Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Hentilson · Mar 18, 2011

Priceless said:
This is fantastic. We're not going to know anything until the last moment.

For example, if Michigan wins the CCHA consolation game, UNH drops down to t13 (a 4 seed) and BC goes west. But if Merrimack were to beat them in the Hockey East final, UNH would jump back up to 12. Then if Miami wins the CCHA, they drop back down to t13. The difference is huge, because if UNH is a 4, BC goes west (probably St. Louis) and Miami or Denver would come east to Manchester. That would totally change the brackets.

Quite a conundrum for BC fans, too. Win tomorrow and go west, lose tomorrow and stay east. Or lose tomorrow and still go west.

Is there any scenario where Dartmouth still makes it with a win over Colgate, or are we done with our loss to Cornell?

GRussinko · Mar 18, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Hentilson said:
Is there any scenario where Dartmouth still makes it with a win over Colgate, or are we done with our loss to Cornell?

Dartmouth is out regardless of tomorrow's outcomes.

jjchurchill · Mar 18, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Hentilson said:
Is there any scenario where Dartmouth still makes it with a win over Colgate, or are we done with our loss to Cornell?

We are done. Cornell hopefully beats Yale tm and a team that actually lasted in the playoffs will get to go to the tournament

Hentilson · Mar 18, 2011

jjchurchill said:
We are done. Cornell hopefully beats Yale tm and a team that actually lasted in the playoffs will get to go to the tournament

Yet another season of oh so close. Go Cornell I guess.

Thanks all for the clarifications

Priceless · Mar 18, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Hentilson said:
Is there any scenario where Dartmouth still makes it with a win over Colgate, or are we done with our loss to Cornell?

I think you're done.

Yale, NoDak and BC are 1 seeds. The 4th 1 seed will either be Miami, Merrimack, Denver or Michigan (in that order).
Those seven teams, plus Union, UMD, Notre Dame, Western, UNH and the AHA Champ are in.
The final 3 spots are Cornell (if they win the autobid), CC, RPI or UNO. Different scenarios yield different results.
I haven't found any scenario that gets anyone else in.

JimDahl · Mar 18, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Priceless said:
Yale, NoDak and BC are 1 seeds. The 4th 1 seed will either be Miami, Merrimack, Denver or Michigan (in that order).
Those seven teams, plus Union, UMD, Notre Dame, Western, UNH and the AHA Champ are in.
The final 3 spots are Cornell (if they win the autobid), CC, RPI or UNO. Different scenarios yield different results.
I haven't found any scenario that gets anyone else in.

I think that's it, too.

As to which 3 of the final 4 (Cornell, CC, RPI, UNO) make it, I think it goes like this:
Yale beats Cornell -- Cornell is out
Cornell beats Yale, Dartmouth beats or ties Colgate, Michigan or Notre Dame wins — RPI is out
Cornell beats Yale, Dartmouth beats or ties Colgate, Notre Dame ties Michigan, Miami beats Western Michigan — RPI is out
Cornell beats Yale, Dartmouth beats or ties Colgate, Notre Dame ties Michigan, Western Michigan beats Miami — UNO is out
Cornell beats Yale, Colgate beats Dartmouth, Michigan beats Notre Dame — CC is out
Cornell beats Yale, Colgate beats Dartmouth, Notre Dame beats Michigan, Western Michigan beats Miami — UNO is out
Cornell beats Yale, Colgate beats Dartmouth, Notre Dame beats Michigan, Miami beats Western Michigan –- RPI is out
Cornell beats Yale, Colgate beats Dartmouth, Michigan ties Notre Dame, Miami beats Western Michigan -- CC is out
Cornell beats Yale, Colgate beats Dartmouth, Michigan ties Notre Dame, Western Michigan beats Miami -- UNO is out

burgie12 · Mar 18, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

JimDahl said:
I think that's it, too.

Cornell beats Yale, Dartmouth beats or ties Colgate -- RPI is out

Not a definite.

Code:

Atlantic Hockey
Championship game: RIT defeats Air Force
CCHA
Championship game: Western Michigan defeats Miami
Consolation game: Notre Dame and Michigan tie.
ECAC
Championship game: Cornell defeats Yale
Consolation game: Dartmouth and Colgate tie.
Hockey East
Championship game: Boston College defeats Merrimack
WCHA
Championship game: Denver defeats North Dakota

UNO is out.

Priceless · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Tonight's bracketology:

Code:

1	Yale (Ya)
2	North Dakota (ND)
3	Boston College (BC)
4	Miami (Mm)
5	Merrimack (Mr)
6	Denver (DU)
7	Michigan (Mi)
8	Union (Un)
9	Minnesota-Duluth (MD)
10	Notre Dame (Nt)
11	Western Michigan (WM)
12	New Hampshire (NH)
13	Nebraska-Omaha (NO)
14	Colorado College (CC)
15	Rensselaer (RP)

Code:

[B]Bridgeport	Manchester	St Louis	Green Bay[/B]
Yale		Boston Coll	Miami		North Dakota
Union		Denver		Merrimack	Michigan
Western		UNH		Notre Dame	UMD
AHA Champ	CC		UNO		RPI

If all favorites win tomorrow:

Code:

1	Yale (Ya)
2	North Dakota (ND)
3	Boston College (BC)
4	Miami (Mm)
5	Michigan (Mi)
6	Merrimack (Mr)
7	Denver (DU)
8	Union (Un)
9	Minnesota-Duluth (MD)
10	Western Michigan (WM)
11	Notre Dame (Nt)
12	Nebraska-Omaha (NO)
13	New Hampshire (NH)
14	Colorado College (CC)
15	Rensselaer (RP)
16      RIT (RT)

Code:

[B]Bridgeport	Manchester	St Louis	Green Bay[/B]
Yale		Miami		Boston Coll	North Dakota
Union		Merrimack	Denver		Michigan
UMD		Western		Notre Dame	UNO
RIT		UNH		CC		RPI

pgv · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Priceless said:

Tonight's bracketology:

Code:

1	Yale (Ya)
2	North Dakota (ND)
3	Boston College (BC)
4	Miami (Mm)
5	Merrimack (Mr)
6	Denver (DU)
7	Michigan (Mi)
8	Union (Un)
9	Minnesota-Duluth (MD)
10	Notre Dame (Nt)
11	Western Michigan (WM)
12	New Hampshire (NH)
13	Nebraska-Omaha (NO)
14	Colorado College (CC)
15	Rensselaer (RP)

Code:

[B]Bridgeport	Manchester	St Louis	Green Bay[/B]
Yale		Boston Coll	Miami		North Dakota
Union		Denver		Merrimack	Michigan
Western		UNH		Notre Dame	UMD
AHA Champ	CC		UNO		RPI

If all favorites win tomorrow:

Code:

1	Yale (Ya)
2	North Dakota (ND)
3	Boston College (BC)
4	Miami (Mm)
5	Michigan (Mi)
6	Merrimack (Mr)
7	Denver (DU)
8	Union (Un)
9	Minnesota-Duluth (MD)
10	Western Michigan (WM)
11	Notre Dame (Nt)
12	Nebraska-Omaha (NO)
13	New Hampshire (NH)
14	Colorado College (CC)
15	Rensselaer (RP)
16      RIT (RT)

Code:

[B]Bridgeport	Manchester	St Louis	Green Bay[/B]
Yale		Miami		Boston Coll	North Dakota
Union		Merrimack	Denver		Michigan
UMD		Western		Notre Dame	UNO
RIT		UNH		CC		RPI

Oh the irony...Merrimack in Manchester, not BC

bronconick · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Question: Is there a possibility that the committee after all of the hard and fast rules tries to avoid non-conference rematches like the Union-Western Michigan one mentioned earlier? Or not a consideration?

Craig P. · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

bronconick said:
Question: Is there a possibility that the committee after all of the hard and fast rules tries to avoid non-conference rematches like the Union-Western Michigan one mentioned earlier? Or not a consideration?

In the relatively recent past, it hasn't been a consideration. They haven't even tried to avoid in-conference rematches of games that were played a week earlier!

Snively65 · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

pgv said:
Oh the irony...Merrimack in Manchester, not BC

Or, more irony, if UNH faces Miami in Manchvegas again, their seedings will be reversed from what they were in 2007.

burgie12 · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Craig P. said:
In the relatively recent past, it hasn't been a consideration. They haven't even tried to avoid in-conference rematches of games that were played a week earlier!

Example? The only in-conference first round match-up since the tournament expanded to 16 teams was Denver v Wisconsin in 2008 when the WCHA placed 6 teams in the tournament (including 3 2-seeds and 2 3-seeds). Denver was matched with Wisconsin (hadn't played since January) instead of Minnesota (played in the Final 5 championship game). Not sure what game / match-up you're referring to above.

JimDahl · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

burgie12 said:
Not a definite.

Code:

Consolation game: Notre Dame and Michigan tie. Consolation game: Dartmouth and Colgate tie.

UNO is out.

You are, of course right. I had done it with straight W/L, then flubbed up the double-tie when trying to weave in those insidious ties. I tried fixing it, but have lost a little self-confidence

Onion Man · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

NCAA hockey has to do one of two things: Either eliminate the rule that the host schools has to play in that regional or allow interconference first round matchups. The fact the UNH gets to play in Manchester is ridiculous. If there was ever a team that didn't deserve any postseason favors its UNH.

hockey east fan · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Onion Man said:
NCAA hockey has to do one of two things: Either eliminate the rule that the host schools has to play in that regional or allow interconference first round matchups. The fact the UNH gets to play in Manchester is ridiculous. If there was ever a team that didn't deserve any postseason favors its UNH.

Well maybe BC should put in a bid to host scallion breath.

Priceless · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Onion Man said:
NCAA hockey has to do one of two things: Either eliminate the rule that the host schools has to play in that regional or allow interconference first round matchups. The fact the UNH gets to play in Manchester is ridiculous. If there was ever a team that didn't deserve any postseason favors its UNH.

Then schools won't bid to host. And Hockey East will only land three teams in the NCAA, you propose making two of them square off in the first round?

slurpees · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

Onion Man said:
NCAA hockey has to do one of two things: Either eliminate the rule that the host schools has to play in that regional or allow interconference first round matchups. The fact the UNH gets to play in Manchester is ridiculous. If there was ever a team that didn't deserve any postseason favors its UNH.

number of times unh has made it to a frozen four from manchester is.......

BC/HE · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

JimDahl said:
To summarize...

In if Cornell loses: Nebraska-Omaha, CC, RPI
In if Cornell wins: Cornell and two of those three (UNO, CC, RPI). UNO is in the strongest position, RPI the weakest.

My current outlook on possible PWR finishes -- NCAA Hockey Tournament shaping up (I even think I got the ties right this time )

I am fairly certain UNH can only get a number 3 seed if either Western Michigan wins or Notre Dame ties or wins yet the percentage you have is 63%. Is that based mostly on the chances of Notre Dame against Michigan since they split at Michigan earlier this year?

Priceless · Mar 19, 2011

Re: Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

This is the TV Guide for today's games and pairwise implications of each. Numbers in parenthesis are DirecTV channels.

3:35 ET: CCHA Consolation #1 Michigan vs #2 Notre Dame (664)
If Michigan wins: They remain alive for the last #1 seed. Losses by Miami, Merrimack and Denver would land them at #4. UNO secures a spot.
If Notre Dame wins or there is a tie: Nothing is decided except Michigan cannot be a 1 seed.

4:00 ET: ECAC Consolation #2 Dartmouth vs #4 Colgate
If Dartmouth wins: RPI needs Yale to defeat Cornell or they're out.
If Colgate wins or ties: CC becomes huge Miami (and Yale) fans. UNO becomes huge Western fans.

7:00 ET: Hockey East Championship #1 Boston College vs #4 Merrimack (629)
If BC wins: They still have a shot at #2 overall if North Dakota loses to Denver. Merrimack cannot be a #1 seed.
If Merrimack wins: They still have a chance at a #1 seed if Miami loses to Western.

7:00 ET: ECAC Championship #2 Yale vs #3 Cornell (613)
If Yale wins: UNO, CC and RPI all clinch.
If Cornell wins: They secure an autobid and eliminate one of CC, RPI or UNO.

7:35 ET: CCHA Championship #3 Miami vs #4 Western Michigan (686)
If Miami wins: They are the final #1 seed.
If Western wins: Miami is the final #1 if Merrimack, Denver and Michigan all lose.

8:00 ET: WCHA Championship #1 North Dakota vs #2 Denver (668, 683)
If North Dakota wins: They secure the #2 overall seed; Denver cannot be a #1
If Denver wins: Denver can be the final #1 seed if Miami and Merrimack both have lost.

The only "magic" game is the ECAC Championship. If Yale wins then the 3 bubble teams all make it. If Cornell wins, all three are relying on a combination of game to clinch a berth.

The UNH situation is tricky as well. The easiest thing is for Notre Dame to win the early game. If winners are:

Dartmouth, Notre Dame, Miami = 12
Colgate, Notre Dame, Miami = 12
Dartmouth, Michigan, Western = 12
Dartmouth, Notre Dame, Western = 12
Colgate, Notre Dame, Western = 12

Dartmouth, Michigan, Miami = 13
Colgate, Michigan, Western = 13

Colgate, Michigan, Miami = 14

Too early for the PWR? Princeton and Brown say no!

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