UNH Men’s Hockey 22-23: the start of something new, or more of the same?

[HockeyRef]

Looking at the schedule I see that they changed "Senior Night" to the Feb 18th (Maine game/WOTW) from the original last game with Vermont...Also note to self...Saturday's game is at 4, not 7 lol. Snives, love the 'first 21 games were practice'. Well when you float a team with that many Frosh I guess you can say that tho I'm sure most here would scoff at that idea...I will reserve my final comment on that after our showing in the HE tournament (forgot Chuck's acronym MB is all I got

Chuck, well, I think its great that these two teams (Harvard, NU) will get a championship game in the 'pot...BU was def not on their game/NU was. Picking NU for all the marbles. (didn't know this would be their 5th time in a row they are in the 'shippppp....sigh.) I'm agreeing that HE is not the 'juggernaut' if I can use that term of college hockey (not a follower of stats so if they ever were, someone can enlighten me if you are thinking of the Maine/UNH 'hey days' of being in the FF4, BU/BC winning the NC etc) that it was, and certainly not UNH of course. Just have to look at how many teams in pairwise at the moment going down the stretch...Of course the purists throughout the USCHO will point to the parity in college hockey...so there's that too.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Looking at the schedule I see that they changed "Senior Night" to the Feb 18th (Maine game/WOTW) from the original last game with Vermont...Also note to self...Saturday's game is at 4, not 7 lol. Snives, love the 'first 21 games were practice'. Well when you float a team with that many Frosh I guess you can say that tho I'm sure most here would scoff at that idea...I will reserve my final comment on that after our showing in the HE tournament (forgot Chuck's acronym MB is all I got

Chuck, well, I think its great that these two teams (Harvard, NU) will get a championship game in the 'pot...BU was def not on their game/NU was. Picking NU for all the marbles. (didn't know this would be their 5th time in a row they are in the 'shippppp....sigh.) I'm agreeing that HE is not the 'juggernaut' if I can use that term of college hockey (not a follower of stats so if they ever were, someone can enlighten me if you are thinking of the Maine/UNH 'hey days' of being in the FF4, BU/BC winning the NC etc) that it was, and certainly not UNH of course. Just have to look at how many teams in pairwise at the moment going down the stretch...Of course the purists throughout the USCHO will point to the parity in college hockey...so there's that too.

Make Believe Phoney Baloney Everyone Gets A Medal. Kinda rolls off the tongue, doesn't it 'Ref? ;-)

As far as the NU-Harvard BP Final for the first time in 71 years of the competition ... "getting wonky" numbers-wise, there are only six potential combinations of two teams (in a four team format like the BP) to play against each other in the Finals. Delving deeper ... with the rotation of first round opponents, that would eliminate 23-24 seasons where NU and Harvard have played each other in the first round, where it was impossible for them to meet in the BP Finals. So that's 47-48 seasons where a NH-Harvard BP Final would have been possible IF both of those teams won their games on the first Monday in February. And next Monday will be the first time out of nearly 50 chances for that combination to advance. Just based on random chance, if each game was a 50/50 proposition, each of the six potential Finals combos would have played each other a dozen times apiece.

Northeastern was the poor cousin of the Beanpot Four for the first 30 years, had a decent '80's run, and has only recently again re-emerged as a consistent BP contender. Harvard has struggled worse than NU over the last 30 or so years of the tourney, and BU and BC have consistently been better programs than the other two. So there are reasons for this ...

... but bringing this back to my favorite pastime - the "NH Beanpot", of course! - some of the complaints voiced against it on here have been that there's too big a competitive gap between the two top dogs - UNH (BU?) and Dartmouth (BC?) - and the rest of the field, say St. Anselm's (Harvard?) and SNHU (NU?). Sure there is, right now. But you bring in those two lower programs, give them time to build (and the additional exposure of the "NH BP" at the SNHU Arena) and it probably would follow kind of the same pattern, if not accelerated in comparison to the real BP, where it's taken over 70 years to get all of the programs on a level approaching par across the board.

It's a great night(s) out for the alums of the 4 Boston schools, why not create such an event closer to home???

All it would take is a few sponsors, 4 visionary and flexible AD's, and some media to push this to reality.

Postcards and letters please to "WIS NH BP Committee, P.O. Box 666, Effingwoods NH 03999"

 

[HockeyRef]

Make Believe Phoney Baloney Everyone Gets A Medal. Kinda rolls off the tongue, doesn't it 'Ref? ;-)

As far as the NU-Harvard BP Final for the first time in 71 years of the competition ... "getting wonky" numbers-wise, there are only six potential combinations of two teams (in a four team format like the BP) to play against each other in the Finals. Delving deeper ... with the rotation of first round opponents, that would eliminate 23-24 seasons where NU and Harvard have played each other in the first round, where it was impossible for them to meet in the BP Finals. So that's 47-48 seasons where a NH-Harvard BP Final would have been possible IF both of those teams won their games on the first Monday in February. And next Monday will be the first time out of nearly 50 chances for that combination to advance. Just based on random chance, if each game was a 50/50 proposition, each of the six potential Finals combos would have played each other a dozen times apiece.

Northeastern was the poor cousin of the Beanpot Four for the first 30 years, had a decent '80's run, and has only recently again re-emerged as a consistent BP contender. Harvard has struggled worse than NU over the last 30 or so years of the tourney, and BU and BC have consistently been better programs than the other two. So there are reasons for this ...

... but bringing this back to my favorite pastime - the "NH Beanpot", of course! - some of the complaints voiced against it on here have been that there's too big a competitive gap between the two top dogs - UNH (BU?) and Dartmouth (BC?) - and the rest of the field, say St. Anselm's (Harvard?) and SNHU (NU?). Sure there is, right now. But you bring in those two lower programs, give them time to build (and the additional exposure of the "NH BP" at the SNHU Arena) and it probably would follow kind of the same pattern, if not accelerated in comparison to the real BP, where it's taken over 70 years to get all of the programs on a level approaching par across the board.

It's a great night(s) out for the alums of the 4 Boston schools, why not create such an event closer to home???

All it would take is a few sponsors, 4 visionary and flexible AD's, and some media to push this to reality.

Postcards and letters please to "WIS NH BP Committee, P.O. Box 666, Effingwoods NH 03999"

Personally I would LOVE to see a 'NH BeanPot'; Of course we couldn't call it that...the 'GraniteBlock' (Ha!) it would be I think, well attended given the Manchester schools who could participate. Like you said tho, it would require sponsorship and WIIFM is going to be a huge factor...But it could showcase the sport as well and the schools involved. Thanks for the background of the BP; I am thinking about going to the games next week if MR. HR doesn't mind haha like he could tell me I couldn't go but you still gotta be polite about such things And look! We already have the entertainment so there's that...

 

[amkirby10]

Venturing in here briefly, I always was intrigued by the idea of a "Northern New England Beanpot" between Maine, UNH, Dartmouth, and UVM. It even follows the same general template of the Boston Beanpot, three Hockey East teams and one Ivy League ECAC team. It could either be held at one central location (likely SNHU in Manchester as its both the largest and most centrally located choice in the region), or it could be rotated between Gutterson Fieldhouse, Thompson Arena, Whittemore Center, and Alfond Arena year-over-year. It would never actually happen, but its fun to theorize about!

 

[Snively65]

Venturing in here briefly, I always was intrigued by the idea of a "Northern New England Beanpot" between Maine, UNH, Dartmouth, and UVM. It even follows the same general template of the Boston Beanpot, three Hockey East teams and one Ivy League ECAC team. It could either be held at one central location (likely SNHU in Manchester as its both the largest and most centrally located choice in the region), or it could be rotated between Gutterson Fieldhouse, Thompson Arena, Whittemore Center, and Alfond Arena year-over-year. It would never actually happen, but it’s fun to theorize about!

I think that the travel distances would be too much for a northern New England “Beanpot-like” successive Mondays tournament, but maybe would work as an annual two-day holiday or early season tournament rotating amongst the four schools or using SNHU arena as you suggest. Another option would be for UNH to combine with UML, Mac, and either Bentley or Holy Cross for the successive Mondays approach. I think that Chuck’s idea of mixing Div 1 and Div 3 teams would be DOA at both league’s headquarters.

 

[Snively65]

Warren Foegele scored his 6th and 7th goals of season tonight in Oilers win, Foegele’s 319th NHL career game tying him with Norm Lacombe (UNH 1981/82-1983) for 15th of UNH players all time for NHL games played. Next up Peter Douris (1983/84-1984/85) with 321 games and Kevin Dean (1987/88-1990/91) with 331 games.

Casey DeSmith separated himself from Eric Nikulas for 24th by playing in his 119th NHL game in his 2-1 OT win and 43 saves against Avs tonight.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Venturing in here briefly, I always was intrigued by the idea of a "Northern New England Beanpot" between Maine, UNH, Dartmouth, and UVM. It even follows the same general template of the Boston Beanpot, three Hockey East teams and one Ivy League ECAC team. It could either be held at one central location (likely SNHU in Manchester as its both the largest and most centrally located choice in the region), or it could be rotated between Gutterson Fieldhouse, Thompson Arena, Whittemore Center, and Alfond Arena year-over-year. It would never actually happen, but its fun to theorize about!

Governor's Cup was actually a concept that came to life for a couple of seasons, I believe in the late '90's, which included UNH, UVM, UMaine and UMass Lowell (instead of your suggested Dartmouth), and was meant to rotate among the four schools as the home site. IIRC the games were played during the Thanksgiving weekend (I think - or maybe end of Winter break?), and the inaugural event was played at the Tsongas Arena, and I believe the second season was hosted at The Whitt by UNH. At the time, those two were the newest D-1 buildings in the region.

Unfortunately, the tourney never got to Burlington or Orono. It's hard to locate any info on this early-Internet fossil, especially when searches come up with other Governor's Cups (Alaska and NY to name two) of more recent vintage. I know there is now the College Cup down in CT too so the concept as a local yokel Beanpot knock-off is hardly new and/or unique.

FWIW Snives I believe both St. A's and SNHU are part of the Northeast 10 conference, which is technically D-2 not D-3. I can't claim to know if that would make a lick of a difference with HEA or NE-10, OR the NCAA. I honestly can't imagine the NE-10 opposing something that would be a growth mechanism for two of their member schools, unless the guy who runs it out of his basement decides to get super-territorial about it??

One potential workaround - especially in these days where UNH feels like a preseason exhibition is worthless - would be to pit the two D-1 schools in the opening game every year (to start with anyway), and ditto with the two D-2 schools, and then the Finals/Consolation games would serve as the designated exhibition games for both UNH and Dartmouth.

Another FWIW: The 4 current Beanpot schools were all D-1 independents for the first decade-plus of the Beanpot. All joined the brand-new ECAC in late 1961 for the '61/'62 season. Which makes me roughly as old as the ECAC ...

 

[Felger]

Venturing in here briefly, I always was intrigued by the idea of a "Northern New England Beanpot" between Maine, UNH, Dartmouth, and UVM. It even follows the same general template of the Boston Beanpot, three Hockey East teams and one Ivy League ECAC team. It could either be held at one central location (likely SNHU in Manchester as its both the largest and most centrally located choice in the region), or it could be rotated between Gutterson Fieldhouse, Thompson Arena, Whittemore Center, and Alfond Arena year-over-year. It would never actually happen, but its fun to theorize about!

It already happened, 1981 - 1983.

Governor's Cup was actually a concept that came to life for a couple of seasons, I believe in the late '90's, which included UNH, UVM, UMaine and UMass Lowell (instead of your suggested Dartmouth), and was meant to rotate among the four schools as the home site. IIRC the games were played during the Thanksgiving weekend (I think - or maybe end of Winter break?), and the inaugural event was played at the Tsongas Arena, and I believe the second season was hosted at The Whitt by UNH. At the time, those two were the newest D-1 buildings in the region.

Unfortunately, the tourney never got to Burlington or Orono.

Governors Cup was played for four seasons:

1995 at Maine

1996 at Vermont

1997 at UNH

1998 at Lowell

UNH won both tourneys twice. I am surprised they don't have banners celebrating those accomplishments.

 

[Chuck Murray]

Governors Cup was played for four seasons:

1995 at Maine

1996 at Vermont

1997 at UNH

1998 at Lowell

UNH won both tourneys twice. I am surprised they don't have banners celebrating those accomplishments.

I stand corrected then, Felgie. At least I was kinda in the ballpark for when it happened. I recall UNH won the year they hosted, and took the tourney final 6-0 or 7-0 against UMaine. That was back when "Champions of November" really meant something, I guess!! I'm almost tempted to say that game was the one that featured Ben Guite's dirty/nasty hit on Mark Mowers?? Hard to believe it's been a quarter century since those heady days. Equally hard to believe that Walshy's been gone for over 20 of those years, too.

I don't remember the 1981-1983 event, those were smack dab in the middle of my college days at the intersection of Beaver & Forest. What was that event called, and what was its timing in the season, Felgie? Phone a friend, Andy Brickley?? ;-)

 

[Felger]

I stand corrected then, Felgie. At least I was kinda in the ballpark for when it happened. I recall UNH won the year they hosted, and took the tourney final 6-0 or 7-0 against UMaine. That was back when "Champions of November" really meant something, I guess!! I'm almost tempted to say that game was the one that featured Ben Guite's dirty/nasty hit on Mark Mowers?? Hard to believe it's been a quarter century since those heady days. Equally hard to believe that Walshy's been gone for over 20 of those years, too.

I don't remember the 1981-1983 event, those were smack dab in the middle of my college days at the intersection of Beaver & Forest. What was that event called, and what was its timing in the season, Felgie? Phone a friend, Andy Brickley?? ;-)

Those three events were played as Dartmouth's annual tournament. All were played in Hanover, which I assumed, (dangerous, I know) was as much about the facility as anything else. Maybe it was coincidence but it seems to have gone by the wayside when Hockey East was founded in 1984. Until then all four schools were in the ECAC.

Then again, maybe it just wasn't that big of a hit. As you said, the concept is nothing new.

 

[Snively65]

Those three events were played as Dartmouth's annual tournament. All were played in Hanover, which I assumed, (dangerous, I know) was as much about the facility as anything else. Maybe it was coincidence but it seems to have gone by the wayside when Hockey East was founded in 1984. Until then all four schools were in the ECAC.

Then again, maybe it just wasn't that big of a hit. As you said, the concept is nothing new.

I have been to Thompson Arena a few times in recent years, including the UNH game when Kohei Sato filled in on the blue line and did a pretty good job there.

But, I never order the chowdah any longer as it was always cold, not lukewarm, but cold. :-(

 

[Snively65]

Governor's Cup

FWIW Snives I believe both St. A's and SNHU are part of the Northeast 10 conference, which is technically D-2 not D-3. I can't claim to know if that would make a lick of a difference with HEA or NE-10, OR the NCAA. I honestly can't imagine the NE-10 opposing something that would be a growth mechanism for two of their member schools, unless the guy who runs it out of his basement decides to get super-territorial about.

Another FWIW: The 4 current Beanpot schools were all D-1 independents for the first decade-plus of the Beanpot. All joined the brand-new ECAC in late 1961 for the '61/'62 season. Which makes me roughly as old as the ECAC ...

Of course, my mistake, and embarrassing after watching Bentley’s women and sometimes men dominate the NE-10 conference in basketball for decades.

And, I remember the early days of ECAC-2 and then ECAC-1 hockey at UNH, when until 1965 we hosted games on the outdoor Batchelder Rink where some of us townie kids retrieved pucks melting out of the snow and ice banks in the spring. Our opponents included Army, Norwich, and the like.

 

[Sean Pickett]

Those three events were played as Dartmouth's annual tournament. All were played in Hanover, which I assumed, (dangerous, I know) was as much about the facility as anything else. Maybe it was coincidence but it seems to have gone by the wayside when Hockey East was founded in 1984. Until then all four schools were in the ECAC.

I have no inside knowledge, but as New Hampshire participated in 1984 and again in 1986 and 1988, I don't think it was directly due to the split.

Looking at schedules for 1984-85 it appears Maine wasn't available, as they were at Duluth for 2 vs UMD as part of the HEA-WCHA interlocking schedule. As I recall, most of the interlocking games were played early in the season, around Thanksgiving break and then after Christmas and the start of the new year. The 34 game schedule left only limited dates for any non-conference games. Maine did participate in 1985, but that was the last time they did so. Looking at Maine's schedules it appears Coach Walsh decided to play more western teams once the interlocking schedule was reduced and then ended.

Sean

 

[HockeyRef]

Since UNH hockey can't be much more than Pairwise wreckers, I'd love to see us do some damage to the Huskies this weekend in that regard. (and of course, pick up some HE points). Not feeling all that optimistic, but who knows? I know it was said that these next few games are 'winnable'...and would love to see that happen. Reason I'm hedging on a W for the 'Cats this weekend is we don't have a great track record with the Huskies (going back 5 seasons we are 3-8-1 if I have that right) BUT...we are at home so... Early predicts:

Friday: Yukon 5 UNH 2
Sat: Yukon 3 UNH 2 (OT)

As always, prove me wrong Wildcats!! Also interesting to wonder about who's gonna be in goal...

 

[Chuck Murray]

Since UNH hockey can't be much more than Pairwise wreckers, I'd love to see us do some damage to the Huskies this weekend in that regard. (and of course, pick up some HE points). Not feeling all that optimistic, but who knows? I know it was said that these next few games are 'winnable'...and would love to see that happen. Reason I'm hedging on a W for the 'Cats this weekend is we don't have a great track record with the Huskies (going back 5 seasons we are 3-8-1 if I have that right) BUT...we are at home so... Early predicts:

Friday: Yukon 5 UNH 2
Sat: Yukon 3 UNH 2 (OT)

As always, prove me wrong Wildcats!! Also interesting to wonder about who's gonna be in goal...

Friday: UNH 1 UConn 0 (Mucinex in goal for the 'Cats); Luce whines that his squad won SOG's and FOW's
Saturday: UNH 5 UConn 2 (Mucinex on a 3 game winning streak); Luce flashes evil grin, knowing what's up next ...

Monday: ... taking the bait, buzzkill AD Rich announces that MS7 has been handed a 5-year contract extension

Wednesday: Coach Souza legally adopts the goalie formerly known as Mucinex - "lifetime" contract rumoured??
Thursday: "Messy Fessy" sees writing on the wall, returns to Huntsville, signs with Havoc, reuniting w/Mike Robinson

 

[After the Whistle]

It was good to see that Senior Night has been changed to a weekend with 2 home games. Thursday!? Has to be among the craziest decisions n years. “Hey mom and dad, you want to come in for my senior night (from BC, Minnesota, Sweden etc.) and then there are no more games but I will be free for dinner on Friday.” Gotta wonder!

 

[HockeyRef]

Friday: UNH 1 UConn 0 (Mucinex in goal for the 'Cats); Luce whines that his squad won SOG's and FOW's
Saturday: UNH 5 UConn 2 (Mucinex on a 3 game winning streak); Luce flashes evil grin, knowing what's up next ...

Monday: ... taking the bait, buzzkill AD Rich announces that MS7 has been handed a 5-year contract extension

Wednesday: Coach Souza legally adopts the goalie formerly known as Mucinex - "lifetime" contract rumoured??
Thursday: "Messy Fessy" sees writing on the wall, returns to Huntsville, signs with Havoc, reuniting w/Mike Robinson

OMG..Mucinex?? And as for the rest, who knows ha!

 

[HockeyRef]

It was good to see that Senior Night has been changed to a weekend with 2 home games. Thursday!? Has to be among the craziest decisions n years. “Hey mom and dad, you want to come in for my senior night (from BC, Minnesota, Sweden etc.) and then there are no more games but I will be free for dinner on Friday.” Gotta wonder!

I know that was crazy...glad to see that changed...who scheduled that, hmmmmm.

 

[Snively65]

Friday: UNH 1 UConn 0 (Mucinex in goal for the 'Cats); Luce whines that his squad won SOG's and FOW's
Saturday: UNH 5 UConn 2 (Mucinex on a 3 game winning streak); Luce flashes evil grin, knowing what's up next ...

Monday: ... taking the bait, buzzkill AD Rich announces that MS7 has been handed a 5-year contract extension

Wednesday: Coach Souza legally adopts the goalie formerly known as Mucinex - "lifetime" contract rumoured??
Thursday: "Messy Fessy" sees writing on the wall, returns to Huntsville, signs with Havoc, reuniting w/Mike Robinson

Cats need to run table (like we Oyster River High kids did in the MUB pool hall en route to emptying pockets (no pun intended) of rich UNH frosh) if MS7 is to see anything like a five-year contract renewal.

 

[Snively65]

Since UNH hockey can't be much more than Pairwise wreckers, I'd love to see us do some damage to the Huskies this weekend in that regard. (and of course, pick up some HE points). Not feeling all that optimistic, but who knows? I know it was said that these next few games are 'winnable'...and would love to see that happen. Reason I'm hedging on a W for the 'Cats this weekend is we don't have a great track record with the Huskies (going back 5 seasons we are 3-8-1 if I have that right) BUT...we are at home so... Early predicts:

Friday: Yukon 5 UNH 2
Sat: Yukon 3 UNH 2 (OT)

As always, prove me wrong Wildcats!! Also interesting to wonder about who's gonna be in goal...

UNH 1-7-0 in last eight games against Yukon at the Whitt. But in 2014/15 season, we won all three at the Whitt, including two in the MBPBEGAM round (pre-Luce, I think).

edit: Nope, I was wrong, as Luce had already replaced Bruce Parker at Yukon, but 2014/15 was also MS7’s last year as assistant coach at Yukon. So, that makes MS7 1-10 in games between UNH and Yukon at the Whitt. In other words, once Luce shed MS7, it was almost all “blue skies” (Who? What?) for Luce at the Whitt.