Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

[FlagDUDE08]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Oh, well then, you should be easy to spot! Are you going to be the one wearing Danica gear?

Simona De Silvestro > Danica Patrick

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

2 days til the Indy/Monaco double header.

Formula1's home page has a strong prediction of rain this weekend in Monaco. So can we exect both a 7th new driver AND a 7th new car to win a race in 2012? That would be something. For both, I would predict Kimi. But it could be Perez. If just a new driver, it's about time Lewis got some luck.

 

[RaceBoarder]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Formula1's home page has a strong prediction of rain this weekend in Monaco. So can we exect both a 7th new driver AND a 7th new car to win a race in 2012? That would be something. For both, I would predict Kimi. But it could be Perez. If just a new driver, it's about time Lewis got some luck.

Well, rain gave us Olivier Panis... Should be a fun one to watch...

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

from Indystar today:

Bernard on the "rift" between he and some team owners

"Rumors of a rift between Bernard and the team owners has been growing for weeks, with Roger Penske commonly attributed as the most frustrated after losing in the Turbogate ordeal, which he addressed.

"You know, I'm not going to really take away from the Indy 500," he said. "I think that the Indy 500 is why we're here. I think, again, the team owners, their passion to win, there was a very upset team owner and still is. I think it's very clear that INDYCAR is not going to play favorites. I think what you saw with penalties this week. It wasn't one-sided. If there was an infraction, it was given. We reported those. That's the new INYDCAR. We have a very competent INDYCAR tech team. I think I'm going to stand behind their decisions."


you know, Roger Penske just doesn't get it and he's part of the reason Indycar lost the war to Nascar. he's won every race this season and cries foul about the losers (honda)? 1994 was a joke of a season due to Penske and what I viewed/view as outright skirting/cheating the rules and he could care less if fans don't want to see one driver or one team winning all the time. That blatant middle finger to all of us fans is along w/the split a huge reason why casual sports fans couldn't care less about Indycar.

Bernard needs to hold firm and be like Bernie. Yeah Roger, go ahead (you ********) start your own series and see what happens. Oh you won't put out for that? Then just **** Roger, ****!

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Incredible weather in Monaco for qualifying.

Schumacher qualified the fastest, but with his 5 spot penalty, Weber will sit on the pole tomorrow, with Rosberg next to him. Ferrari tried to pull a rabbit out at the end but neither Masa (who looks great this weekend) nor Alonso could really challenge for the pole.

Hamilton is in an interesting position, right behind Weber, and Grosjean looks to be the best hope for a different driver/team to take it all. But I think Weber stands the best chance for the 7th different winner.

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

wow...Connor Daly incident...thank god that car didn't go in a few more degrees toward the top of the car, it could have been shredded
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ybh61PkSVOk

 

[hanasoni]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Why no comments about Franchitti chopping Sato in turn one? Sato was next to Franchitti, touching tires, and hehad to go below the line. Where’s the racing etiquette, giving a driver a vehicle width when they get next to you?????

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Why no comments about Franchitti chopping Sato in turn one? Sato was next to Franchitti, touching tires, and hehad to go below the line. Where’s the racing etiquette, giving a driver a vehicle width when they get next to you?????

but you could also say that Sato made a really late and optimistic move. IMHO, he should have planned it better to make the pass going into 3 but started so early that he had to make the move or not do it at all. I'm not a big Dario fan, but Sato...

 

[Russell Jaslow]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

but you could also say that Sato made a really late and optimistic move. IMHO, he should have planned it better to make the pass going into 3 but started so early that he had to make the move or not do it at all. I'm not a big Dario fan, but Sato...

It really seemed to me that Sato hesitated as if he didn't want to make the move there knowing it was too early in the lap to take the lead. I also wondered if Dario backed off a bit hoping Sato would pass him. Then, they got to the turn, and Dario thought, heck, he's not going to take it, I'll start diving for the apex, but at the same time Sato thought, crap, I'm closing in too fast, I have to make a move there. And by then, it was too late for Sato.

Of course, you have to understand Sato, too, going back to his F1 days. I was rooting for him, but I told my wife, "If anything happens on the last lap, it's going to be because of Sato." Well, I was right. Sato is just not a patient driver.

Besides, Dario is very lucky Sato didn't take him out. It was very close. So, Dario "technically" had nothing to gain being overaggressive that early on the last lap, especially since being second was the best spot entering the second half of the last lap.

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Why no comments about Franchitti chopping Sato in turn one? Sato was next to Franchitti, touching tires, and hehad to go below the line. Where’s the racing etiquette, giving a driver a vehicle width when they get next to you?????

I think Sato was (like Viso) overly optimistic...however...it IS INDY and it was the final lap it was all or nothing there. My guess is Mario and Michael would have done the same exact move at that spot. He saw a shot and took it. Franchitti probably could have and should have given him a bit more room. 5-6 inches to the right and they both sail through there fine.

the big disappointment for me is this Andretti curse. I mean I really don't understand how awful their luck can possibly be. also Hinchcliffe and Kanaan, either one deserved the win and Kanaan w/that bonzai re-start going from 6th to 1st? you've got to be effing kidding me. that was like Senna but instead of doing it in one lap he did it in 1 straight away and corner! what b-a-l-l-s!!!!!

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

I think Sato was (like Viso) overly optimistic...however...it IS INDY and it was the final lap it was all or nothing there. My guess is Mario and Michael would have done the same exact move at that spot. He saw a shot and took it. Franchitti probably could have and should have given him a bit more room. 5-6 inches to the right and they both sail through there fine.

the big disappointment for me is this Andretti curse. I mean I really don't understand how awful their luck can possibly be. also Hinchcliffe and Kanaan, either one deserved the win and Kanaan w/that bonzai re-start going from 6th to 1st? you've got to be effing kidding me. that was like Senna but instead of doing it in one lap he did it in 1 straight away and corner! what b-a-l-l-s!!!!!

I was rooting for Hinchliffe to have a good race, but he nicely earned penalty, when he skidded over the air hose of his RF tire changer. That's always a major penlaty, and if he doesn't get one for that, I openly question Indycar's safety rules. Someone else drove over the gun of another team, when it was placed inside their own box- again, major, major penalty. Conway's accident should mean his poor pit should cost him in Detroit somehow.

It's too bad that Kanaan didn't pull it out, but I think Sato had the fastest car of the top 4. It's just too bad he pretty much had to make the move at exactly the wrong time. Nice of him not to run high and knock out Franchitti.

 

[hanasoni]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

the big disappointment for me is this Andretti curse. I mean I really don't understand how awful their luck can possibly be.

Please note, in the 1969 race, which Mario won (the only Andretti win at Indy), if Lloyd Ruby's crewman had not made a fatal mistake on his last pit stop (he indicated to Lloyd to go, before the gas man had unhooked the fueling hose, thus tearing off the whole side of Lloyd's car), no way was Mario going to overtake him, thus the curse would've been even worse, NO INDY WINS, EVER!! Mario even admitted this after the race.

 

[solovsfett]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Please note, in the 1969 race, which Mario won (the only Andretti win at Indy), if Lloyd Ruby's crewman had not made a fatal mistake on his last pit stop (he indicated to Lloyd to go, before the gas man had unhooked the fueling hose, thus tearing off the whole side of Lloyd's car), no way was Mario going to overtake him, thus the curse would've been even worse, NO INDY WINS, EVER!! Mario even admitted this after the race.

wow. I didn't know that. totally insane. I'll celebrate like a mad man when/if an Andretti finds victory circle there ever again

 

[Timothy A]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

but you could also say that Sato made a really late and optimistic move. IMHO, he should have planned it better to make the pass going into 3 but started so early that he had to make the move or not do it at all. I'm not a big Dario fan, but Sato...

After watching the DVR'ed version yesterday, Sato definately dove in way too late, he had no run at Dario at all, and should have waited. I am a certified Dario hater, but I don't blame Dario for not just moving over either to the highside, it's the last lap of the biggest race of the year, you should be making it hard to pass.

I am also a certified Marco hater and he did himself no good yesterday, first getting all cocky that he was going to win, and then he's whining and crying over the radio about this and that, so then he finally screws up and hits the wall. He has zero humility and zero poise.

The Penske cars were a big disappointment overall. Briscoe made a crazy awesome restart on the 2nd to last one to get to 3rd, but he just didn't have the speed to hold onto that high of a spot. Poor Power, that guy has terrible luck at this race. Hoe could Helio have missed the set-up by such a wide margin?

Penske vs Bernard.....I am a certified Penske lover, but Rodger needs to mind his p's and q's. He certainly is coming off as a spoiled rich brat, which is not becoming. I get his point Honda should not have been allowed to make he change to the turbo, but get over it. And P&M-ing about fines....suck it up and play by the rules.

The start of the race was awesome and the re-starts were a ton of fun to watch.

Monaco did indeed deliver another different winner, but after watching the Indy dvr first, then Monaco, the Monaco race felt so inconsequential. My oldest son and I were screaming Tako to get Dario, then the knife in the back as Tako starts to slide...

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Monaco did indeed deliver another different winner, but after watching the Indy dvr first, then Monaco, the Monaco race felt so inconsequential. My oldest son and I were screaming Tako to get Dario, then the knife in the back as Tako starts to slide...

That's a good way of putting it- I never got excited about the Monaco race, even with the rain. But going into the last laps at the 500 put me at the edge of my seat. (again)

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

I was rooting for Hinchliffe to have a good race, but he nicely earned penalty, when he skidded over the air hose of his RF tire changer. That's always a major penlaty, and if he doesn't get one for that, I openly question Indycar's safety rules. Someone else drove over the gun of another team, when it was placed inside their own box- again, major, major penalty.

Follow you to my own note- IndyCar have posted the final results on their webage- and a MAJOR note- neither Hinchcliffe NOR Rahal got a penalty for these transgressions. I had always thought that the rule against running over air powered stuff, whether yours or your neighbors, was very, very strict. James totally ran both wheels over his RF tire changer air lines and Graham ran over the legaly placed air gun or the RR changer of the team in front of him. No penalty.

What in the world is that about?

Since I'm not on any of the social sites, and i can't seem to find a "ask robin" site on speed- can anyone post the question to him why neither of these drivers got ANY penalty?? They never noted one, and I suspect that both drivers would have ended up a lap down had they been given a drive through.

 

[MattS]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Monaco:

I thought it was one of the better Monaco races I have seen in a while. While there was the usual lack of passing as it the norm at Monaco, at least the top 6 cars were pretty much nose to tail for most of the race. On slip up and it could of been real interesting.

It was great to see Massa run good! I hope he can keep this form going.

When is Lotus going to replace Grojean? He can't get through turn one on the first lap about 75% of the time.

And while I have always like Button, he needs to shut up and face the fact that his car sucked and Heikki had ever "right" to race him hard for 12th place!



Indy:

I thought it was a very entertaining race. For me it was not the "best" ever that some pundits are spewing, but much better than any in recent memory. It was good to see some different drivers running well and up front most of the day.

Excellent drive by Rubens! First time in a race on an oval, the Indy 500, and he takes a respectable 11th. Good for him.

After watching the DVR'ed version yesterday, Sato definately dove in way too late, he had no run at Dario at all, and should have waited. I am a certified Dario hater, but I don't blame Dario for not just moving over either to the highside, it's the last lap of the biggest race of the year, you should be making it hard to pass.

I am not so sure Sato went in that late especially considering it was the last lap and I think going for possibly an overoptimistic move was just good hard racing. It was a move I would like as a car owner to see my driver try in that situation.

I am also a certified Marco hater and he did himself no good yesterday, first getting all cocky that he was going to win, and then he's whining and crying over the radio about this and that, so then he finally screws up and hits the wall. He has zero humility and zero poise.

Marco is a whiny little brat. I have never ever liked any of the Andrettis and he just makes me dislike them even more.

Penske vs Bernard.....I am a certified Penske lover, but Rodger needs to mind his p's and q's. He certainly is coming off as a spoiled rich brat, which is not becoming. I get his point Honda should not have been allowed to make he change to the turbo, but get over it. And P&M-ing about fines....suck it up and play by the rules.

It sounds like the rift between some of the owners (Barnes and Andretti, if the rumors are true) has really reached a boiling point. Read Miller's article on it on Speed. Very interesting. And it's not RP who is leading the charge to get rid of Bernard. Bernard tweeted that is was not RP doing the dirty.

Follow you to my own note- IndyCar have posted the final results on their webage- and a MAJOR note- neither Hinchcliffe NOR Rahal got a penalty for these transgressions. I had always thought that the rule against running over air powered stuff, whether yours or your neighbors, was very, very strict. James totally ran both wheels over his RF tire changer air lines and Graham ran over the legaly placed air gun or the RR changer of the team in front of him. No penalty.

I don't get this either. It seems like sometime the rules aren't really rules since they seem to be enforced randomly.

 

[Timothy A]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Indy Revolt...No big surprise Barnes and George are leading the revolt, considering they both have axes to grind. I don't expect all the owners to like each other (Barnes vs Andretti), but they are mostly spoiled rich kids who are used to always getting their own way and now RB is trying to run a fair series for all, which is hard to say the least. Now if the cars/parts are costing more than planned, that is not good. Dallara and the suppliers need to honor the planned/quoted costs. I'd be p/o'ed too if I was an owner.

I do give RB a lot of credit, at this point in the season the races have been very good to watch, and that is the bottom line.

Running over hoses...maybe that was taken out of the rulebook? I never really understood why that was a big deal.

Monaco was compelling from the angle that 1st-6th were pretty much nose to tail at the end and the rain factor, but Indy was trumped that.

I had to add this letter from the mailbag, I was just about rolling on the floor with laughter...

"While you're in Motor City this weekend please do me a BIG! favor. When you see Marco tell him I'm his newest, bestest fan (I know he'll really care). I WAS his biggest critic, thinking he'd never amount to much because he was just a spoiled brat who thought his last name entitled him to all the trappings of racing success that Gramps and Sugar Daddy worked for before him. O'BOY!!! Was I ever wrong! Reading some of his exchanges with his crew on the radio during the 500 explain the burdens Marco is carrying and why he can't win. The other drivers want to kill him! The crew ignores his humble requests to make the car better. And last but certainly not least, the kicker. Marco fails to inform the crew about making adjustments to the car because he AH, AH, gets bored sometimes in the car and forgets. Anyone dealing with burdens like these deserves our support, not our scorn. I'm SO sorry Marco. I didn't realize. Forgive me.

Cletus Cobb

RM: I’m starting to think this may be Sarcasm Week at The Mailbag."

 

[MattS]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

In case anyone is interested here is some of Marco's whining during the 500:

Lap 22:

Andretti, after being passed by Ryan Briscoe for the lead: “(Expletive), I’m going back at him!”
Pit: “Just nice and easy. Long race.”
Andretti regained the lead on the next lap.



Lap 85:

Andretti: “One of my shoes just melted to the throttle.”



Lap 90

Andretti, who was leading: “It’s going to cost us the race, the freaking overboost.” He finished 24th after crashing on Lap 188.



Lap 113:

Andretti: “These guys (other drivers) are trying to (expletive) kill me!”



Lap 147:

Andretti, on changes he expected during a previous pit stop: “You didn’t put the rear wing in?”
Pit: “No, we didn’t put the rear wing in.”
Andretti: “That’s what I was (expletive) screaming for.”
Pit: “Well, I didn’t hear that.”
Andretti: “I didn’t say it because I’m (expletive) bored.”



Lap 149:

Andretti, on being asked to conserve fuel: “I don’t want to give away any more position because we’re already (expletive).”

 

[alfablue]

Re: Open Wheel Racing 2012: The year of the ugly cars!

Running over hoses...maybe that was taken out of the rulebook? I never really understood why that was a big deal.

Safety. The air gun system runs at a high pressure, and if it gets released in an uncontrolled manner- such as running over a line or running over a gun- bad things can happen.