The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

[joecct]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Bluster all you want, but don't pull the trigger.

 

[Foxton]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Bluster all you want, but don't pull the trigger.

It's funny because that seems to be the way Netanyahu thinks the US should work, the deputy to his sheriff.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

It's funny because that seems to be the way Netanyahu thinks the US should work, the deputy to his sheriff.

What's really funny is His Foreignpolicyness just couldn't find the time for a face-to-face with Netanyahu, but was able to clear his schedule to permit an interview with "The Pimp With a Limp" in Miami.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Hopefully decisions like going to war won't be driven by campaign politics. My intuition is the Republicans (not the Neocons lurking in the basement, but the mainstream party) have no intention of actually going to war with Iran -- they know that would be ruinously expensive and destructive. They are stoking war fever to create an opening between Israel and the US which they can then exploit. They either don't realize or don't care that they are playing with fire. That kind of recklessness is worrisome.

 

[XYZ]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

It's funny because that seems to be the way Netanyahu thinks the US should work, the deputy to his sheriff.

You know, I've disagreed plenty with Foxton in the past, but this is completely correct.

 

[FreshFish]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

There are demonstrations in Libya against the terrorists who killed the US diplomat:

On Wednesday night in Tree Square in Benghazi, we witnessed crowds expressing heartfelt disappointment, shouting slogans like, "Free Libya, terrorists out!" On Saturday, Libyan President Mohamed Magariaf told "NBC Nightly News" that non-Libyans were among those involved. The assertion dovetails with educated opinion here that the attack on the mission must have been planned by an al Qaeda affiliate in revenge for the U.S. drone killing of the Libyan-born al Qaeda leader Abu Yahya al-Libi in Pakistan in June.

....

Most Libyan popular opinion is more nuanced. Based on our dozens of interviews in Benghazi, most Libyans are appalled by the consulate attack. One female medical student at a Benghazi demonstration captured the mood: "The Americans are guests in our country and Islam requires us to treat them well."

According to a recent Gallup poll, Libyans hold a more favorable attitude toward Americans than they do even toward Canadians. As days have passed since the attack, Libyan popular condemnation has increased. A meeting took place on Thursday evening at the Shbelia Hotel to coordinate citizen action against the militants. The people who attended also wanted to goad the government into reining in the myriad militias that fought Gadhafi and have deepened their hold on local politics since his ouster

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390443524904577651530322231506.html?mod=opinion_newsreel



So the Libyans are friendly to Americans and condemn the terrorist attacks....why is Susan Rice still talking about the D*&%m movie! Its NOT the movie.

 

[Rover]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

And I'll say again, why can't Israel solve its own problem? If they want to act before the US, go for it. What exactly aside from our 10Bn a year in aide do they need from us? Certainly we'd support their actions. This is why neo-conartists flaggergast everyone else. Its "don't get involved in overthrowing Khaddafi in Libya....BUT bomb Syria". Or "don't let the UN dictate or actions...BUT let one leader from one country decide that we need to fight his war for him". Good Lord people, can we have some consistancy?

Now as Kep alluded to, a good deal of righties are just along for the ride because they want to make Obama look bad, but think about it: if this sorta thing worked politically, wouldn't we be seeing the effects by now? The GOP has been trying to outsource US foreign policy in the Middle East to the Lukid Party at least since GWB and perhaps earlier than that.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Hopefully decisions like going to war won't be driven by campaign politics. My intuition is the Republicans (not the Neocons lurking in the basement, but the mainstream party) have no intention of actually going to war with Iran -- they know that would be ruinously expensive and destructive. They are stoking war fever to create an opening between Israel and the US which they can then exploit. They either don't realize or don't care that they are playing with fire. That kind of recklessness is worrisome.

Wanna bet? Mitt gets in and I bet we have more ships, more planes, and more troops in the Middle East than we do now.

 

[Rover]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Wanna bet? Mitt gets in and I bet we have more ships, more planes, and more troops in the Middle East than we do now.

Dead on accurate. People on the left and the right need to wake up to the fact that Republicans mean what they say. You WILL see a military buildup under Romney whether we need it or not. You WILL see taxs cuts for the wealthy paid for by Medicare recipients. This is in the plan they already voted for.

Its odd that libs are saying "take Republicans at their word" as a reason for not voting for them, and conservatives are saying "oh, don't believe everything they say, its just electioneering" as a reason for voting for them.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Bluster all you want, but don't pull the trigger.

It's amusing because Israel's defense minister (former PM Ehud Barak) thinks we're "more supportive" under Obama than he can ever remember.

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The video should probably come with a "consider the source" warning, since Blitzer does try to lead the interview a little too much, but it still is worth noting.

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

All Israel needs is a video showing Ahmadinejad wearing the rival gang's colors and Obama would all for popping a cap in his ***.

 

[5mn_Major]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

And I'll say again, why can't Israel solve its own problem?

Frankly the US playing cover for Israel has put us in the position we're in now. Over the years, the US on its own has gone against world opinion at the UN and this helped lay the groundwork today's 'outrage'. The invasion of Iraq, etc cemented the deal. At that point, a misunderstanding that in some way 'the US supports the film because we don't prosecute' is all it takes to push it over the edge.

The right must be happy with political problems in the mid east as it makes it seem like their solution of troops everywhere has any validity (when in reality troops everywhere is part of the cause).

 

[Rover]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Frankly the US playing cover for Israel has put us in the position we're in now. Over the years, the US on its own has gone against world opinion at the UN and this helped lay the groundwork today's 'outrage'. The invasion of Iraq, etc cemented the deal. At that point, a misunderstanding that in some way 'the US supports the film because we don't prosecute' is all it takes to push it over the edge.

The right must be happy with political problems in the mid east as it makes it seem like their solution of troops everywhere has any validity (when in reality troops everywhere is part of the cause).

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for supporting them. As the only true democracy over there, they do need our help and some aide $$$. Where I draw the line is when they feel entitled to rent the US military out to carry out missions on their behalf. They have a robust fighting force. If they feel threatened they should use it as they've done in the past.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

All Israel needs is a video showing Ahmadinejad wearing the rival gang's colors and Obama would all for popping a cap in his ***.

I don't show up in the political threads enough to know for sure... is this trolling, or are you the type that makes these kinds of comments somewhat seriously?

 

[bigblue_dl]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

I don't show up in the political threads enough to know for sure... is this trolling, or are you the type that makes these kinds of comments somewhat seriously?

I don't post in the political threads much either. Usually I just jump in to say something offensive.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

I don't post in the political threads much either. Usually I just jump in to say something offensive.

Ah. In that case... good work.

 

[Kepler]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for supporting them. As the only true democracy over there, they do need our help and some aide $$$. Where I draw the line is when they feel entitled to rent the US military out to carry out missions on their behalf. They have a robust fighting force. If they feel threatened they should use it as they've done in the past.

They will if they need to. It's in their national interest to have the World's Only Superpower influence the environment so they don't have to. There's nothing wrong with that.

We in turn, need to act according to our national interest.

 

[DaveStPaul]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

You really ought to pay occasional attention to what I'm saying.

I'm trying my best. But you're all over the place, man! It's tricky keeping up. One minute you're saying "when the Hellfire missiles begin to come down like raindrops at a picnic, you'll know who to blame"; and when I say that doesn't always work, you jump straight to "It's not my theory." I know it's not. That's why I said, "According to FF's theory . . . " So why'd you even join in, if you're going to pull the old It's Not My Theory when people start shooting holes in it?

And I'm not advocating that we be more like "China, Russia or Syria." Just pointing out a discreet example where an application of tough measures ended a hostage taking and evidently convinced the hostage takers to look elsewhere for victims.

Yeah, that too, the I'm Just Pointing Out Discreet Examples. You say stuff, then when I try to have a back-and-forth, you give me I'm Just Pointing Out Discreet Examples. So you're giving me both the It's Not My Theory and the I'm Just Pointing Out Discreet Examples, and you follow those up with You Really Ought To Pay Occasional Attention To What I'm Saying. Again, I'm trying as best I can. But it's tricky.

Speaking of "not holding up for 30 seconds of thinking,"your analysis is terribly flawed. The reason why Islamists haven't invaded the embassies of the countries you mentioned is because nobody on the world stage gives a sh*t about them. In this context, any comparison between the United States and Sweden or Norway is the kind of thing you'd hear in a freshman survey course for slow students. And gives ignorance a bad name.

Easy there! "You Give Ignorance A Bad Name" -- this is how you respond? Anyway, what about Denmark? I'd bet they'd make your list of countries nobody on the world stage gives a **** about. But their embassies were breached in Tehran in 2006, set afire in Beirut and attacked in Damascus, were bombed in Pakistan in 2008. Where would you file Denmark? "No one gives a **** about them"? "No one fears them, but they were attacked anyway"? "They responded to terrorist attacks diplomatically, and have mostly avoided further trouble"? How about All Of The Above?

As long as you're going to offer non sequitor examples of why the United States is an "evil empire" if it takes steps to avoid taking take nine inches of sandpaper dik everytime a mob of Islamist takes it into their heads to punish us, why not mention Lidice?

See, now it's just too easy. You're fastidious about "don't put words in my mouth / it's not MY theory!," but for me, questioning FF's theory is saying the US in an evil empire. Who can keep up with this?

We have clipped numerous Islamists using drones and shot the biggest Islamist of all in the face. Are we "more like China, Russia and Syria" as a result?

Now we're getting somewhere! Yes, that is exactly true, and a good rebuttal to my questions. But it also is true that we've clipped Islamists, used drones, etc., and terrorism has continued. All of these examples -- Libya, Egypt, Russia's tactics, China's tactics, Sweden and Norway vs Denmark, retribution working, retribution not working, diplomacy working, diplomacy not working -- all of them prove that this **** is complicated. My examples and yours.

So there you go. I did my best to keep up.

Also, don't take it so personally when I have a little back-and-forth. For me it's in good faith.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

Meanwhile, the world is awash in OMS (Offended Muslim Syndrome). Maybe Hillary can host the telethon.

http://thepeoplescube.com/current-truth/offended-muslim-syndrome-self-help-support-groups-t1621.html

 

[Old Pio]

Re: The 4th Global War on Terror - Deja vu all over again!

I'm trying my best. But you're all over the place, man! It's tricky keeping up. One minute you're saying "when the Hellfire missiles begin to come down like raindrops at a picnic, you'll know who to blame"; and when I say that doesn't always work, you jump straight to "It's not my theory." I know it's not. That's why I said, "According to FF's theory . . . " So why'd you even join in, if you're going to pull the old It's Not My Theory when people start shooting holes in it?



Yeah, that too, the I'm Just Pointing Out Discreet Examples. You say stuff, then when I try to have a back-and-forth, you give me I'm Just Pointing Out Discreet Examples. So you're giving me both the It's Not My Theory and the I'm Just Pointing Out Discreet Examples, and you follow those up with You Really Ought To Pay Occasional Attention To What I'm Saying. Again, I'm trying as best I can. But it's tricky.



Easy there! "You Give Ignorance A Bad Name" -- this is how you respond? Anyway, what about Denmark? I'd bet they'd make your list of countries nobody on the world stage gives a **** about. But their embassies were breached in Tehran in 2006, set afire in Beirut and attacked in Damascus, were bombed in Pakistan in 2008. Where would you file Denmark? "No one gives a **** about them"? "No one fears them, but they were attacked anyway"? "They responded to terrorist attacks diplomatically, and have mostly avoided further trouble"? How about All Of The Above?



See, now it's just too easy. You're fastidious about "don't put words in my mouth / it's not MY theory!," but for me, questioning FF's theory is saying the US in an evil empire. Who can keep up with this?



Now we're getting somewhere! Yes, that is exactly true, and a good rebuttal to my questions. But it also is true that we've clipped Islamists, used drones, etc., and terrorism has continued. All of these examples -- Libya, Egypt, Russia's tactics, China's tactics, Sweden and Norway vs Denmark, retribution working, retribution not working, diplomacy working, diplomacy not working -- all of them prove that this **** is complicated. My examples and yours.

So there you go. I did my best to keep up.

Also, don't take it so personally when I have a little back-and-forth. For me it's in good faith.

Lots of smoke, but no fire.