USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

[Eeyore]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

...and you have to admit UW has a decent barn too.

Most uncomfortable seats in the conference, which is quite an accomplishment with St. Cloud in the competition.

 

[Timothy A]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Most uncomfortable seats in the conference, which is quite an accomplishment with St. Cloud in the competition.

I've only had the pleasure of sitting in LaBahn's seats, do you mean to tell me there are better ones than those? Maybe I should not have had the same seats installed in my house that surrounding the tv? EGads!

 

[Timothy A]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Most uncomfortable seats in the conference, which is quite an accomplishment with St. Cloud in the competition.

I'm also standing so frequently to sieve the opposing goalie and yell at the refs over the glass I hardly notice them.

 

[ne7minder]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Most uncomfortable seats in the conference, which is quite an accomplishment with St. Cloud in the competition.

Nope, sorry but to my anatomy SCSU has the worst seats.

I think there was only one Minnesota native on the 2016 senior women's national team at worlds.

And that proves what? I'm not seeing a point.

Don't get me wrong, there are talented female players all over the country. Just not at the pure numbers of MN.

Exactly, its like complaining that too many hockey players come from Canada.

 

[KTDC]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

And that proves what? I'm not seeing a point.

I think the point was Hannah Brandt and Rachel Ramsey (for example) aren't good enough to play on that team

 

[ne7minder]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

The U16 level in Massachusetts saw two very good teams compete against Minnesota in April. And yes Minnesota was better. But there is a bias at USA Hockey that cannot be ignored.

That third sentence does not flow out of the first two.

I'd also disagree with your first sentence that Minnesota produces the best hockey players. They produce some of the best players and more of the best players, but other states have contenders for the best. I don't think the development is linear so you can't say "MN has 7.5 times the players so they should only have 7.5 times as many representatives at this level". There is a better chance of finding more exceptional players in a larger sample. Add to that the focus on the sport in MN that does not exist in any other state. As a comparison, my guess is the US has a lot more people running marathons than Kenya does but yet the Kenyans still have a tendency to cross the finish line first. If you were putting together a team of the best marathoners would you expect it to be staffed by more Americans based on numbers?

 

[agfire]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Its just too bad that there are players that do not get to attend because of the politics in USA hockey. I know of several players who were not afforded the opportunity because of geographical location and lack of name recognition. You must locate yourself in an area that is convenient to be seen by the USA people. If you do not have the means to do this, you are just out of luck. I do not argue that the girls who are there are not deserving, its just that the process is very skewed.

 

[ne7minder]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Its just too bad that there are players that do not get to attend because of the politics in USA hockey. I know of several players who were not afforded the opportunity because of geographical location and lack of name recognition. You must locate yourself in an area that is convenient to be seen by the USA people. If you do not have the means to do this, you are just out of luck. I do not argue that the girls who are there are not deserving, its just that the process is very skewed.

Names?
It is entirely possible to get overlooked given the limited resources USA Hockey puts into it. It is also possible that, if they are not playing top competition, they may look good only because of the opponents and trained eyes see that. There are a lot of possible reasons but if they are that good they might want to consider sending tapes and recommendations to USA Hockey asking for a look. Sort of like some elite players do with colleges.

 

[agfire]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Names?
It is entirely possible to get overlooked given the limited resources USA Hockey puts into it. It is also possible that, if they are not playing top competition, they may look good only because of the opponents and trained eyes see that. There are a lot of possible reasons but if they are that good they might want to consider sending tapes and recommendations to USA Hockey asking for a look. Sort of like some elite players do with colleges.

That is a great point. I guess then the next question would be are they willing to take a look? I guess that could work but then those girls need to take the initiative to put something together.

 

[Healthyscratch]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Look at the report below which was from an unbiased reporter who watched the semi final games. Quite a few Mass Eagles were mentioned. I think two of those mentioned made the 66 camp.
http://www.sbncollegehockey.com/wom...makenna-webster-presley-norby-gracie-ostertag


I think the common mistake being made is the assumption that the best girls are playing in the National tournament which simply is not the case. Yes, there are the SSM's of the world (but even they have some girls on their teams that would struggle making a 2nd line on some MN High School teams). Aside from those top tier 1 programs, there are plenty of fairly weak teams playing at Nationals where districts get an auto entry after playing a lousy 14 games. There are some districts that fielded very bad teams but were automatically in based on they were only team in their district.

I have spoken to numerous D-1 college coaches who have that same thought. National tournament is NOT the most talented. That is reserved for the NAHA type tournaments.

 

[Healthyscratch]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

That is a great point. I guess then the next question would be are they willing to take a look? I guess that could work but then those girls need to take the initiative to put something together.

Along the lines of my posts concerning the pure numbers and talent coming out of MN. The numbers speak. There are 130 Varsity girls high school hockey teams in MN and another 50 or so Junior Varsity teams. Not to mention 16U and 19U programs in areas that are not supporting a high school team.

Yes, I tend to agree that Mass runs in 2nd place (comfortably) with 90 teams or so at high school level but in other regions, there are very very few.

 

[Eeyore]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

When all your other sports suck you can dump a lot into a women's hockey program.......and you have to admit UW has a decent barn too.

Jealousy is so unattractive.

 

[giwan]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Along the lines of my posts concerning the pure numbers and talent coming out of MN. The numbers speak. There are 130 Varsity girls high school hockey teams in MN and another 50 or so Junior Varsity teams. Not to mention 16U and 19U programs in areas that are not supporting a high school team. Yes, I tend to agree that Mass runs in 2nd place (comfortably) with 90 teams or so at high school level but in other regions, there are very very few.

Iceland should have taught people it's not about population.

 

[Eeyore]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Iceland should have taught people it's not about population.

It's not just about population, but that does play a big role. There's a reason this was the first major tournament that Iceland had ever played in.

 

[giwan]

It's not just about population, but that does play a big role. There's a reason this was the first major tournament that Iceland had ever played in.

Right the population has been the same but they changed the culture. Indoor soccer fields at every school, qualified coaches at every level. Not population.

 

[Eeyore]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Right the population has been the same but they changed the culture. Indoor soccer fields at every school, qualified coaches at every level. Not population.

If you think population doesn't have anything to do with results, you're not paying any attention to overall outcomes, and are just cherrypicking one example to fit your hypothesis. Even then, it's not all that. Larger countries don't have to make the sort of investment relative to the population that Iceland has for soccer.

 

[giwan]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

If you think population doesn't have anything to do with results, you're not paying any attention to overall outcomes, and are just cherrypicking one example to fit your hypothesis. Even then, it's not all that. Larger countries don't have to make the sort of investment relative to the population that Iceland has for soccer.

Didn't say that, and yes the investment per capita must be greater. FYI Portugal 10m France 66m There are many examples

 

[Eeyore]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Didn't say that, and yes the investment per capita must be greater. FYI Portugal 10m France 66m There are many examples

There are many examples, but many, many more counterexamples. All of the ten most populous European countries made the final tournament. (Kazakhstan, at 11th was the most populous that didn't.) None of the five least populous that competed in qualifying did so. The 24 teams in France ranked 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 13, 15, 16, 17, 18, 21, 22, 27, 29, 30, 36, and 45, plus Wales (who would slot in at 34th) and Northern Ireland (who would be 40th). This is out of 54 countries that participated. If you don't look at those numbers and recognize that the size of the population is probably the most important factor in determining who made it, you're blind.

 

[giwan]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

There are many examples, but many, many more counterexamples. All of the ten most populous European countries made the final tournament. (Kazakhstan, at 11th was the most populous that didn't.) None of the five least populous that competed in qualifying did so. The 24 teams in France ranked 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 13, 15, 16, 17, 18, 21, 22, 27, 29, 30, 36, and 45, plus Wales (who would slot in at 34th) and Northern Ireland (who would be 40th). This is out of 54 countries that participated. If you don't look at those numbers and recognize that the size of the population is probably the most important factor in determining who made it, you're blind.

So California, Texas, Florida and Arizona should have more hockey players that MN. Really missing the point

 

[D2D]

Re: USA Hockey Womens U18 Select 66 Camp Invites

Along the lines of my posts concerning the pure numbers and talent coming out of MN. The numbers speak. There are 130 Varsity girls high school hockey teams in MN and another 50 or so Junior Varsity teams. Not to mention 16U and 19U programs in areas that are not supporting a high school team.

Yes, I tend to agree that Mass runs in 2nd place (comfortably) with 90 teams or so at high school level but in other regions, there are very very few.

Good article about how the community-based model for youth hockey has served Minnesota well, drawing a contrast with MA which has gone in a different direction. Although the article's focus is more on the boys, the story is the same with the girls.

http://www.letsplayhockey.com/onlin...el-at-core-of-minnesota-hockey-s-mission.html