Unrest in Egypt

[Priceless]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

Twitter

Gaddafi moved troops over to Benghazi by plane last night. There are snipers on rooftops. Does not bode well

vision on AJE now of army tanks rolling thru streets of Manama, Bahrain. This is getting very serious!!

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

I don't buy this. I don't know for sure what he intended...but I see no solid evidence that he intended a radical use of the guard that he felt didn't need any explanation. Likewise, I don't see how anyone can rule out the meaning which the vast majority of people believed he intended...while clearly he needed some cya action in a hurry.

Right

And when the Democratic governor did the exact same thing in 2003? What then?

Pants on Fire.

 

[Priceless]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

situation #Libya critical, brutal repression of demos in #Benghazi 6 confirmed dead & #Bayda no conf on death toll #Feb17

http://on.fb.me/hEvHXB vid from zintan, crowd chating "To hell with Gaddafi, oh Zintan don't be afraid anymore"

CONFIRMED Doctors in Bayda, east of #Benghazi , #Libya being threatened, warned against talking to media

MSNBC is interviewing Nicholas Kristof in Bahrain...the army has shot protesters and there are tanks patrolling the streets. The hospitals were swamped by wounded and injured - over 600.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

Right

And when the Democratic governor did the exact same thing in 2003? What then?

Pants on Fire.

The piece is fine in that it says we don't know what Walker intended. Although I will add that the most obvious and widely understood interpretation of what Walker said was that he was planning on using the guard for its most frequently used role of crowd control.

You said you did know what Walker intended...and that he definitely did not intend to use the guard against the protesters. I see no evidence of that and disagree.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

The piece is fine in that it says we don't know what Walker intended. Although I will add that the most obvious and widely understood interpretation of what Walker said was that he was planning on using the guard for its most frequently used role of crowd control.

Uh, no. We know pretty clearly what Walker intended- it even said so in the piece.

In an email to PolitiFact Wisconsin, Walker spokesman Cullen Werwie wrote: "In the unlikely event that core government services are disrupted the Guard would be used just to continue those services. That’s what the National Guard does."

But you're right, he totally was going to use them against the protestors. Hosni Walker! Mubarak of the Midwest! Hitler of the Plains!

 

[Priceless]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

BBC's Ian Pannell in #Bahrain: "clear evidence police used live rounds against protesters when clearing the demonstration this morning."

#Bahrain barring journalists from entry at airport. King Hamad doesn't want witnesses to his brutality.

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[aparch]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

So it's pretty much going like we felt Egypt would.

Whenever the book is written about how Egypt unfolded, I hope they keep a few chapters to talk about Bahrain and what the 180° difference would be.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

Uh, no. We know pretty clearly what Walker intended- it even said so in the piece.

You mean this?

"I got a full briefing from all the major, level-one state agencies as well as the the National Guard yesterday. We are fully prepared and equipped to handle whatever may occur."

I don't see 'calling in the national guard to do the jobs of employees' in either his first statement or his spokesman's follow up.

In the end, I disagree...that he couldn't have meant the most common use of the guard. Indeed, I haven't seen him deny it either.

 

[unofan]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

Uh, no. We know pretty clearly what Walker intended- it even said so in the piece.

But you're right, he totally was going to use them against the protestors. Hosni Walker! Mubarak of the Midwest! Hitler of the Plains!

I've got no love for unions in general, but still agree with their right to form and collectively bargain. Fark Walker, he stepped way over the line on this one. There is absolutely no reason to strip collective bargaining rights for budgetary purposes. It's akin to trying to strip the fifth amendment of its protections because it costs too much money to hold trials without confessions.

I will say the photos of the crowds are awesome. Glad to see the masses can be motivated even here in fly-over country.

 

[bigmrg74]

So it's pretty much going like we felt Egypt would.

Whenever the book is written about how Egypt unfolded, I hope they keep a few chapters to talk about Bahrain and what the 180° difference would be.

Hell in a handbasket. Might just end up being a little more messier than what Egypt was, or it could become a near civil war. Most likely it just depends on how far the security forces are willing to carry out orders.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

I've got no love for unions in general, but still agree with their right to form and collectively bargain. Fark Walker, he stepped way over the line on this one. There is absolutely no reason to strip collective bargaining rights for budgetary purposes. It's akin to trying to strip the fifth amendment of its protections because it costs too much money to hold trials without confessions.

I will say the photos of the crowds are awesome. Glad to see the masses can be motivated even here in fly-over country.

So you believe there's a constitutional right being violated here? (Honestly asking). I don't think even the protestors have been saying that.

In either case, having a problem with the bill is different from believing that the national guard will be called upon to beat strikers, which crazypants 5mn seems to believe.

 

[unofan]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

So you believe there's a constitutional right being violated here? (Honestly asking). I don't think even the protestors have been saying that.

Not a Constitutional one, but at this point certainly a traditional one that, frankly, I can't imagine any reason whatsoever to do away with. If Walker wants to bust the unions, he's free to attempt to do so (and will likely get trampled next election by driving away the independents). This has nothing to do with the budget, though; it's political retribution.

Even Iowa hasn't attempted this kind of shenanigans.

Edit: I compared it to the fifth amendment out of laziness - I'm trying to think of something more comparable, i.e. a longstanding codified "right" that isn't necessarily guaranteed by the Constitution, but mind's drawing a blank at the moment.

 

[Priceless]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

Hell in a handbasket. Might just end up being a little more messier than what Egypt was, or it could become a near civil war. Most likely it just depends on how far the security forces are willing to carry out orders.

In some countries the police aren't locals, the rulers bring in mercenaries from other countries to police their population.

The protesters are ignoring US media and sending messages directly to the BBC and Al-Jazeera. Journalists aren't being allowed into countries like Libya and Bahrain, so information is sketchy.

 

[bigmrg74]

In some countries the police aren't locals, the rulers bring in mercenaries from other countries to police their population.

True, but after a while, you would have to think that those guys would get tried of dealing with all of the protestors day in and day out, when for the most part they had a fairly cake job that maybe required them to perhaps throw their weight around maybe every third day or so. You would think that most of them would be well fed and fat. Not many of them would be close to game shape, and heck, some of them might start thinking that it would be a good time to start asking for pay raises as well. Other regimes might also be hiring right now, and be looking at having a few more experianced shock troops as well.

 

[Priceless]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

From @NickKristof

A young woman breaks down as she tells me what happened when the police attacked #Bahrain democracy protesters. http://twitpic.com/40rwob

Crowd at #Bahrain hospital is chanting "We'll stay until the regime falls." Helicopter overhead and rumors police will attack.

Example of #Bahrain govt propaganda: @alibinkhalifa of royal family tweeted that I am "supporting outlaws with weapons."

A video of police attack on #Bahrain protesters last night (via @DavidClinchNews) http://bit.ly/gHcfn4

As a reporter, some things just break your heart. Like watching the govt of moderate, tolerant #Bahrain kill its people.

I'm documenting #Bahrain crackdown with video, photos, sound. I'm on the move to get these out before govt confiscates them.

1 #Bahrain ambulance driver told me #Saudi army officer held gun to his head, said wld kill him if helped injured.

 

[WeWantMore]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

Not a Constitutional one, but at this point certainly a traditional one that, frankly, I can't imagine any reason whatsoever to do away with. If Walker wants to bust the unions, he's free to attempt to do so (and will likely get trampled next election by driving away the independents). This has nothing to do with the budget, though; it's political retribution.

I seriously doubt that this will drive away too many independents. Everyone keeps talking about the crowds of protestors, but who do you think put him into office?

Anyways, so long as we're clear it's not a Constitutional right, I think we're pretty much on the same page here. He's free to attempt this, we'll see what the consequences are. Isn't that the point of elections?

 

[alfablue]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

It's not as if the protests in Bahrain are being ignored- the circus known as Formula 1 comes to town, quite soon. This is a BIG deal in terms of pure $$.

And the GP2 race has been canceled due to the situation.

F1 is scheduled the weekend of March 11, 12, and 13. May not happen.

 

[Priceless]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

NPR Reporter in #Bahrain: "I have just seen one of the more gruesome sites in 10 years of covering the Middle East"

They have blocked access to @CrowdVoice in Bahrain because of this page: http://is.gd/U1kFyU

reports that pro-change member of parliament & activist Ahmed Saif Hashid was harassed by thugs & security and is now missing. #yf, #yemen

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[5mn_Major]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

In either case, having a problem with the bill is different from believing that the national guard will be called upon to beat strikers, which crazypants 5mn seems to believe.

Uh...no. I never said what he intended, evidence by me saying:

I don't know for sure what he intended.

...though you said:

There's a difference between calling in the national guard to do harm to strikers/employees and calling in the national guard to do the jobs of employees (most notably at state prisons) should they strike. Gov. Walker firmly intends it to be the latter.

...you have only shown weak references that Walker intends to use the guard for some purpose as your evidence. Hence I disagree and Walker deserves the press he's getting.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Unrest in Egypt

I wondered when that great freedom-loving state we went to bat for would start to make noises. They are after all the moral equivalent of our Founding Fathers. Or was that the Mujahideen?