Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

[OnMAA]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

One additional question specific to Kimball - it appears he was the recruiter at North Dakota the year that the Lamoreaux's decided to go to MN, and they came to ND the year after he left - this wouldn't be a great commentary if it were true.

That is a ridiculous argument to suggest some is a bad recruiter. The Lam twins were probably wooed by just about any team in the country and probably got the red carpet treatment everywhere. At the time UND was not even on the MAP in terms of competitive teams. Nobody knows what led the Twins to go to Minny, other then they themselves. I suspect that the fact they left after a year to come "home" had much more to do with their personal wishes/experiences after year one, rather than any coaching changes at UND. There are a lot of 19 year old's that have a change of heart after a year.

 

[Eeyore]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

I have no problem with valid and constructive criticism, however, as DC so eloquently said, tearing people down and saying they suck without any valid arguments, or arguments based on opinion rather than facts can lead to the good old "lynch mob" mentality. And by golly there have been plenty of examples on this board that got pretty ugly.

Wow. Overstate your arguments much? (Actually, yes, you do.)

No one said that Kimball sucks; any such comments are purely in your imagination. The original poster (not the one you are responding to here) did say that the Vermont program he has been a part of sucks. That's a debatable, although that original poster already retracted the comment. It's pretty hard to argue that Vermont has been bad for Kimball's tenure there; remember, every win or tie against a good team that someone cites means that, given their overall record, they lost an additional game to a bad team.

To suggest that, at this point, Kimball has something left to prove before being considered for a head coaching position seems eminently reasonable. Maybe he is amazingly impressive in person and could win an AD over in an interview, but all of the evidence available for us to consider says that he isn't at the top of the list of prospective candidates at this time.

 

[OnMAA]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Wow. Overstate your arguments much? (Actually, yes, you do.)

No one said that Kimball sucks; any such comments are purely in your imagination. The original poster (not the one you are responding to here) did say that the Vermont program he has been a part of sucks. That's a debatable, although that original poster already retracted the comment. It's pretty hard to argue that Vermont has been bad for Kimball's tenure there; remember, every win or tie against a good team that someone cites means that, given their overall record, they lost an additional game to a bad team.

To suggest that, at this point, Kimball has something left to prove before being considered for a head coaching position seems eminently reasonable. Maybe he is amazingly impressive in person and could win an AD over in an interview, but all of the evidence available for us to consider says that he isn't at the top of the list of prospective candidates at this time.

I was not the one suggesting someone be considered for a head coaching job, and won't go there. Doing that is a no win situation on this board. I was merely responding about people being torn down after someone put up a list. Have been pretty clear and consistent in the past wrt my opinions about posters tearing down people or their reputations. I will not veer from that conviction, whether you like it or not.

As far as overstating my arguments, I'll admit that my command of the English language may be poor at times, and may sometimes use the wrong or wrongly intended expression. I'll debate you anytime in two other languages and W'll see how long you last.

 

[Eeyore]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

I was not the one suggesting someone be considered for a head coaching job, and won't go there. Doing that is a no win situation on this board. I was merely responding about people being torn down after someone put up a list. Have been pretty clear and consistent in the past wrt my opinions about posters tearing down people or their reputations. I will not veer from that conviction, whether you like it or not.

You could at least be honest when you do.

As far as overstating my arguments, I'll admit that my command of the English language may be poor at times, and may sometimes use the wrong or wrongly intended expression. I'll debate you anytime in two other languages and W'll see how long you last.

Sorry, but this is a dodge. The problems with your post were not language related. They involved accusing people of saying things that they didn't.

 

[Call It]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Yet despite this they ended up at Minnesota. No matter how much wrangling the coaching trio of Idalski, Lewis, and Kimball did (and one has to assume short of a headlock there was a lot of wrangling) they failed in landing the dynamic (and occasionally reckless) duo.

Are you allowed to say that here, with out facts? When were the twins reckless?

 

[OnMAA]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Wow. Overstate your arguments much? (Actually, yes, you do.)

No one said that Kimball sucks; any such comments are purely in your imagination. The original poster (not the one you are responding to here) did say that the Vermont program he has been a part of sucks. That's a debatable, although that original poster already retracted the comment. It's pretty hard to argue that Vermont has been bad for Kimball's tenure there; remember, every win or tie against a good team that someone cites means that, given their overall record, they lost an additional game to a bad team.

To suggest that, at this point, Kimball has something left to prove before being considered for a head coaching position seems eminently reasonable. Maybe he is amazingly impressive in person and could win an AD over in an interview, but all of the evidence available for us to consider says that he isn't at the top of the list of prospective candidates at this time.

Me Overstate arguments.....Pot...Kettle...Black.

 

[Call It]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

As the poster of "VT sucks and will continue to thus he doesn't seem to recruit/ coach well", I have to think of the book "Don't sweat the small stuff". For what ever reason I have the same belief for Prov. College but wrote "PC isn't that good". Perhaps if I wrote that for VT than this thread would not have exploded. I wrote VT sucks based solely upon their record of 8-21-4 (A FACT DC78-82) and their previous records. I used poor judgement in words using "suck" and for that I am sorry.

I do not know Mr. Kimball personally and wish him no bad will. As for Hockey Coaching, the quote by Coach Wooden, "don't confuse activity with accomplishment" might describe VT season.

Really folks, I enjoy this board, it was a statement off the cuff. Lighten Up!

 

[OnMAA]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

You could at least be honest when you do.

I'm always honest. I made a small error by making the wrong third reference, does not make me dis-honest or imaginary.

At any rate that, was not the gist of my post. Your picking on one wrongly used adjective and ran with that to make your point.

They involved accusing people of saying things that they didn't.

Never accused anyone of anything. Did not name any names of posters, and the one name I did refer to was in a positive aspect. The gist of the post was to indicate that I don't agree with baseless ripping of reputations.

 

[ARM]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Isn't it hard to separate an assistant coach's contribution to a record? For example, Julie Chu was at UMD in 2008 when the Bulldogs won an NCAA Championship. She has been at Union as of late. My personal assumption is that a young coach like Chu would be getting better at this stage of her career, not worse. So do we say that she was a championship-caliber assistant at UMD and is now one of the worst assistant coaches out there because Union struggles? I don't think so. Coaches, like many others in sport, get too much credit when they win, too much blame when they lose, but the truth often lives somewhere in the middle.

 

[OnMAA]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Isn't it hard to separate an assistant coach's contribution to a record? For example, Julie Chu was at UMD in 2008 when the Bulldogs won an NCAA Championship. She has been at Union as of late. My personal assumption is that a young coach like Chu would be getting better at this stage of her career, not worse. So do we say that she was a championship-caliber assistant at UMD and is now one of the worst assistant coaches out there because Union struggles? I don't think so. Coaches, like many others in sport, get too much credit when they win, too much blame when they lose, but the truth often lives somewhere in the middle.

Well Put.

There is something else to consider as well. Some coaches are great in their role as assistants, but don't do so well as a head coaches.

 

[Call It]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Isn't it hard to separate an assistant coach's contribution to a record? For example, Julie Chu was at UMD in 2008 when the Bulldogs won an NCAA Championship. She has been at Union as of late. My personal assumption is that a young coach like Chu would be getting better at this stage of her career, not worse. So do we say that she was a championship-caliber assistant at UMD and is now one of the worst assistant coaches out there because Union struggles? I don't think so. Coaches, like many others in sport, get too much credit when they win, too much blame when they lose, but the truth often lives somewhere in the middle.

Good points.

 

[Blackbeard]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Well Put.

There is something else to consider as well. Some coaches are great in their role as assistants, but don't do so well as a head coaches.

Nor does it necessarily follow that great players make great or even just competent coaches.

 

[Blackbeard]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Nobody knows what led the Twins to go to Minny, other then they themselves. I suspect that the fact they left after a year to come "home" had much more to do with their personal wishes/experiences after year one, rather than any coaching changes at UND.

You couldn't be more wrong. Many people know what led them to UM or, maybe more acurately, why they didn't go to UND initially...they've explained it publicly...the UND program was in shambles...in the last season under the previous coach whose name escapes me (I think her first name was Chantale) their record at one point was 1-13. Their reason for going to UND was also discussed by them publicly...it was because the coaching situation had seemed to stabilize and as a result they then felt comfortable in fulfilling their aspirations as youngsters of always having wanted to play for UND...and certainly their life long ties to that community was the cherry on top of the whipped cream on top of the cake.

 

[brookyone]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

You couldn't be more wrong. Many people know what led them to UM or, more maybe acurately, why they didn't go to UND initially...they've explained it publicly...the UND program was in shambles...in the last season under the previous coach whose name escapes me (I think her first name was Chantale) their record at one point was 1-13. Their reason for going to UND was also discussed by them publicly...it was because the coaching situation had seemed to stabilize and as a result they then felt comfortable in fulfilling their aspirations as youngsters of always having wanted to play for UND...and certainly their life long ties to that community was the cherry on top of the whipped cream on top of the cake.

Shantel Rivard...and you're correct about the rest as well. The reason for not committing to UND at the time was not a mystery.

 

[Blackbeard]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Shantel Rivard...and you're correct about the rest as well. The reason for not committing to UND at the time was not a mystery.

Thanks...couldn't remember her last name.

I was following the program somewhat at the time and it was a complete mess...very sad state of affairs. She stayed on with the coaching staff the next year in a reduced capacity, as I recall, and then disappeared into the administrative end with UND seemingly being somewhat beholden to her and not wanting to make her walk the plank.

 

[brookyone]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Thanks...couldn't remember her last name.

I was following the program somewhat at the time and it was a complete mess...very sad state of affairs. She stayed on with the coaching staff the next year in a reduced capacity, as I recall, and then disappeared into the administrative end with UND seemingly being somewhat beholden to her and not wanting to make her walk the plank.

She ended up coaching girls high school hockey in Woodbury Minnesota shortly after leaving UND. Left that position pretty quickly too.

 

[Eeyore]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Never accused anyone of anything. Did not name any names of posters, and the one name I did refer to was in a positive aspect. The gist of the post was to indicate that I don't agree with baseless ripping of reputations.

Do you really think that just not putting someone's name in means that you haven't pretty directly accused someone of something when you quote their post? That's your excuse?

 

[OnMAA]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

Do you really think that just not putting someone's name in means that you haven't pretty directly accused someone of something when you quote their post? That's your excuse?

You accused me of Overstating much....Me thinks you are making a mountain of a mole hill due to a single word reference error I made in my post.

 

[OnMAA]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

You couldn't be more wrong.........their record at one point was 1-13. ........

You actually kind of agree with me....as I indicated in my post you reacted to....

The Lam twins were probably wooed by just about any team in the country and probably got the red carpet treatment everywhere. At the time UND was not even on the MAP in terms of competitive teams. .....

Me thinks the record of UND was the key motivator for not going there. Put yourself in their shoes. With their history of being on winning programs (SSM), and their desire to be the best they can be, would you go to A 1-13 program vs. a program with a winning tradition. Most would not. If I were in their shoes, I would go to a winning program, better chance of success and reaching your goals. Now you can debate that the losing record was due to a lack of coaching, but me thinks, the record of UND at the time was more of a motivator not to go there.

P.S....Just looked up the records. UND was 3-31 and 4-26 the two seasons prior to the season the Lams committed to UM. UM was 27-7 with several recent National Championships in their back pocket.

 

[ARM]

Re: Who goes first Lewis or Linstad?

P.S....Just looked up the records. UND was 3-31 and 4-26 the two seasons prior to the season the Lams committed to UM. UM was 27-7 with several recent National Championships in their back pocket.

It doesn't change your point, but that's not quite accurate. Minnesota was in the midst of a season that saw it go 23-12-1 and miss the NCAA Tournament the year that the twins verbally committed, after having finished 29-11-1 and reaching the title game the season before. Part of the reason that they chose Minnesota over Wisconsin was that they did want to be part of helping a team get to the top, not just remain there.