USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

[dolphinlover]

decker and coyne were the best at the U18 level and fast forward four years later they are the best at the national level....other than poulin who else does canada have?

i love brianne jenner but she is not that player yet.....and seriously the jessica campbell comparison tells all about the dire situation of team canada women's teams...

Other than Poulin...oh let's see...Johnston, Spooner, Agosta. To name a few. Funny how a country with no player development still manages to win 4 straight Olympic golds. And this is where Chaffron will make excuses as to why the U.S. Didn't win

 

[Chaffron]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2015

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2015

omg please read better
are you aware that rebecca johnston is 26 years old?

team canada women from last world championships looked like a bunch of rink rats playing an efficient slick american team....i love their spirit and character but the coach needs to work with the team on speed and passing....honestly I thought the coach was totally outcoached and just not smart

for every Brandt or Pankowski or even a Trivigno there is not a canadian equivalent, maybe except Clark (at least the closest)....and if you try to match up a Brandt/Pankowski against a canadian equivalent the canadian player is older and slightly not quite as good

holy crap but alex carpenter is only 21 (!)
pray tell, but who in canada is an equivalent to alex carpenter (in age and ability)?

 

[dolphinlover]

omg please read better
are you aware that rebecca johnston is 26 years old?

team canada women from last world championships looked like a bunch of rink rats playing an efficient slick american team....i love their spirit and character but the coach needs to work with the team on speed and passing....honestly I thought the coach was totally outcoached and just not smart



for every Brandt or Pankowski or even a Trivigno there is not a canadian equivalent, maybe except Clark (at least the closest)....and if you try to match up a Brandt/Pankowski against a canadian equivalent the canadian player is older and slightly not quite as good

holy crap but alex carpenter is only 21 (!)
pray tell, but who in canada is an equivalent to alex carpenter (in age and ability)?

Know exactly how old Johnston is. Do you think she came out of nowhere? She was developed by Canada. I think the development cycle ebbs and flows for the 2 countries. Canada did a better job pre 2011 in player development and now the U.S. Is doing a better job. It has no bearing on results though. Just because you develop better players doesn't mean your team will play better. Otherwise why couldn't Carpenter, Kessel and Stecklein lead their team to victory in the Olympics?
That's the ultimate goal and until the U.S. can win one I think the question of player development is a moot point.

 

[BigFan]

Only reason Canada won last Olympics was superior coaching. An NHL coach(Dineen)versus college coach at Womens NCAA level. Look at the record in exhibition games prior to Dineens arrival.

 

[dolphinlover]

Only reason Canada won last Olympics was superior coaching. An NHL coach(Dineen)versus college coach at Womens NCAA level. Look at the record in exhibition games prior to Dineens arrival.

I agree the US was out coached at the Olympics but the rest of your post doesn't really prove your point. Look at the record in exhibition games after Dineens arrival....no wins

 

[Hello]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

So the Americans have a bunch of skilled players but still can't win the big one... Canada will be just fine, no need to compare talent. The U18 series was entertaining as was the Development series. When the next Winter Olympics roles around all hockey fans will get to see if the American's can find a way to win gold. On a side note, thank goodness for the state of Minnesota (hockey) in developing its players otherwise the American's may not be able to medal.

 

[dolphinlover]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

I think the developmental systems are different as well. The Americans always go for speed and skill. Even on the mens side they normally are faster and more skilled than the Canadians. I remember watching the 2010 Gold medal game and seeing how fast the US players were. Seemed like Canada couldn't keep up with their speed at times. The Canadians on the other hand go for power forward type of players and rely on agility and physicality and skill rather than blistering speed. It has been like this for years. And of course I'm generalizing here because there are players on both teams that are exceptions to this. Who's to say which developmental system is the better one? I just think both sides construct their teams differently. So yeah maybe Canada's women's team can't keep up with their American counterparts a lot of the time but they've proven that they don't need to in order to win

 

[Puckdrop14]

There is no denying the US' improved development program. They are producing star quality players in greater numbers than the Canadians. My take is that the Americans are in a great zone and the Canadians are not. It's a talent thing. Other than goaltending and a few up and comers, it could be a difficult 5 to 7 years for the Canadians. The top Canadian players are aging and replacements are not at the same level, not even close. I love Clark but if she is being dubbed as the next Hailey??? I don't know....

 

[Chaffron]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

There is no denying the US' improved development program. They are producing star quality players in greater numbers than the Canadians. My take is that the Americans are in a great zone and the Canadians are not. It's a talent thing. Other than goaltending and a few up and comers, it could be a difficult 5 to 7 years for the Canadians. The top Canadian players are aging and replacements are not at the same level, not even close. I love Clark but if she is being dubbed as the next Hailey??? I don't know....

yes
thank you
this is exactly what i have been saying....you are right, Clark is no Hayley....but unlike the rest of the rookies Clark was the only member who didn't look absolutely outplayed at last year's worlds, and probably Jillian Saulnier too

The top Canadian players are aging and replacements are not at the same level, not even close.

so true
sorry but kelly terry, rattray, and jessica campbell showed at last year's world championships they are not senior caliber players competitive to win gold against USA...fortunately they will be easily replaced by Wickenheiser, meghan agosta

Wickenheiser and Agosta are a frustrating creative combo for opponents and that is why team USA hates them so much

 

[pokechecker]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

yes
thank you
this is exactly what i have been saying....you are right, Clark is no Hayley....but unlike the rest of the rookies Clark was the only member who didn't look absolutely outplayed at last year's worlds, and probably Jillian Saulnier too

so true
sorry but kelly terry, rattray, and jessica campbell showed at last year's world championships they are not senior caliber players competitive to win gold against USA...fortunately they will be easily replaced by Wickenheiser, meghan agosta

Wickenheiser and Agosta are a frustrating creative combo for opponents and that is why team USA hates them so much

this is the difference between the US & Canada

we don't blame the players, we blame the coach (or elevate them to God like status if they win)
We are much more attached to our college team, you could see this at the game between the two teams in St Paul, the Canadian fans wore team Canada gear while the US fans wore their college gear.
Sure it is nice if Team USA wins, but it is more important that our college players make the team and play well, even the Canadian players.

The US won 40 gold medals at the summer games, winning gold in hockey just means they've beaten one good team, so it is no big deal.
Although it certainly was when they won it, nobody really watched or cared until after they had done it.

Even here in MN hockey is a second class sport.
Amanda Kessel retires, and the local media is unaware of it until after they are scooped by the Grand Forks newspaper. Scooped because they just don't care about it, it's a minor sport to them because it doesn't involve big bucks.
The basketball coach gets a $450,000 raise for winning only half as many games as he loses in a tenth place finish in the Big Ten. That raise is more than the entire women's hockey team staff makes for the year after winning 3 championships in 4 years.

Meanwhile Canadians dissect a loss in a series intended to develop young players that was only attended by the players parents ....
but hey, it's better than arguing about 90% of the things we argue around here, at least it's hockey.

 

[Supernaut]

this is the difference between the US & Canada

we don't blame the players, we blame the coach (or elevate them to God like status if they win)
We are much more attached to our college team, you could see this at the game between the two teams in St Paul, the Canadian fans wore team Canada gear while the US fans wore their college gear.
Sure it is nice if Team USA wins, but it is more important that our college players make the team and play well, even the Canadian players.

The US won 40 gold medals at the summer games, winning gold in hockey just means they've beaten one good team, so it is no big deal.
Although it certainly was when they won it, nobody really watched or cared until after they had done it.

Even here in MN hockey is a second class sport.
Amanda Kessel retires, and the local media is unaware of it until after they are scooped by the Grand Forks newspaper. Scooped because they just don't care about it, it's a minor sport to them because it doesn't involve big bucks.
The basketball coach gets a $450,000 raise for winning only half as many games as he loses in a tenth place finish in the Big Ten. That raise is more than the entire women's hockey team staff makes for the year after winning 3 championships in 4 years.

Meanwhile Canadians dissect a loss in a series intended to develop young players that was only attended by the players parents ....
but hey, it's better than arguing about 90% of the things we argue around here, at least it's hockey.

Too bad that you are 100% correct. Love the women's game much more that the men's. Canadian Hockey fans are like skilled surgeons when picking apart a hockey team. It's really all they have after free medical care.

 

[FiveHoleFrenzy]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

this is the difference between the US & Canada

we don't blame the players, we blame the coach (or elevate them to God like status if they win)
We are much more attached to our college team, you could see this at the game between the two teams in St Paul, the Canadian fans wore team Canada gear while the US fans wore their college gear.
Sure it is nice if Team USA wins, but it is more important that our college players make the team and play well, even the Canadian players.

The US won 40 gold medals at the summer games, winning gold in hockey just means they've beaten one good team, so it is no big deal.
Although it certainly was when they won it, nobody really watched or cared until after they had done it.

Even here in MN hockey is a second class sport.
Amanda Kessel retires, and the local media is unaware of it until after they are scooped by the Grand Forks newspaper. Scooped because they just don't care about it, it's a minor sport to them because it doesn't involve big bucks.
The basketball coach gets a $450,000 raise for winning only half as many games as he loses in a tenth place finish in the Big Ten. That raise is more than the entire women's hockey team staff makes for the year after winning 3 championships in 4 years.

Meanwhile Canadians dissect a loss in a series intended to develop young players that was only attended by the players parents ....
but hey, it's better than arguing about 90% of the things we argue around here, at least it's hockey.

Good post although this seems like something that is a bit tamed down for you. Like you have gone through a twelve-step rehabilitation program for caustic posters or some such thing.

 

[pokechecker]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

Good post although this seems like something that is a bit tamed down for you. Like you have gone through a twelve-step rehabilitation program for caustic posters or some such thing.

yes, the program is very good, they might even be good enough to help shelfit & a few others around here without going the lobotomy route that TTT had to take

probably a better demonstration of my point
at the game in StP, the most visible sports apparel was the shirt for Anne Schleper, it may even have outnumbered the U of MN apparel

 

[Chaffron]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

this is the difference between the US & Canada

we don't blame the players, we blame the coach (or elevate them to God like status if they win)
We are much more attached to our college team, you could see this at the game between the two teams in St Paul, the Canadian fans wore team Canada gear while the US fans wore their college gear.
Sure it is nice if Team USA wins, but it is more important that our college players make the team and play well, even the Canadian players.

meanwhile CIS fans dump drinks on the head of Hayley Wickenheiser during game, throw things at her on ice, shout obscenities and display obscenity laden signs to her face, gets heckled by parents of opposing players even getting jeered by parent of other team's kid outside dressing room

although obviously this is a special case of a caliber of player as her...and most of this stuff happens in redneck places...like alberta
speaking of which
Hayley plays against my alma mater quite often

 

[OnMAA]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

decker and coyne were the best at the U18 level and fast forward four years later they are the best at the national level....other than poulin who else does canada have?

i love brianne jenner but she is not that player yet.....and seriously the jessica campbell comparison tells all about the dire situation of team canada women's teams...

You woke up to late.....The generational talents of this era were at the U18 level a few years prior to 2010. I clearly recall sitting in the stands in St-Jerome circa 2006 watching a loaded Polar Bear team playing a loaded Quebec team and someone in the stands high up in the coaching fraternity made the comment..."You are watching the two stars of the future Olympics"....It was a 17 year Hillary Knight vs 16 year old Poulin.....Game went into overtime..... Nothing against Coyne and the like but IMHO Knight and Poulin are the generational type talents of the first half of this decade. The others that come close would be one of the Lam Twins and Agosta. JMO.

 

[OnMAA]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

I think the developmental systems are different as well. The Americans always go for speed and skill. Even on the mens side they normally are faster and more skilled than the Canadians. I remember watching the 2010 Gold medal game and seeing how fast the US players were. Seemed like Canada couldn't keep up with their speed at times. The Canadians on the other hand go for power forward type of players and rely on agility and physicality and skill rather than blistering speed. It has been like this for years. And of course I'm generalizing here because there are players on both teams that are exceptions to this. Who's to say which developmental system is the better one? I just think both sides construct their teams differently. So yeah maybe Canada's women's team can't keep up with their American counterparts a lot of the time but they've proven that they don't need to in order to win

Exactly. That was my point a while back that triggered this whole discussion. Well said.

 

[OnMAA]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

this is the difference between the US & Canada

we don't blame the players, we blame the coach (or elevate them to God like status if they win)
We are much more attached to our college team, you could see this at the game between the two teams in St Paul, the Canadian fans wore team Canada gear while the US fans wore their college gear.
Sure it is nice if Team USA wins, but it is more important that our college players make the team and play well, even the Canadian players.

The US won 40 gold medals at the summer games, winning gold in hockey just means they've beaten one good team, so it is no big deal.
Although it certainly was when they won it, nobody really watched or cared until after they had done it.

Even here in MN hockey is a second class sport.
Amanda Kessel retires, and the local media is unaware of it until after they are scooped by the Grand Forks newspaper. Scooped because they just don't care about it, it's a minor sport to them because it doesn't involve big bucks.
The basketball coach gets a $450,000 raise for winning only half as many games as he loses in a tenth place finish in the Big Ten. That raise is more than the entire women's hockey team staff makes for the year after winning 3 championships in 4 years.

Meanwhile Canadians dissect a loss in a series intended to develop young players that was only attended by the players parents ....
but hey, it's better than arguing about 90% of the things we argue around here, at least it's hockey.

I actually have to commend you on a good post. What is happening ..But you are right on with your premise that except for a few fervent fans, Women's hockey is a niche sport that the general public pays little attention to. Sadly, albeit to a lesser extent, that is the same here in Canada as in the USA.

Even an immensely popular sport at the grass roots like soccer has trouble attracting big crowds to top level games, in comparison to the men's equivalent.

 

[Chaffron]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

You woke up to late.....The generational talents of this era were at the U18 level a few years prior to 2010. I clearly recall sitting in the stands in St-Jerome circa 2006 watching a loaded Polar Bear team playing a loaded Quebec team and someone in the stands high up in the coaching fraternity made the comment..."You are watching the two stars of the future Olympics"....It was a 17 year Hillary Knight vs 16 year old Poulin.....Game went into overtime..... Nothing against Coyne and the like but IMHO Knight and Poulin are the generational type talents of the first half of this decade. The others that come close would be one of the Lam Twins and Agosta. JMO.

knight will be 28 in 2018
decker is better than knight

brianne jenner and poulin are the answers to kessel and decker...and sorry but kessel and decker are the best

you should compare knight to someone of equal age like rebecca johnston

 

[hocper]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

Does anyone know how to find the roster for the upcoming Senior camp for Hockey Canada? Has it been published yet?

 

[Chaffron]

Re: USA-Canada U-22/Development Team Series 2016

Does anyone know how to find the roster for the upcoming Senior camp for Hockey Canada? Has it been published yet?

It will prob be published in 2-3 weeks, as it was last year

hope Agosta and Wickenheiser make the roster, they cause team USA many fits and hate them