Patty Kaz 2012

[ARM]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

The first edition of USA Hockey's Kaz Watch: Knight knows scoring.

Revisiting what Dave said a month ago ...

There needs to be a case for Hilary to win the award, without resorting to career achievement. That's not to say career achievement is irrelevant -- the way I'd put it, it matters in terms of how voters will rationalize their choices. But there needs to be a strong case, e.g. Meghan Agosta was not able to win because there wasn't a strong enough argument for her in any one season.

I do believe there is a case for Hilary at the moment. I laid it out before. The WCHA stats, the 17 goals, while the next best is JLam with 13 and everyone else is 11 or fewer -- that stands out for me, plus the context of those goals. The Minnesota games right after break are crucial. Hilary was 0-0-0 in the first Minnesota series. It'd be hard to win the Kaz if you're scoreless in 4 close games against your top rival.

In the Minnesota series to start out 2012, Knight had the only goal in the shootout in Game 1; she was shut out along with her team in the second game. So her line for the four Minnesota games is in fact 0-0-0. Contrast that with the line from four Minnesota games for Brooke Ammerman (3-3-6), Brianna Decker (1-5-6), or Carolyne Prévost (3-4-7). Last weekend in the UND series, Knight had a 0-3-3 line, again below the top line of Ammerman (2-4-6), Decker (3-2-5) and Prévost (4-3-7). Much of this isn't Knight's fault, as the other three are playing together while she is with Brittany Ammerman and Madison Packer. But had Prévost stayed healthy, Knight would be the fourth-leading scorer on her team, and the Kaz typically doesn't go to players who take one for the team. Krissy Wendell spent over half of the 2003-04 season on the Gophers' "2nd" line, and that kept her out of the Kaz top 3 (Angela Ruggiero, Jenny Potter, Chanda Gunn), and she was clearly the best player in terms of numbers on the best team.

 

[northhockey]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

j lam knows scoring, she leads the nation is points per game. and her team which relies on the twins, has been in the top 10 all year, and should make the ncaa tourney for the first time in history. take her off the team, and i dont see it

 

[ManBehindTheCurtain]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

The one that scares me EVERY SINGLE TIME she touches the puck is Hilary Knight. She may not end up with the best stats but she is absolutely the best player.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

 

[Blackbeard]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

The one that scares me EVERY SINGLE TIME she touches the puck is Hilary Knight. She may not end up with the best stats but she is absolutely the best player.

Totally agree.

 

[PTS34]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

The one that scares me EVERY SINGLE TIME she touches the puck is Hilary Knight. She may not end up with the best stats but she is absolutely the best player.

Just my opinion, I could be wrong.

Yeah it's just an opinion. Knight may be to the most "dangerous" player when she's out there but that doesn't make her the best and certainly not the most complete. Decker is not only the Badger's top point producer, but she's got it all. Plays all three zones, wins battles, wins faceoffs, is clutch (though Knight certainly is to). Not to mention her passing and shooting that has made her such a productive player... Like I said before, she'd seriously be a candidate with just half the number of points she has; she's that complete a player. Knight is a phenomenal talent, but she's not as complete as Decker and isn't even outscoring her at this point. However, I wouldn't be that surprised if she did end up winning in the end.

Also how is it that there's been no mention of Amanda Kessel? There's someone that will definitely make the top 26 and very likely the top ten too.

 

[mercyfan]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Just like to point out.. that yes J-Lam leads the nation in points.. but she does not lead the nation in points per game. This column belongs to Bailey Bram.. so just wondering why there is no mentions for her?

 

[brookyone]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Just like to point out.. that yes J-Lam leads the nation in points.. but she does not lead the nation in points per game. This column belongs to Bailey Bram.. so just wondering why there is no mentions for her?

Possibly because you haven't weighed in 'til now.

 

[northhockey]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Just like to point out.. that yes J-Lam leads the nation in points.. but she does not lead the nation in points per game. This column belongs to Bailey Bram.. so just wondering why there is no mentions for her?

Bram should be considered. But I believe J Lam has an edge because of the higher talent she faces.

 

[ARM]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Now that we're heading into the break, I thought I'd start a thread for this season's Patty Kazmaier trophy. Bailey Bram, Hilary Knight, Brooke Ammerman, Brianna Decker, Amanda Kessel, or one of the Lamoureuxs? Who will it be this year?

All the names mentioned would deserve the Patty Kaz if they win it. I will put in my observations for Bailey Bram of Mercyhurst...

CHA
Bram, Mercyhurst, Sr., F...

...Mercyhurst
Bram +26
PP Points: Bram 9-9-18 (next best on Mercyhurst 11)

... Cornell 5, Mercyhurst 4
Bram has a game-tying PP Goal in 3rd period. Fortino scores the game-winner at 17:30.

Mercyhurst 5, Cornell 2
Bram has three assists, including primary assist on the lasting lead goal.

Mercyhurst 3, BC 2 (OT)
Bram assists on OT game-winner.

The race for the top 3 is still very wide open, though I suspect Bram and Johnston are probably the only serious contenders outside the WCHA.

Guess who has 5 points. Yep, Bram. Mercyhurst rolling all lines.

Umm...ok.....anyway, Bram (who should be a top 10 finalist) ended up with 6 points.

Re: Bram, she's definitely in contention. For her to win the award, Bram has to keep her current scoring pace. Mercyhurst has to win out or come close. The Feb. 7 rubber match against Cornell is huge for the candidacy of both Bram & Johnston -- neither wins the award without a victory and a standout performance in that game.

Bram got hurt tonight about 4 shifts into the game.. still was able to put up 3 points in 4 shifts.. good for her.. does anyone know if she will be okay or anything?

Just like to point out.. that yes J-Lam leads the nation in points.. but she does not lead the nation in points per game. This column belongs to Bailey Bram.. so just wondering why there is no mentions for her?

Just curious -- how many times would Bram have to be mentioned for that not to count as "no mention"?

 

[yungblud]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

I know you just play who is on your schedule, but I believe 27 or nearly half of Bram's points have came in her games against Lindenwood and Yale. In my opinion she would have to easily win the point race to be considered if I voted over the likes of Decker, J Lamoureux, M Lamoureux, Kessel, Bro. Ammerman or Knight.

 

[mercyfan]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Yes, that may be true. But Wisconsin and North Dakota both played Lindenwood this year.. also, they get the benefit of playing week teams like St. Cloud, and Ohio (North Dakota beat them 10-0 at start of year) so if you're going to take that from Bram u have to look at the other games as well. Bram produced in both Cornell games, St Lawrence games and against BC. Also, the CHA teams seem to be giving the Lakers some of their toughest games this year.. so if people are going to blame it on the league, well then it needs to go both ways. Cornell plays week teams in their league (yale, union, etcc) , the WCHA has a couple week team and so does Hockey East. In my opinion, Bram deserves to be looked at for the award, along with the other players.

 

[ARM]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Yes, that may be true. But Wisconsin and North Dakota both played Lindenwood this year.. also, they get the benefit of playing week teams like St. Cloud, and Ohio ...

That comment is a little like political debates where somebody throws out an absurd attack and the other party is forced to defend it. Lindenwood and Yale have been the two weakest teams by just about any measure this season. Ohio State is in the top half of all the rankings. I agree that Lindenwood games should be excluded for all candidates. Bram just has more of them.

 

[northhockey]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

agree with ARM:

st cloud state may be a bad wcha team, but i would bet they could be in the middle of the standings in any other conference. also, ohio state is a good team. the first series between UND/OSU is not a true measure of the difference in the teams. Just as UW beat UND 8-2 a few weekends ago.

 

[mattj711]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Kaz Watch - Rebecca Johnston

http://www.usahockey.com/patty_kazmaier/default.aspx?NAV=AF_10&id=311336&DetailedNews=yes

 

[dave1381]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Revisiting my top 10 prediction from December:

Top 10 prediction

WCHA
J. Lam, UND. Jr., F
M. Lam-Kolls, UND, Jr., F/D
Raty, Minnesota, Jr., G
Kessel, Minnesota, So., F
Decker, Wisconsin, Jr., F
Knight, Wisconsin, Sr., F

ECAC
Johnston, Cornell, Sr., F
Fortino, Cornell, Jr., D

Hockey East
Schelling, Northeastern, Sr. G

CHA
Bram, Mercyhurst, Sr., F

Position Distribution
6.5 F, 2 G, 1.5 D

Class Distribution
4 Sr., 5 Jr., 1 So.

The obvious omission here now is Wisconsin goalie Alex Rigsby, now the national leader in save pct. at .949 by a wide margin and second nationally in GAA. But who do you drop off the list? Maybe Knight, since it'll be tough for any team to get 3 players, and Knight has fallen down the scoring charts, but I do feel Knight has been clutch enough to deserve top 10 status. Decker is a Kaz 10 lock for sure.

Who do Wisconsin fans and rivals believe is most deserving of Kaz consideration on the Badgers?

 

[ARM]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

Who do Wisconsin fans and rivals believe is most deserving of Kaz consideration on the Badgers?

What may cloud the issue for the Wisconsin candidates is that there are five Badgers for whom one could make a good Kazmaier case. I'd say Decker has the best shot, because she has put up numbers and plays an all-around game. Knight is a great player; she hasn't had a great season. Prévost missed seven games, including both with Lindenwood, and has only one point less. Brooke Ammerman has two less goals than Knight, but 15 more assists. If I was going to pick two Badgers, I'd probably go with Decker and Rigsby, but I don't see the voters leaving Knight out of the Top 10.

 

[dave1381]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

That sounds right. I wouldn't be too surprised to see three Badgers in the top 10 either -- certainly not unusual for a No. 1 team to get three in the 10.

I still have no idea who would get left out if three Badgers made the Kaz 10 -- my guess would be Kessel, given that she's a sophomore and trailing Decker & the Lams in scoring, and it'd probably be tough for the WCHA to get 7 in the 10.

I'd predict Decker & Johnston in the top 3. I think Johnston solidified her status by figuring on both goals in a 2-0 win over Harvard.

I wouldn't have guessed that Rigsby would be a contender to win before this season or even halfway through the season, but my impression is that she's bailed out Wisconsin quite a bit during some big games in this month of January, and she's been the difference in a number of close games. If she keeps this up through March she could definitely win. I'd be interested whether others share that opinion, since I'm just not as familiar with her.

I expect the winner will likely be decided in conference tournament play for the first time, since it's only a recent change that USA Hockey moved the voting after the conference tournaments. I don't think timing made a whole lot of difference last year, since Duggan really ran away with the award and merely solidified her candidacy in the WCHA tournament. I suspect the timing could've made a difference in other years, like Bauer vs. Chu in 2007, when I feel it was really close, and Bauer had a much better conference tournament weekend following the voting.

 

[EastFan1]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/...ookie_fulfills_hype/srvc=sports&position=also

Have to admire elite players that have the courage to jump onto average teams and try to carry them into NCAAs.

Not good for the sport to limit the award to women on stocked teams and obvious statistical bump that goes with it.

For the same reason hope to see Spooner.

 

[mattj711]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/...ookie_fulfills_hype/srvc=sports&position=also

Have to admire elite players that have the courage to jump onto average teams and try to carry them into NCAAs.

Not good for the sport to limit the award to women on stocked teams and obvious statistical bump that goes with it.

For the same reason hope to see Spooner.

Cornell was anything but a stacked team when Johnston committed to the program. She showed a ton of guts to commit to the program.

 

[ARM]

Re: Patty Kaz 2012

I still have no idea who would get left out if three Badgers made the Kaz 10 -- my guess would be Kessel, given that she's a sophomore and trailing Decker & the Lams in scoring, and it'd probably be tough for the WCHA to get 7 in the 10.

My original thought was that four Gophers were deserving of nominations to the list of 25 or whatever it is: Räty, Kessel, Schoullis, and Bozek. Of those, only Bozek had a strong January in terms of being consistent, and she didn't put up numbers. Voters don't care about the number of times that she erases a teammate's mistake, wins a puck battle, or lugs the puck out of danger, so she'll likely fare better for something like WCHA DPotY than the Kaz voting. I'd say Räty still deserves top 10, because without her, Minnesota would be BU. However, I won't be entirely shocked if the Gophers are ignored.

I wouldn't have guessed that Rigsby would be a contender to win before this season or even halfway through the season, but my impression is that she's bailed out Wisconsin quite a bit during some big games in this month of January, and she's been the difference in a number of close games. If she keeps this up through March she could definitely win. I'd be interested whether others share that opinion, since I'm just not as familiar with her.

I can't see her winning it, in part because she isn't yet Jessie Vetter, and Vetter didn't generate serious buzz until she was a senior. I wouldn't rule out the top three, though.

Cornell was anything but a stacked team when Johnston committed to the program. She showed a ton of guts to commit to the program.

Maybe she was just the first one to get the memo titled, "Report to Team Canada Training Camp in Ithaca, NY."