UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

[redhead18]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

I had thought your best bet was a breakaway AHA cluster trying to link up with Ferris and Bowling Green before they opted for the nWCHA.

That was my thought as well. I think if UBuffalo had actually come out and announced they were starting a program at the time, this conference would be a reality. I still have some slim hopes of seeing this conference but as more time passes my feeling is it wont happen.

 

[LtPowers]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

Here are the number of times that an Atlantic Hockey team has played in Huntsville since UAH became a Division I team for the second time.

I don't see how that's a relevant comparison. If we want a twelfth member (and I'll believe Navy when I see it) why wouldn't we pursue UAH? You'll be a lot more appealing when you're in a conference; no one likes to play an independent for PWR reasons.


Powers &8^]

 

[gfmorris]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

I don't see how that's a relevant comparison. If we want a twelfth member (and I'll believe Navy when I see it) why wouldn't we pursue UAH? You'll be a lot more appealing when you're in a conference; no one likes to play an independent for PWR reasons.

But why would a fly date be appealing to more than half of the member schools? From what I understand from talking to Chris Lerch, Air Force does not subsidize travel. Would that extend to UAH? Then, hell yes we think it's a good idea. But given that 1) AHA teams don't fly here, even when we have been good PWR comparisons, and 2) we were previously told no, then why do we get a yes now? The CCHA proved in 2009 that teams won't always fill holes that are left open by conference shakeups.

The WCHA proposition is, by my estimate, 50-50. I can't say more than that.

This is quite the cruel game of musical chairs. People keep throwing a milk crate underneath us and moving the needle back on the record, but either we find another chair and move into the CD age or we go away. People say that it's up to UAH to show a commitment to the sport, and I will grant you that we have to do that. But we have no guarantee that there is some magical amount of support that guarantees that even the most intractable opponents will suddenly say, "You know what? You're right. They really want this sport. TO UNANIMOUS VOTES!" I don't think that a unanimous vote will be had either way, to tell the truth; it will probably be couched in acclimation as the CCH vote was.

GFM <-- still has high hopes for a WCHA bid and to get back to talking about recruits and why Kyle Lysaght needs to cut his **** hair.

 

[UAHStatman]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

But why would a fly date be appealing to more than half of the member schools? From what I understand from talking to Chris Lerch, Air Force does not subsidize travel. Would that extend to UAH? Then, hell yes we think it's a good idea. But given that 1) AHA teams don't fly here, even when we have been good PWR comparisons, and 2) we were previously told no, then why do we get a yes now? The CCHA proved in 2009 that teams won't always fill holes that are left open by conference shakeups.

The WCHA proposition is, by my estimate, 50-50. I can't say more than that.

This is quite the cruel game of musical chairs. People keep throwing a milk crate underneath us and moving the needle back on the record, but either we find another chair and move into the CD age or we go away. People say that it's up to UAH to show a commitment to the sport, and I will grant you that we have to do that. But we have no guarantee that there is some magical amount of support that guarantees that even the most intractable opponents will suddenly say, "You know what? You're right. They really want this sport. TO UNANIMOUS VOTES!" I don't think that a unanimous vote will be had either way, to tell the truth; it will probably be couched in acclimation as the CCH vote was.

GFM <-- still has high hopes for a WCHA bid and to get back to talking about recruits and why Kyle Lysaght needs to cut his **** hair.

I'm at the point where I just want to know the WCHA's summer calendar of meeting fun. Just tell me which specific days I should get my hopes up.

So why does Kyle Lysaght need to cut his hair?

 

[gfmorris]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

So why does Kyle Lysaght need to cut his hair?

It's out of control, much like Justin Cseter's was before he cut it after last season. Of course, if 27 showed up on my doorstep with a crew cut, I don't think that I'd recognize him. The first time I saw Brice with short hair, I didn't place him for a second.

GFM

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

But why would a fly date be appealing to more than half of the member schools? From what I understand from talking to Chris Lerch, Air Force does not subsidize travel. Would that extend to UAH? Then, hell yes we think it's a good idea. But given that 1) AHA teams don't fly here, even when we have been good PWR comparisons, and 2) we were previously told no, then why do we get a yes now? The CCHA proved in 2009 that teams won't always fill holes that are left open by conference shakeups.

The WCHA proposition is, by my estimate, 50-50. I can't say more than that.

This is quite the cruel game of musical chairs. People keep throwing a milk crate underneath us and moving the needle back on the record, but either we find another chair and move into the CD age or we go away. People say that it's up to UAH to show a commitment to the sport, and I will grant you that we have to do that. But we have no guarantee that there is some magical amount of support that guarantees that even the most intractable opponents will suddenly say, "You know what? You're right. They really want this sport. TO UNANIMOUS VOTES!" I don't think that a unanimous vote will be had either way, to tell the truth; it will probably be couched in acclimation as the CCH vote was.

GFM <-- still has high hopes for a WCHA bid and to get back to talking about recruits and why Kyle Lysaght needs to cut his **** hair.

One thing to remember about Air Force is that, when it joined the AHA, it was required to play a very IMBA schedule in terms of home/away games.

 

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

It's out of control, much like Justin Cseter's was before he cut it after last season. Of course, if 27 showed up on my doorstep with a crew cut, I don't think that I'd recognize him. The first time I saw Brice with short hair, I didn't place him for a second.

GFM

That's nothing. Bring back the northern mullets!

 

[LtPowers]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

But given that 1) AHA teams don't fly here, even when we have been good PWR comparisons, and 2) we were previously told no, then why do we get a yes now? The CCHA proved in 2009 that teams won't always fill holes that are left open by conference shakeups.

1) is fixed by actually joining the conference; 2) is fixed by virtue of the addition moving the league to an even number of teams rather than odd. I realize you're pessimistic after prior disappointments, but I don't think it's warranted here.


Powers &8^]

 

[UpNorthHockey]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

Hockey will not a net money maker under most scenarios for any of the nWCHA programs. The old WCHA shared league revenues between the big arena programs and small arena programs. It also split the proceeds from the Final Five tourney. This made hockey a break even or slightly profitable sport for the small schools, and a money maker for the big schools. With the big schools gone, the nWCHA will now be in the same boat as most small college sports conferences.....the team will be a cost center instead of a profit center for member schools. The nWCHA schools are willing to kick in funds for their hockey programs going forward because they provide important publicity. However, any scenario that brings in another air travel school means that all the league schools will simply have to kick in more funds. That's the headwind UAH is facing. Once the nWCHA gets a handle on its revised financial picture, it will be up to the member schools to decide if they can afford to admit another air travel school. When you figure out the per school cost of flying most of the league teams to Hunstville once a year, it's probably not really a deal breaker for most member schools. It probably raises program costs by 5-10% depending on the school's hockey budget. To me, that suggests that UAH might get 'yes' votes from many nWCHA programs. However, I have to wonder if the UAH administration will be willing to pay the nWCHA league fees and endure the same expense as the other nWCHA programs now that the nWCHA's financial dynamics have changed.

 

[moose97]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

Hockey will not a net money maker under most scenarios for any of the nWCHA programs. The old WCHA shared league revenues between the big arena programs and small arena programs. It also split the proceeds from the Final Five tourney. This made hockey a break even or slightly profitable sport for the small schools, and a money maker for the big schools. With the big schools gone, the nWCHA will now be in the same boat as most small college sports conferences.....the team will be a cost center instead of a profit center for member schools.

BSU was a money maker in the CHA - no reason to think that they won't be one in the nWCHA.

 

[gfmorris]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

1) is fixed by actually joining the conference; 2) is fixed by virtue of the addition moving the league to an even number of teams rather than odd. I realize you're pessimistic after prior disappointments, but I don't think it's warranted here.

Why should I have hope and faith in something that's rarely panned out, especially when UAH was told no before?

However, I have to wonder if the UAH administration will be willing to pay the nWCHA league fees and endure the same expense as the other nWCHA programs now that the nWCHA's financial dynamics have changed.

We will gladly pay the league fees. It's not as if we've never been in a conference. The CHA never had more than 24 conference games, and most of the time it was 20. That's still a lot of dates to fill, and most of them were on the road. This year, we played Western [bus], Providence [fly], Merriack-Lowell-UNH [fly], Mankato [I think bus], Bemidji [fly], Denver [fly], Duluth [fly], Maine [fly], Miami [bus]. That's the most fly-heavy schedule that I can remember us playing, mainly because we had three Eastern trips and trips to Denver and UMD, where we usually have just the one trip to a big WCHA school where we end up flying. We can handle the travel. We're not complaining about the travel; hell, the travel gets easier if we play in the WCHA than it is here in the Thug Independent Life.

The only question in my mind is how exorbitant the travel subsidy is, if there even is one.

GFM

 

[aparch]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

The only question in my mind is how exorbitant the travel subsidy is, if there even is one.

The CCHA had UAF over a barrel and made them pay for everyones trips to Alaska. Twenty-five round trip airline tickets. Even to NMU and UNO who joined after UAF was made a member school. UNO got screwed into being in UAF's "travel cluster" when the league became 12 teams.

My understanding for UAA was the WCHA made them do the same for the first decade or so, and then weaned down to just cost assistance (just 10 or 15 airline tickets tops). New conference foes MSU-M, UNO, and BSU had to pay their own way to Anchorage.

As of right now, I would presume there is ZERO travel subsidy for the five new WCHA schools (per the existing membership rules), but that is likely to be one of the topics hammered out this summer by the new member schools.




We'll likely know a lot more after April 29th...

 

[moose97]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

Looks like UConn to HEA is all but a done deal. Now that makes nWCHA and AHA as the two conferences with odd numbers...

http://www.ctnow.com/videogallery/69198812/Sports/uconn-moves-to-hockey-east-04/03#pl-62894825

Does Navy finally make the jump and go AHA? Will AHA give UAH the time of day if they call to ask?

 

[moose97]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

New conference foes MSU-M, UNO, and BSU had to pay their own way to Anchorage.

As of right now, I would presume there is ZERO travel subsidy for the five new WCHA schools (per the existing membership rules), but that is likely to be one of the topics hammered out this summer by the new member schools.

Don't know where you got that info, but UAA continued to offer the same subsidy to all schools the last two years (including when BSU and UNO went north. As it was explained to me, the subsidy wasn't going to go down by adding two new teams because UAA still had the same number of home conference games that they were responsible for subsidizing (no matter who comes, there are 7 home conference weekends). It did not matter if they subsidized travel for UMinn or CC or BSU or UNO. The subsidy was the same all 7 weekends of the season.

 

[fangers]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

1) is fixed by actually joining the conference; 2) is fixed by virtue of the addition moving the league to an even number of teams rather than odd. I realize you're pessimistic after prior disappointments, but I don't think it's warranted here.


Powers &8^]

I agree 100% with Geof. If they won't come here when it's their choice - probably due to costs - do you honestly think they would vote to invite UAH which would commit them to come here on a reguar basis???? No way in hell...

 

[fangers]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

Why should I have hope and faith in something that's rarely panned out, especially when UAH was told no before?



We will gladly pay the league fees. It's not as if we've never been in a conference. The CHA never had more than 24 conference games, and most of the time it was 20. That's still a lot of dates to fill, and most of them were on the road. This year, we played Western [bus], Providence [fly], Merriack-Lowell-UNH [fly], Mankato [I think bus], Bemidji [fly], Denver [fly], Duluth [fly], Maine [fly], Miami [bus]. That's the most fly-heavy schedule that I can remember us playing, mainly because we had three Eastern trips and trips to Denver and UMD, where we usually have just the one trip to a big WCHA school where we end up flying. We can handle the travel. We're not complaining about the travel; hell, the travel gets easier if we play in the WCHA than it is here in the Thug Independent Life.

The only question in my mind is how exorbitant the travel subsidy is, if there even is one.

GFM

They actually bussed to Merrimack/Lowell/UNH over thanksgiving, and bussed to Mankato/BSU since it was during break and they stayed up north between games.

 

[UAHStatman]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

Looks like UConn to HEA is all but a done deal. Now that makes nWCHA and AHA as the two conferences with odd numbers...

http://www.ctnow.com/videogallery/69198812/Sports/uconn-moves-to-hockey-east-04/03#pl-62894825

Does Navy finally make the jump and go AHA? Will AHA give UAH the time of day if they call to ask?

Merrimack beat writer Mike McMahon says that report is wrong. UConn has not been accepted by Hockey East (yet).

https://twitter.com/#!/MikeMcMahonET/status/187701442646257664

 

[gfmorris]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

They actually bussed to Merrimack/Lowell/UNH over thanksgiving, and bussed to Mankato/BSU since it was during break and they stayed up north between games.

Aw hell, I even looked at the schedule and remembered that Mankato/Bemidji was a bus trip because they stayed. I remember reading tweets about that one. I must not have known about the Thanksgiving trip. I should have tried to hop the bus on that one.

GFM

 

[aparch]

Don't know where you got that info, but UAA continued to offer the same subsidy to all schools the last two years (including when BSU and UNO went north.

Thanks for the correction, I apparently had incorrect information when it was explained the travel costs a few years back (and applied it to the expansion a few years ago). Maybe the memory of recalling stuff from college is starting to fade.

 

[LtPowers]

Re: UAH Hockey 2011-12: Will Someone Break the Conference Logjam? Thanks.

I agree 100% with Geof. If they won't come here when it's their choice - probably due to costs - do you honestly think they would vote to invite UAH which would commit them to come here on a reguar basis???? No way in hell...

You think AHA teams would fly out to Air Force on a regular basis if they weren't in the conference? Of course not. Yet there they are, in the conference. I don't see any reason UAH would be any different.


Powers &8^]