Save Uah Hockey!

[tnlong]

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

... What are they going to do: mandate that every team visit Huntsville within the next five years?
...

Since UAH is so far out of the way that no conference wants them, one thing that could be done is to adding an "extra game(s) on the schedule" provision specifically for UAH Hockey.

 

[owslachief]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

Since some folks noticed that we made the front page of The Huntsville Times, but the article isn't on AL.com [Why? Who knows.], I got permission to re-print the article: http://saveuahhockey.com/2009/08/16/reprint-can-uah-hockey-survive/

Very little new ground plowed, but it becomes quite obvious that Forrest Karr is on the Chargers' side. We appreciate that. Go Nanooks!

GFM

“I can’t discuss how the vote went,” said Alaska-Fairbanks Athletic Director Forrest Karr, a member of hte council. “But, I’ve been a main advocate for Huntsville throughout this process.

Incredible. So the guy whose team would be on the complete opposite end of CCHA's graph from UAH, and whose program pays for teams to visit doesn't have a problem with UAH joining?

What REALLY is going on with the other reps. present during the vote?

 

[MinnesotaNorthStar]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

Actually, "Nanook" means polar bear, not Inuit or Eskimo, as many believe. So far the polar bears haven't complained to UAF. I think they have bigger things to worry about.

Whoooooooosh.

So taking two instead of four is stepping up? If AHA had been willing to take all four we wouldn't be in this mess. Don't make them out to be the nice guys in this one. The four CHA schools made a very solid proposal to merge with AHA to which they said thanks but no thanks. So then they went ahead and took Niagara and Robert Morris leaving UAH and Bemidji floating in the wind.

Taking all four would have meant a 14 team conference...

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Since UAH is so far out of the way that no conference wants them, one thing that could be done is to adding an "extra game(s) on the schedule" provision specifically for UAH Hockey.

That may be a Pandora's box. Suddenly, you get an exemption when you don't have to leave the lower 48? How would Denver's and USAFA's lacrosse programs feel about that, considering that they're the only lacrosse programs west of Indiana? Where do you continue to draw the line here? How do you define that UAH Hockey warrants special consideration, but not any other programs in other less-popular sports that might be far away from the other schools in their sport?

Perhaps I shouldn't say that there's nothing for the NCAA to do here, but anything they do would have to be air-tight and very specific. Otherwise, the NCAA will get a lot of knocking on their door asking for exemptions in their sport.

 

[MikeAnderson]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

Since UAH is so far out of the way that no conference wants them, one thing that could be done is to adding an "extra game(s) on the schedule" provision specifically for UAH Hockey.

That's a precedent that the NCAA is not going to be willing to set. If they do, then why not for Air Force in lacrosse or water polo?

It was enough of a can of worms when the NCAA allowed ice hockey (along with other similarly situated sports) to bend the automatic-bid rules such that the D1 championships committee is considering altering or rescinding those provisions.

 

[gfmorris]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

I just had lunch with Danton Cole. He just got back from Slovakia last night, but suffice it to say that everything he hears at the school is that we're not cooked yet, and we're not folding our program. That commitment starts at the top, too.

Geof

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

What REALLY is going on with the other reps. present during the vote?

Cost reduction, I guess. UAH may not make any more or less money for the other CCHA schools compared to UNO, but having UAH vs. having 11 teams means one less long trip. That's the only reason that makes any sort of sense.

That and some of the smaller Michigan/Ohio schools can't draw fans on their own merits and need to be playing Michigan in order to get a good crowd. Thus, they want a smaller league with more Michigan games.

 

[tnlong]

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

... Short of something illegal, there's nothing that the NCAA can do to make sure that UAH survives. They can't force a conference to accept them. They can't tell UAH not to fold when it will likely be next to impossible to survive as an independent. What are they going to do: ...

One thing that "they" could do is to reserve one slot in the NCAA D1 tournament for independents, in fact creating a defacto conference with unlimited free membership open to all. Although scheduling is obviously the major driving factor for conferences, a lot of the MAAC/AH/CHA turmoil may have unfolded differently if independents had something/anything in their favor. Although it may not have been an official slot, didn't the NCAA generally select the top independent for the tournament before the Alaskas found a home?

 

[bigmrg74]

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

That may be a Pandora's box. Suddenly, you get an exemption when you don't have to leave the lower 48? How would Denver's and USAFA's lacrosse programs feel about that, considering that they're the only lacrosse programs west of Indiana? Where do you continue to draw the line here? How do you define that UAH Hockey warrants special consideration, but not any other programs in other less-popular sports that might be far away from the other schools in their sport?

Perhaps I shouldn't say that there's nothing for the NCAA to do here, but anything they do would have to be air-tight and very specific. Otherwise, the NCAA will get a lot of knocking on their door asking for exemptions in their sport.

Yep, The NCAA probably would be better off going to every single president and AD within D1 Ice Hockey that if Huntsville folds, then the NCAA will be then forced to drop the tournament to 12 teams. With the death of the CHA, there would be one more at-large berth to be had. Surely there are a lot of mid-level schools from the WCHA, Hockey East, and the ECAC that would be really perturbed if the tournament now lost four at-large berths. At best, those schools leaning on the CCHA schools get Huntsville into that stable. And at the least, it would be a strong encouragement for teams from the other conferences to at least make one trip south pretty soon. One weekend in Alabama would seem like a pretty small price to pay for a shot at one of the last spots into the Dance.

 

[tnlong]

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

...Perhaps I shouldn't say that there's nothing for the NCAA to do here, but anything they do would have to be air-tight and very specific. Otherwise, the NCAA will get a lot of knocking on their door asking for exemptions in their sport.

Is it bad to expect them to do a little work to earn their $$? Let's say the rule could read something like "If a team has aggressively pursued all reasonable avenues for admission to a conference and no conference is willing to accept them, special consideration may be given to that program (after formal application under sec. _) by allowing any team that wants to schedule a game with them an extra game on that team's schedule".

 

[4four4]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

I just had lunch with Danton Cole. He just got back from Slovakia last night, but suffice it to say that everything he hears at the school is that we're not cooked yet, and we're not folding our program. That commitment starts at the top, too.

Geof

Good news.

The only thing good about what happened last week is everybody in college hockey is talking about UAH. They have gotten more press this summer over anything in the last twenty five years. Granted it is bad press but people are writing and talking about UAH.

I hope they find a home.

 

[gfmorris]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

Good news.

The only thing good about what happened last week is everybody in college hockey is talking about UAH. They have gotten more press this summer over anything in the last twenty five years. Granted it is bad press but people are writing and talking about UAH.

I hope they find a home.

More good news: one of my goons/fellow alumni cold-called Tom Anastos. Tom called him back and explained the league's position. Tom also said, "If you guys want a scheduling alliance, now is the time." So my goon went to talk to Coach, but he was at lunch with me. Suffice it to say that I was on the phone with Danton right after that.

My day is looking up.

GFM

 

[burgie12]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

One thing that "they" could do is to reserve one slot in the NCAA D1 tournament for independents, in fact creating a defacto conference with unlimited free membership open to all.

That would inspire even more ridiculous rules and rule-bending adventures. What incentive does a team have to schedule twenty-plus games if they'll get an auto-bid at 10 games? Why would mid-level ECAC / WCHA / CCHA schools schedule a game against a team that could steal their at-large bid if they get enough games?

I mean, I've only followed the game for two years, and I really want to see UAH survive, but I don't think that's the way to do it.

I just had lunch with Danton Cole. He just got back from Slovakia last night, but suffice it to say that everything he hears at the school is that we're not cooked yet, and we're not folding our program. That commitment starts at the top, too.

Geof

Good news... I hope they find a home.

Agreed

 

[MikeAnderson]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

That would inspire even more ridiculous rules and rule-bending adventures. What incentive does a team have to schedule twenty-plus games if they'll get an auto-bid at 10 games? Why would mid-level ECAC / WCHA / CCHA schools schedule a game against a team that could steal their at-large bid if they get enough games?

The NCAA mandates a minimum of 20 regular-season games played in order to be eligible for NCAA Tournament play.

 

[burgie12]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

The NCAA mandates a minimum of 20 regular-season games played in order to be eligible for NCAA Tournament play.

Thank you. Did not realize that.

 

[IrishHockeyFan]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

Incredible. So the guy whose team would be on the complete opposite end of CCHA's graph from UAH, and whose program pays for teams to visit doesn't have a problem with UAH joining?

What REALLY is going on with the other reps. present during the vote?

That's what is so important in this. Perhaps knowing that 5 or 6 CCHA schools were already against adding UAH made it easy for Alaska -- a school in somewhat similar situations when it comes to things like travel arrangements -- to be in favor. Mind you I'm not saying I think this is what is going on, just adding it to the pot of speculation.

The biggest disservice in all of this, at least the biggest after what would be a sad and needless loss of yet another D1 team, is the mystery surrounding it all. I want to know what factors and information all these institutions used in coming to this conclusion. Hell, all but one is supported by public funds, which leads me to believe we have the RIGHT to a little more information.

 

[Goon]

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Trend lines don't lie; D1 hockey is in a lot of trouble.
With no mechanism for adding new programs, D1 hockey is in a lot of trouble.
If the NCAA is willing to let a viable D1 hockey program disappear because other teams don't won't them playing in their sandbox, D1 hockey is in a lot of trouble.

Really, do you have any data to back up this claim? The WCHA is doing fine financially. They had almost record numbers in March for the Final Five. You might want to rephrase that as some teams in the CCHA might be in Financial trouble.

 

[gfmorris]

Re: Save Uah Hockey!

That's what is so important in this. Perhaps knowing that 5 or 6 CCHA schools were already against adding UAH made it easy for Alaska -- a school in somewhat similar situations when it comes to things like travel arrangements -- to be in favor. Mind you I'm not saying I think this is what is going on, just adding it to the pot of speculation.

Karr was on our side regardless. I'm pretty darn sure of that.

Also, I have the feeling that it was only four schools against.

GFM

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Really, do you have any data to back up this claim? The WCHA is doing fine financially. They had almost record numbers in March for the Final Five. You might want to rephrase that as some teams in the CCHA might be in Financial trouble.

Well, we'd be losing the 5th program of this decade, with a possibility of losing more. That's not exactly good. Beyond that, if we lose any more programs, the NCAA may see to it that we go back to a 12-team playoff. That's not good either.

Who have we added since the mid-90s that replaces the loss of Kent St, UIC, Fairfield, Findlay, Iona, Wayne St and (maybe) UAH and BGSU? The MAAC schools?

The big dogs might be doing just fantastic, but if we're bleeding programs then the D-I game cannot possibly be considered to be doing well.

 

[Ralph Baer]

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Re: Save Uah Hockey! - a lot of troubles in the D1 hockey world

Well, we'd be losing the 5th program of this decade, with a possibility of losing more. That's not exactly good. Beyond that, if we lose any more programs, the NCAA may see to it that we go back to a 12-team playoff. That's not good either.

Who have we added since the mid-90s that replaces the loss of Kent St, UIC, Fairfield, Findlay, Iona, Wayne St and (maybe) UAH and BGSU? The MAAC schools?

The big dogs might be doing just fantastic, but if we're bleeding programs then the D-I game cannot possibly be considered to be doing well.

We did add RIT, and I think that WSU was both added and lost.