of the regular season. They scored 51 goals in those 16 games (~3.2 goals per game) against primarily big ten teams. This team’s play is not even close to the same thing.

 

[solovsfett]

He did well with the full cupboard. Unfortunately, the cupboard left in the offseason. Five of the top 10 producers from last year either transferred or turned pro. This included the entire top line of Lucius-Silye-DSP and the top goal scorer (Bantle).

Before the “end of last season they played the same way” excuse bs goes too far, they were 9-5-2 after the Kwik Trip Holiday faceoff to the end of the regular season. They scored 51 goals in those 16 games (~3.2 goals per game) against primarily big ten teams. This team’s play is not even close to the same thing.

Yeah, except every coach deals with departures due to graduation or kids looking for greener pastures.

no excuses here. Granato and Oseicki didn’t just leave a stocked cupboard, they left a pipeline of recruits who most agreed were damn good.

so the question remains, WTF is happening here? And… why?

 

[Ditra]

I believe Tony's first year was pretty good and then it went where it went after that. Hasting's seems to be having that same second year dip. Meanwhile over in Mankato they split with Michigan, NoDak and swept Omaha. Maybe that recruiting accolade was not very accurate.

 

[Wisko McBadgerton]

Yeah, except every coach deals with departures due to graduation or kids looking for greener pastures.

no excuses here. Granato and Oseicki didn’t just leave a stocked cupboard, they left a pipeline of recruits who most agreed were damn good.

so the question remains, *** is happening here? And… why?

The greener pastures thing has obviously accelerated, so it's difficult to compare to the past. everybody is trying to figure it out yet.
In terms of pipeline, I believe several of those kids haven't or won't be coming here. At Mankato, Hastings has never recruited a player that has had more than a cup of coffee in the NHL. Just not the type of players he's recruited. Aged out Juniors capable of having minor league pro careers and keeping them until 25 (or 26?) are the bread and butter. I really didn't expect that to change dramatically here. That's perhaps illustrated by the high-end talent guys that didn't want to play here after last year. I don't expect many high-end talent guys to come here going forward.

So there's undoubtably a talent gap this year. As an example, and this is no judgement on Morrissey, he looks to be a guy that will develop into a nice player, but our top line center is a guy that was 7th in ppg on his own USHL team last year and had 3 points in 12 playoff games. Again, not judging his personal performance, but a freshman with those credentials is just not typically the top line center on a contending B1G team.

I sort of wondered vs. OSU if Finley didn't stand out so much because he's an all-American type, but rather because he's so much better than his own teammates.

There are not 16 games on the schedule of teams to just run over like there was in the New WCHA, so I suspect it might take a bit longer to get the Hastings formula to fruition here.

On the other hand, I expected to get swept by DU, so it's not really worse this week than last.

 

[Almington]

Yeah, so the question remains, *** is happening here? And… why?

This is not a unified team, it is just 23 players who all happen to wear the same uniform. I’ve seen better chemistry and cohesiveness from random players at a pickup game.

as for the why?

This is just pure speculation, but I’m guessing that the players don’t trust each other to be where they expect them to be and as such they are out of sync, slow to react, and are having to think to much.

now for wild, potentially reckless, speculation. What I’m guess happened last year is that Hastings first addressed the defensive issues and had great success. And the offensive results were residual from Granato and the highly skilled players. As Hastings tried to integrate more of his philosophy, chemistry slipped, resentment built, and the on-ice results cratered.

This past offseason, as many have pointed out, the highly skilled players who allegedly chafed under Hastings restrictions departed and while that may work out in the long term, it is leading to massive short term growing pains to start this season as the incoming and returning players are struggling to gel.

I fear this will be a frustrating and rocky season, but by the end of it let’s hope that it clear the arc is upwards.

 

[digitalbooya]

Yeah, except every coach deals with departures due to graduation or kids looking for greener pastures.

no excuses here. Granato and Oseicki didn’t just leave a stocked cupboard, they left a pipeline of recruits who most agreed were damn good.

so the question remains, *** is happening here? And… why?

We cannot move to answering the question because the question assumes a false premise. That is the issue.

Let’s look at the supposed cupboard/pipeline:

Finley - Granato
Morrissey - Hastings
Mosley - transfer/Hastings
Laskosky - transfer/Hastings
Fitzgerald - transfer/Hastings
Tassy - transfer/Hastings
Dyck - transfer/Hastings
Kukkonen - transfer/Hastings
Lindmark - Granato
Botterill - Hastings
Scholl - Granato
Horbach - Granato
Mehlenbacher - Granato
Pietela - Hastings

By my count, that’s 2 (maybe 3 with Horbach) Granato players in the top 9 and the rest are 4th line quality

What Granato recruits are left in the pipeline and have yet to arrive?

The issue is that Hastings needs to build up his recruits and establish a “way of life” so to speak. He cannot rely on transfers every year and not expect some volatility.

 

[solovsfett]

This is not a unified team, it is just 23 players who all happen to wear the same uniform. I’ve seen better chemistry and cohesiveness from random players at a pickup game.

as for the why?

This is just pure speculation, but I’m guessing that the players don’t trust each other to be where they expect them to be and as such they are out of sync, slow to react, and are having to think to much.

now for wild, potentially reckless, speculation. What I’m guess happened last year is that Hastings first addressed the defensive issues and had great success. And the offensive results were residual from Granato and the highly skilled players. As Hastings tried to integrate more of his philosophy, chemistry slipped, resentment built, and the on-ice results cratered.

This past offseason, as many have pointed out, the highly skilled players who allegedly chafed under Hastings restrictions departed and while that may work out in the long term, it is leading to massive short term growing pains to start this season as the incoming and returning players are struggling to gel.

I fear this will be a frustrating and rocky season, but by the end of it let’s hope that it clear the arc is upwards.

I agree with all of this. I just couldn’t encapsulate it as well as you have.

Ultimately, I believe in Hastings so if this is a losing season I’ll be unhappy but it will be for the best in the long run I think. Hastings’s track record is undeniable.

 

[digitalbooya]

I sort of wondered vs. OSU if Finley didn't stand out so much because he's an all-American type, but rather because he's so much better than his own teammates.

Counter observation: He tries way too often to deke or go through the other team than use his teammates to create opportunities. Teammates don't want to pass to him because they will never get the puck back. It's a microcosm of the team as a whole, but maybe overlooked due to his production.

 

[Almington]

I agree with all of this. I just couldn’t encapsulate it as well as you have.

Ultimately, I believe in Hastings so if this is a losing season I’ll be unhappy but it will be for the best in the long run I think. Hastings’s track record is undeniable.

While every situation is different, I see many parallels between the Granato-Hastings transition and the Sauer-Eaves transition in needing to dramatically shift the underlying culture of the program from something loose and ad hoc to something more deliberate and structured.

While Hastings has a track record of success, all of college sports is in a dramatic upheaval of the status quo that is no where near stabilizing to a new normal. Only time will tell if he can adapt as needed to find the right mix needed for success year after year. For the last 30+ years UW hockey has had one or two “good” years surrounded by mediocrity (or worse). What we all want is to play more games that matter in March and April.