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Sandusky/Penn State scandal

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Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

WeAreNDHockey said:
Not that Old Pio needs defending from me (I'm inclined to wonder if he would be rushing to defend Paterno if JoePa was a well known liberal instead of a well known Republican), but where in that story does it say Paterno knows any more or any less than anyone has speculated so far? In fact I'm inclined to feel if the story is accurate, it tends to exonerate him to a certain extent. If he "knew long ago" that would tend to implicate him and would make a generous package less likely.
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Its all speculation,Lets assume the article is accurate. Penn State doesn't want him saying anything so either he knew long ago or he knew Penn state didn't do their job, either way is ****ing to Joe Pa. I obviously don't know the truth neither does anyone but Joe Pa and others at Penn State.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

WeAreNDHockey said:
Not that Old Pio needs defending from me (I'm inclined to wonder if he would be rushing to defend Paterno if JoePa was a well known liberal instead of a well known Republican), but where in that story does it say Paterno knows any more or any less than anyone has speculated so far? In fact I'm inclined to feel if the story is accurate, it tends to exonerate him to a certain extent. If he "knew long ago" that would tend to implicate him and would make a generous package less likely.
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I'm kinda confused about what you are asking- are you talking about the stories that are being written, or the Grand Jury document? In the Grand Jury's opinion, the Graduate Assistant and his dad reported what he witnessed in the shower. Was there more than that? Or the speculation that he knew more and before that.

Certainly, the speculation of more and before is pure speculation, and should not be taken into account.

I'm stilll shocked that it's taken this long, even after two investigations by the State (according to the Grand Jury document). And the fact that there are repored victims after both investigations.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

Old Pio said:
They can probably find some justification if they really want to. Do they really want to?
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I think if they want to set an example...they might. Covering up felonies is not something the NCAA is likely to look kindly upon.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

alfablue said:
I'm kinda confused about what you are asking- are you talking about the stories that are being written, or the Grand Jury document? In the Grand Jury's opinion, the Graduate Assistant and his dad reported what he witnessed in the shower. Was there more than that? Or the speculation that he knew more and before that.

Certainly, the speculation of more and before is pure speculation, and should not be taken into account.

I'm stilll shocked that it's taken this long, even after two investigations by the State (according to the Grand Jury document). And the fact that there are repored victims after both investigations.
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I'm speaking strictly of the linked article/blogpost J.D. provided. To say it looks more and more like JoePa knew long ago while quoting the post with the link to chatsports makes it look very much like walrus believes that article says something it does not say. My apologies if that wasn't the point walrus was making.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

WeAreNDHockey said:
Not that Old Pio needs defending from me (I'm inclined to wonder if he would be rushing to defend Paterno if JoePa was a well known liberal instead of a well known Republican), but where in that story does it say Paterno knows any more or any less than anyone has speculated so far? In fact I'm inclined to feel if the story is accurate, it tends to exonerate him to a certain extent. If he "knew long ago" that would tend to implicate him and would make a generous package less likely.
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Paterno's political beliefs are news to me. So you can "wonder" all you want. And I guess I have to explain it again, since some folks haven't been paying attention. If by "defending Joe Paterno," you mean not lynching him and driving him out of a job without even a chance of explaining himself, then yes, I'm defending Joe Paterno. As I said before, lynch mobs are always impatient. And that's what many of our posters have become. There's plenty of time to grind Joe Paterno into dust. Why is it so all fired important to do it before he's even given a chance to give his side of the story?
 
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Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

WeAreNDHockey said:
I'm speaking strictly of the linked article/blogpost J.D. provided. To say it looks more and more like JoePa knew long ago while quoting the post with the link to chatsports makes it look very much like walrus believes that article says something it does not say. My apologies if that wasn't the point walrus was making.
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That's ok- I just wanted to clarify. Totally agree about the stories and blogspots. The only thing that should be gone with is the Grand Jury docuemnts- that's the only solid research with evidence. Other than that, it's about trying to appeal to some kind of reader.

Not to say that there are not some odd things that has happened- like the investigations that didn't lead anywhere. Well, until now.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

Almington said:
What would you throw them in jail for? They didn't break any laws - they satisfied all the legal requirements for what they were supposed to do in that case.

As for if they did everything that they were morally obligated to do, I think that the fact that everything didn't end right then and there means that these people didn't meet those obligations and they are justifiably being roasted over the coals of public opinion. At the end of the day they have to live with what they did and didn't do to meet their moral obligations to society.

If the PSU AD and VP who didn't even do their legal, let alone moral, obligations had followed through no one would be questioning if Paterno and the graduate assistant had done enough.

That said, I think that there are still large questions about what Paterno knew and when he knew it and what, if any, roll he may have played in the cover-up to protect the reputation of the program and himself.

From my perspective the graduate assistant was in a no win situation: either he does nothing and has to live with that or the rest of his life or he raises the alarm on what he saw and given the response of the PSU administration I can't believe that they would have supported him so his career as a coach would have been over. Paterno is the one with the reputation and the power to have made sure that action was taken on this and I think that it is fair to ask why he did not make sure that sufficient and appropriate action was taken.
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My emotional response to a legal problem.

Now that I've thought about it for a while...

JoePa and everyone else who knew about this at any point needs to go. Completely clean house. The fact remains that people knew about this back as early as 1998 and 2002 and Sandusky was on campus as recently as this year. This does not compute.

The legal obligations may have been met by Joe Paterno, the graduate assistant, etc. but the moral obligations were not. Not by a long shot. THese people had the moral obligation to bring this to the light of day. You could be **** sure if the local police didn't do anything, I'd have gone up the ladder. Why these people didn't do that is BEYOND me.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

1. Joe Pa reported the incident to his boss, who he TRUSTED.
2. Boss says, we got this, it's being taken care of.
3. No reason NOT to trust your TRUSTED BOSS.
4. Turns out that trusted boss lied. Ooops.

How was JoePa supposed to know? He trusted that the job was being done, because he had no other reason to think otherwise.

Now, the gag order thing: obviously PSU doesn't want anything messing up this thing any further. Whether that means that JoePa knew more, or didn't know anything, we will not know. JoePa leaving is most likely a PR move, to show that "PSU is indeed cleaning house." Something like this, warranted or not, would have been mentioned with every mention of JoePa's name.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

Brenthoven said:
1. Joe Pa reported the incident to his boss, who he TRUSTED.
2. Boss says, we got this, it's being taken care of.
3. No reason NOT to trust your TRUSTED BOSS.
4. Turns out that trusted boss lied. Ooops.

How was JoePa supposed to know? He trusted that the job was being done, because he had no other reason to think otherwise.
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Is this what you believe is true, or is it what you think is the carefully crafted PSU/JoePa narrative? Because I think there's way too much stuff out there to believe that it's true.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

Craig P. said:
Is this what you believe is true, or is it what you think is the carefully crafted PSU/JoePa narrative? Because I think there's way too much stuff out there to believe that it's true.
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This is what I got from the grand jury report, which I read.

And as I have said throughout, if JoePa did know more, I'll step up and say I'm wrong. It's too bad we probably will never find out how much he knew.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

Brenthoven said:
1. Joe Pa reported the incident to his boss, who he TRUSTED.
2. Boss says, we got this, it's being taken care of.
3. No reason NOT to trust your TRUSTED BOSS.
4. Turns out that trusted boss lied. Ooops.

How was JoePa supposed to know? He trusted that the job was being done, because he had no other reason to think otherwise.

Now, the gag order thing: obviously PSU doesn't want anything messing up this thing any further. Whether that means that JoePa knew more, or didn't know anything, we will not know. JoePa leaving is most likely a PR move, to show that "PSU is indeed cleaning house." Something like this, warranted or not, would have been mentioned with every mention of JoePa's name.
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I think there's a better than even chance this would have been his last season under any circumstances. How long did A. A. Stagg coach? Certainly there aren't too many seasons left in the tank. And why and how are so many of us certain that what the record reflects is "all" Joe did? The grand jury document is merely an outline of his testimony, not a daily rundown on his every contact on this matter. Nor a transcript.

This is no laughing matter. But I remember what Bette Midler said: "When I die, the first line of my obituary is going to be:" "Bette Midler, who discovered a cure for cancer and got her start in the Continental Baths, died today. . ." Whether he deserves it or not, Paterno's reputation is trashed forever.
 
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Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

What do you call an older woman who chases younger men?...... A cougar.

What do you call an older man who chases young boys?...... A Nittany Lion.

In all seriousness, I'll go out and say it's a **** shame that this is what is going to bring JoePa down. That isn't me trying to knock down the main cause, as that is an awful/horrible/(insert more powerful word here) thing to happen to anybody, let alone young boys. However a truly legendary coach is most likely not going to be able to go on his own terms, despite not doing anything illegal. Do I think he should have pressed the issue further/higher up? Probably, however I/we don't know exactly how things went down, and regardless, I'm going to go forward with the belief that JoePa was, and still is, a great coach, and maybe the greatest that I'll see in my lifetime.
 
Re: Sandusky/Penn State scandal

I feel awful for Penn State fans. When something as indefensible and heinous as this happens, I think you should be allowed a do-over and get to pick a new team. No one would blame them.

Victim count being reported possibly as high as 20 now.
 
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