The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

[OnMAA]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

IMHO the quickest (and perhaps only) way to grow the game internationally and make the games more competitive would be for several NA players to represent some of these countries in these international competitions to make the games even watchable. Let's be real. 10-0 games are not watchable, they are painful, even for a dedicated women's hockey fan! And Canada is even beating up on Sweden as we speak to that magnitude.

How about sending some NA players with Chinese heritage there for a couple of years to bolster their squad? Starting up teams representing Great Britain, Italy, etc with a core of former NCAA players with those roots.

It's hard to imagine many girls in Russia or anywhere will take up a sport in which the game is not exciting, their teams are embarassed and fail to register even significant shots on goal.

There was a columnist from a major Toronto newspaper (who is also a strong feminist and sports reporter too), who said yesterday that these games are akin to strangling kittens. Her solution to ensure Womens hockey is not removed from the Olympics would be to do as they did in bobsled (I think it was), and allow Canada and US to enter 2 teams each. By splitting their talent in half in this way , this would help bridge the huge divide with remaining nations, as well as making the eventual medal winning teams and positions for each team far less obvious.

Great post and you might be on to something.....As an immigrant from Europe this might be an opportunity for my D's.

But seriously, not a bad idea. Countries like Italy and Germany used Canadian sons of imigrants on their national mens teams for years to help develop the game in the 70's and 80's to the next level there. Many ex Jr A players out of Canada not good enough to make the big show ended up playing the local semi-pro leagues in my home country when I was growing up over there many moons ago.

 

[Shipe Family]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

So enjoyed this game!

 

[5 4 Fighting]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

One of my own daughters who had the priviledge to play with MP in a tourney a few years ago told me today on the way to the rink....

Dad did you see Marie Philips Goal?. It's the same move she made when she played with us. Having seen the move live in the past, my question to her was...."what did the commentators say about it".

Note: I once saw her score 5 goals in a game, 3 of them with this move. Great to watch.

Nice player don't get me wrong. But with the proper defensive strategy against her I've seen her held to no points in more than one game when she was averaging nearly 2.2 ppg @ Dawson.

"Anyone can score ...it's stopping the other team from scoring that's the key" - Patty Gennell

 

[Hux]

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

If this Olympics shows that there are two elite teams and 4 - 6 teams of somewhat equal strength, I still think we will see an upsurge in the nations that could be contenders. A LOT can happen in 4 years if the resources are provided

This seems to be lost on a lot of people. Yes, the blowouts suck. But we have seen, despite the Canada-Sweden fiasco, that Finland and Sweden can throw a wrench into the works. The important thing is that the Chinese took a solid run at the apple cart against the Finns, and the party crashing Slovaks are holding their own against the Swiss.

The Federations know they are very likely to get the stuffing knocked out of them when they play the US or Canada. The object for them is to be competitive with the other teams. I am sure that the Chinese are tickled pink with the result against the Finns, and that the Slovaks are thinking "hey, we can make this work."

It ultimately comes down to how much coin the countries are willing to drop to improve their standing. If the resources are increased and put to good use we will see improvement. (As witnessed by the improvement in the results of the US team in the last four years) If not, then things will look really bleak in Sochi.

 

[Brian Schulz]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

At least a couple of current players that I am aware of are taking (or have taken) majors that point towards a career in broadcasting. Just like everything else it is going to take a bit but I expect that very soon there will be a talented charismatic polished broadcasting personality with absolutely top level playing experience doing very well the job that in my opinion AJ now does so poorly.

Obviously I'm biased here but in both 2006 and 2010, NBC provided zero on-air opportunities, coaching or training for AJ leading up to the Games. They auditioned 4-5 former Team USA players for one session in the fall before the Games and made their pick from there. She actually did try to get in as much practice as she could via working with me or the odd NESN game but none of that is going to compare to what an Olympic broadcast asks of someone on a game-to-game basis. You can study a ton and have the gift of gab but you need reps to hone your craft and there aren't many women's hockey players out there that have those or opportunities to get them. Not to mention developing chemistry with your play-by-play partner. NBC has the luxury of not having to invest anything in its commentators for a lot of the feature sports because there is regular TV coverage of those sports already. That isn't the case with women's hockey and hockey is a fairly difficult sport to call besides. And if I had to guess, the producers are probably actually telling AJ to talk more not less...I know that was the case in 2006 so she might be doing her best to follow orders.

 

[notfromaroundhere]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

Ya mean this goaltending?

BEMIDJI, Minn. -- Bemidji State University’s Alana McElhinney (So., G, Calgary, Alberta) and Tyler Lehrke (Sr., F, Park Rapids, Minn.) have been named Beaver Pride Athletes of the Week after outstanding athletic performances during the week of Feb. 8-14.

McElhinney backstopped the BSU women’s ice hockey team to a weekend split with University of North Dakota, allowing one goal all weekend. In Friday’s series opener, she made 36 saves before the Fighting Sioux netted their first goal of the game at the 14:28 mark of the third period. McElhinney went to the bench for an extra attacker, but BSU came up short and UND scored an empty netter with three seconds remaining in the game to claim a 2-0 victory. On Saturday night in Grand Forks, N.D., McElhinney posted a 17-save shutout to give the Beavers two valuable points to stay in the hunt for a home-playoff berth.

Yes, they are indeed blessed with goaltending talent, but actually I was asking for some more offense, please.

Clearly UND losing the twins was hurt more than BSU during the games.

 

[Hux]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

Obviously I'm biased here but in both 2006 and 2010, NBC provided zero on-air opportunities, coaching or training for AJ leading up to the Games. They auditioned 4-5 former Team USA players for one session in the fall before the Games and made their pick from there. She actually did try to get in as much practice as she could via working with me or the odd NESN game but none of that is going to compare to what an Olympic broadcast asks of someone on a game-to-game basis. You can study a ton and have the gift of gab but you need reps to hone your craft and there aren't many women's hockey players out there that have those or opportunities to get them. Not to mention developing chemistry with your play-by-play partner. NBC has the luxury of not having to invest anything in its commentators for a lot of the feature sports because there is regular TV coverage of those sports already. That isn't the case with women's hockey and hockey is a fairly difficult sport to call besides. And if I had to guess, the producers are probably actually telling AJ to talk more not less...I know that was the case in 2006 so she might be doing her best to follow orders.

Gotta figure the stakes get even higher when there is a blowout and the play by play goes by the wayside, making color/analysis a real high wire act.

 

[freak]

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

I think most here would agree that this was not Kim Martin's finest hour (approx 30 minutes, really).

If only she could have had that hour (30min) two years ago.

 

[ARM]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

And if I had to guess, the producers are probably actually telling AJ to talk more not less...I know that was the case in 2006 so she might be doing her best to follow orders.

I haven't had a problem with her. When watching a women's hockey broadcast, the expectation isn't that high. She's definitely better than an Ellen Weinberg. At least she knows what she is talking about. I'm more offended by the play-by-play guys who can't pronounce a name the same way twice. Was it Kenny Albert calling the Slovakia/Switzerland game? I didn't realize that there were so many different ways to say "Tomcikova".

Clearly UND losing the twins was hurt more than BSU during the games.

UND didn't lose the Lams to the Olympics -- the WCHA has a "sit a year" rule for transfers, so they weren't playing this year in Grand Forks in any case.

One thing I admire about Slovakia is that they've tried hard in both games I've seen them. They are at a serious talent deficit, but all you can ask of anybody is that they are willing to work.

 

[D2D]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

I've been thinking just the opposite after the games I've seen. I honestly don't recall ever seeing any team dominate games like the present TC has.

I hope you're right and I'm wrong.

I agree 100%. Canada looked absolutely awesome today, in every facet of the game. Granted, Sweden couldn't have played any worse, but Canada gave them no chance. I stopped watching when they hit double figures, against a team that I thought would put up a much better fight.

Still some games to be played before the final, but assuming no upsets before then, I hope you and me are both wrong.

 

[Trillium]

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

This seems to be lost on a lot of people. Yes, the blowouts suck. But we have seen, despite the Canada-Sweden fiasco, that Finland and Sweden can throw a wrench into the works. The important thing is that the Chinese took a solid run at the apple cart against the Finns, and the party crashing Slovaks are holding their own against the Swiss.

The Federations know they are very likely to get the stuffing knocked out of them when they play the US or Canada. The object for them is to be competitive with the other teams. I am sure that the Chinese are tickled pink with the result against the Finns, and that the Slovaks are thinking "hey, we can make this work."

It ultimately comes down to how much coin the countries are willing to drop to improve their standing. If the resources are increased and put to good use we will see improvement. (As witnessed by the improvement in the results of the US team in the last four years) If not, then things will look really bleak in Sochi.

This discussion is centered on how to grow the women's game outside of North America, and how the Olympics might help that. Certainly, 10 years ago, it had a very positive effect on registration here at home.

What I am even more concerned with is the impact in North America of the current situation. The game is stagnating: at least in Canada, it is now seeing declining registration.

The results of this competition are doing nothing to help
anymore, and might actually hurt it. Blowout games between Canada or US and the others are now a complete snoozefest that established fans don't want to watch. (And the poor female announcing on both sides of the border makes it that much more painful)

And although the games between the other teams might be competitive with one another, they frankly aren't a whole lot more watchable either. Some of these girls can't skate very well. There are major weaknesses in team play, an inability to make good basic decisions on what to do on the power play, and really poor defense. When the quality of play of most Olympic teams is inferior to that of several teams of local high school aged players at home, (which no one other than parents currently watch either even though it's more exciting), it does NOTHING to represent the quality or potential of the women's game, much less help promote it to another incoming generation.

I really hate to rain on the parade, but something drastic needs to be done if anyone cares about salvaging this as an Olympic sport.

 

[OnMAA]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

Nice player don't get me wrong. But with the proper defensive strategy against her I've seen her held to no points in more than one game when she was averaging nearly 2.2 ppg @ Dawson.

"Anyone can score ...it's stopping the other team from scoring that's the key" - Patty Gennell

Agree that you can focus on defense strategies to try and stop a standout player like her. I'm sure all teams facing Dawson last year tried to do this, but many failed, either cause they did not have the horses to do it, or Dawson had other weapons to compensate. Dawson this year without her and two other studs is not the same team.

 

[Shipe Family]

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

This discussion is centered on how to grow the women's game outside of North America, and how the Olympics might help that. Certainly, 10 years ago, it had a very positive effect on registration here at home.

What I am even more concerned with is the impact in North America of the current situation. The game is stagnating: at least in Canada, it is now seeing declining registration.

The results of this competition are doing nothing to help
anymore, and might actually hurt it. Blowout games between Canada or US and the others are now a complete snoozefest that established fans don't want to watch. (And the poor female announcing on both sides of the border makes it that much more painful)

And although the games between the other teams might be competitive with one another, they frankly aren't a whole lot more watchable either. Some of these girls can't skate very well. There are major weaknesses in team play, an inability to make good basic decisions on what to do on the power play, and really poor defense. When the quality of play of most Olympic teams is inferior to that of several teams of local high school aged players at home, (which no one other than parents currently watch either even though it's more exciting), it does NOTHING to represent the quality or potential of the women's game, much less help promote it to another incoming generation.

I really hate to rain on the parade, but something drastic needs to be done if anyone cares about salvaging this as an Olympic sport.

Perhaps if Canada and America would just fall in line with the rest of the world and stop centralizing its players, using state-of-the-art training, and playing 30 plus games schedule they could salvage the future of this Olympic sport.

Seriously, the preliminary round isn't even wrapped yet. Anyone that watched the 2006 semis realize, it isn't over til its over. I plan on watching every moment of the Olympics and cheering on each and every person involved--including AJ and Cassie.

 

[notfromaroundhere]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

I haven't had a problem with her. When watching a women's hockey broadcast, the expectation isn't that high. She's definitely better than an Ellen Weinberg. At least she knows what she is talking about. I'm more offended by the play-by-play guys who can't pronounce a name the same way twice. Was it Kenny Albert calling the Slovakia/Switzerland game? I didn't realize that there were so many different ways to say "Tomcikova".

UND didn't lose the Lams to the Olympics -- the WCHA has a "sit a year" rule for transfers, so they weren't playing this year in Grand Forks in any case.

One thing I admire about Slovakia is that they've tried hard in both games I've seen them. They are at a serious talent deficit, but all you can ask of anybody is that they are willing to work.

I stand corrected with regards to the twins eligibility. I do think though that the twins will add more to UND when they arrive than Tomcikova will add to BSU when she returns. And as we saw late in the game, a goalie can only take you so far.

Also agree with the assessment regarding Slovakia. I think the only difference is depth between them and the other European teams. Top line seemed quite good. The Chinese seem to be the grittiest of the non-NA bunch.

As to the pronounciation of Tomcikova, I think they needed to spend an extra 30 minutes practicing all of the names on the squad with flash cards before the game. Some of the names were a mouthful for English speaking announcers.

 

[Skate79]

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

This discussion is centered on how to grow the women's game outside of North America, and how the Olympics might help that. Certainly, 10 years ago, it had a very positive effect on registration here at home.

What I am even more concerned with is the impact in North America of the current situation. The game is stagnating: at least in Canada, it is now seeing declining registration.

The results of this competition are doing nothing to help
anymore, and might actually hurt it. Blowout games between Canada or US and the others are now a complete snoozefest that established fans don't want to watch. (And the poor female announcing on both sides of the border makes it that much more painful)

And although the games between the other teams might be competitive with one another, they frankly aren't a whole lot more watchable either. Some of these girls can't skate very well. There are major weaknesses in team play, an inability to make good basic decisions on what to do on the power play, and really poor defense. When the quality of play of most Olympic teams is inferior to that of several teams of local high school aged players at home, (which no one other than parents currently watch either even though it's more exciting), it does NOTHING to represent the quality or potential of the women's game, much less help promote it to another incoming generation.

I really hate to rain on the parade, but something drastic needs to be done if anyone cares about salvaging this as an Olympic sport.

I got hooked on women's hockey by watching the Nagano Olympics and have followed women's hockey ever since. IMHO, the women's game has come a long way in the 10+ years I've been watching with speed and skill being the most noticeable areas of improvement. Last year's Frozen Four was great fun even though attendance wasn't that great.

That said, I agree that watching blowouts doesn't do anyone any favors. Attendance hasn't increased measurably even though at Harvard, the program continues to produce solid, exciting teams. At this point, I'd rather watch Liza Ryabkina and Kate Buesser dash around the ice than anyone from our men's team. I'm serious.

On an international level, I would hope that funding continues to flow into these programs. Perhaps some international exchange could be developed and sponsored by USA Hockey and the Canadian Ice Hockey Federation (I'm just reaching here for a title) to help these countries get up to speed. Better coaching, better equipment, available ice time and lots of skill drills will go a long way towards making a more competitive Olympics. Angela Ruggerio has been a goodwill ambassador for the game reaching out to communities to promote women's hockey. We need more of that to be structured and consistent so that parents know their daughters will be playing well into their teens and twenties.

 

[IceIsNice]

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Perhaps if Canada and America would just fall in line with the rest of the world and stop centralizing its players, using state-of-the-art training, and playing 30 plus games schedule they could salvage the future of this Olympic sport.

You broke my sarcasm detector! This was off the charts!

But seriously, even the men's game takes knocks due to the lack of a centralized effort to prepare. Isn't it afterall a team sport, and aren't the Olympics not meant to be simply a series of "all-star games".

Iceisnice's naive thought of the day:

Maybe the rule for participation ought to simply be that the team that's entered has to be organized as such and perform as such for some period of time immediately leading up to the start of the games. I don't know....off the top of my head and without studying a calendar, let's say a 5 month preparatory and performance period was required. For both genders, I think this would better prepare teams as "teams" (you know, like...there's no "I" in "team"? remember the true definition of that word?).

 

[DC78-82]

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

You broke my sarcasm detector! This was off the charts!

But seriously, even the men's game takes knocks due to the lack of a centralized effort to prepare. Isn't it afterall a team sport, and aren't the Olympics not meant to be simply a series of "all-star games".

Iceisnice's naive thought of the day:

Maybe the rule for participation ought to simply be that the team that's entered has to be organized as such and perform as such for some period of time immediately leading up to the start of the games. I don't know....off the top of my head and without studying a calendar, let's say a 5 month preparatory and performance period was required. For both genders, I think this would better prepare teams as "teams" (you know, like...there's no "I" in "team"? remember the true definition of that word?).

Maybe the teams that qualified for the Games should pool their funds and all train together I

 

[DC78-82]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

Has an American ever played hockey on a Canadian college hockey team or a Brazilian college volleyball team or a Swedish college tennis team? Why are American universities the caretakers of the world's olympic athletes? Why is Northern Iowa University responsible for feeding, housing and training Kenyan long-distance runners and Lithuanian basketball players? I guess I just don't understand the global economy of sport....

I know that Granato, and possibly a few others who had exhausted their US college eligibility prior to the '98 Games, went to schools like Mc Gill and Concordia to earn their Master's and played hockey for them. At that time there were very few post-collegiate options either here or in Canada for aspiring Olympian / elite athletes.

 

[joegrav]

Re: The 2010 Winter Olympics Women's Ice Hockey Tournament

13-1? Seriously?

I DVR'd that game thinking it would be a good one to watch.

Guess I can delete it and clear some space for bobsledding.

Jesus Christ.

 

[OnMAA]

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

Re: and get your mind out of the gutter. or at least leave me out of it

I got hooked on women's hockey by watching the Nagano Olympics and have followed women's hockey ever since. IMHO, the women's game has come a long way in the 10+ years I've been watching with speed and skill being the most noticeable areas of improvement. Last year's Frozen Four was great fun even though attendance wasn't that great.

That said, I agree that watching blowouts doesn't do anyone any favors. Attendance hasn't increased measurably even though at Harvard, the program continues to produce solid, exciting teams. At this point, I'd rather watch Liza Ryabkina and Kate Buesser dash around the ice than anyone from our men's team. I'm serious.

On an international level, I would hope that funding continues to flow into these programs. Perhaps some international exchange could be developed and sponsored by USA Hockey and the Canadian Ice Hockey Federation (I'm just reaching here for a title) to help these countries get up to speed. Better coaching, better equipment, available ice time and lots of skill drills will go a long way towards making a more competitive Olympics. Angela Ruggerio has been a goodwill ambassador for the game reaching out to communities to promote women's hockey. We need more of that to be structured and consistent so that parents know their daughters will be playing well into their teens and twenties.

Great post and Agree with your line of thinking, as per my prior postings on this subject yesterday.

To answer your question, it is HC = Hockey Canada.


P.S. Remember seeing Ryabkina play with the PB team. Always liked the way she played the game, and her skillset.