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Obama V: For Vendetta

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Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

I don't think anybody outside of party activists really gets up on the morning and thinks about the census.

(and if you do, you really need some companionship)
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

Red Cloud said:
I posted a link to some video in the healthcare thread.
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Thanks!

But not limited to one side:

http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/...ourages-physical-violence-use-of-firearms.php

Based on the news that health care events are edging into violence, an anti-health care reform protester in New Mexico named Scott Oskay is calling on his hundreds of online followers to bring firearms to town halls, and to 'badly hurt' SEIU and ACORN counter protesters.
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http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/...phone-call-involving-the-second-amendment.php

SEIU says it has now received an apparent threat involving gun violence from a right-winger in reaction to the union bringing their own people to town halls, Greg Sargent reports.
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Both sides have more than their share of *******s who are content with causing crap and not seeing anything of value happening.
 
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Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

Rachel, please tell me the difference between someone carrying a firearm and someone kicking the **** out of someone else. You think one might have something to do with the other?
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

Red Cloud said:
French Rage, please tell me the difference between someone carrying a firearm and someone kicking the **** out of someone else. You think one might have something to do with the other?
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Possibly. Does that somehow make it less of an asinine and juvenille idea that won't solve crap and will only make the situation tailspin even worse?
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

Red Cloud said:
French Rage, please, reaffirm my faith in you. I think you're smarter than Priceless.
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Your question was: "You think one might have something to do with the other?"
My response was: "Possibly."
A bit of a brief answer, I'll admit, but an answer nonetheless.

Now, on to your imperative sentence: "French Rage, please tell me the difference between someone carrying a firearm and someone kicking the **** out of someone else."

Well the largest difference would be one is an actual attack on a person (the kicking of the ****) whereas the other merely represents the threat of an attack (the carrying of the gun), so at the most stringest level yes the former is worse. But not by far since both are meant to intimidate. I know the response will be that carrying the firearms is just a measure of protection since otherwise every single attendee will be brutally manhandled be SEIU and ACORN, but I'm not buying that's the only or even remotely primary motivation for that. That's a subjective feeling on my part, but these meetings have essentially become a chest-thumping competition and this firearm stuff would have happened (on both sides) regardless of what specific incidents are used to justify it; again that's simply my opinion.
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

French Rage said:
Well the largest difference would be one is an actual attack on a person (the kicking of the ****) whereas the other merely represents the threat of an attack (the carrying of the gun), so at the most stringest level yes the former is worse.
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Thank you. But let me introduce an alien concept to you. Perhaps it's not about intimidation - perhaps there's a legitimate argument for self-defense. I know people only carry guns to kill people with, but I want you to roll that one around for a bit, sweetheart. I know you want to just dismiss it out of hand for the sake of convenience, but ask yourself this - were these "angry mobs" packing guns before someone was violently assaulted?
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

Red Cloud said:
Thank you. But let me introduce an alien concept to you. Perhaps it's not about intimidation - perhaps there's a legitimate argument for self-defense. I know people only carry guns to kill people with, but I want you to roll that one around for a bit, sweetheart. I know you want to just dismiss it out of hand for the sake of convenience, but ask yourself this - were these "angry mobs" packing guns before someone was violently assaulted?
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Well, we reached the point of accusing me of thinking every gun owner is a crazed shooter faster than I thought; the vast vast majority of gun owners are of course responsible people, but there's always a group of *******s, on both sides of the debate mind you, looking for reasons to cause more crap, and for them I don't think this is as much about self defence as much as an excuse.

A better comparison would be whether people would start carrying guns had the assault not happened at all. Comparing what people were doing a week or two back ignores how much things have escalated, people have gone from being angry to shouting others down to pushing and shoving and slapping to attacking others in a pretty **** short span. You can't tell me that the idiots (by which I mean the idiots are both sides looking more for trouble than solutions) who got it this far wouldn't have gotten it to the point of firearms before long.

So, as to not lose participation points and fail to make the honor roll, in answer to your question, no. But the idiots would have found a way to get their anyways, so what they are using as a justification is in reality for that very small but unfortunately very vocal minority an excuse.
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

French Rage said:
Well, we reached the point of accusing me of thinking every gun owner is a crazed shooter faster than I thought.
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You have only yourself to blame, considering that you find someone carrying a weapon to be a threat first and foremost.
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

walrus said:
Good thing you don't live in Maine. I knew all kinds of folks who carry, Never felt threatened by it.
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Well, there's a difference between carrying it along as part of a daily routine, nothing out of the ordinary, and to a place where tensions are already high and things are getting physical and people are actively encouraging others to bring their own. Yeah, I'm not a gun person myself and have never lived in a gun heavy area, so perhaps they are more of a boogeyman to me than others, I'll be the first to admit that. But that also doesn't mean that to me every person carrying a concealed gun is some crazy nut looking to shoot up the place, and that my opinion is automatically that of a "world with no guns" hippie. But when in these circumstances people are trying to getting others all excited and encouraging them to bring firearms, you'll excuse me if that doesn't sound to me like the exact same situation as someone deciding on their own to bring one for personal protection. (And again, these people represent a small small minority, but that's what's been pushing this crap along on both sides for the whole time.)
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

French Rage said:
But when in these circumstances people are trying to getting others all excited and encouraging them to bring firearms, you'll excuse me if that doesn't sound to me like the exact same situation as someone deciding on their own to bring one for personal protection. (And again, these people represent a small small minority, but that's what's been pushing this crap along on both sides for the whole time.)
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Encouraging folks to bring guns to a townhall meeting doesn't seem like the best idea to me either.
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

French Rage said:
(And again, these people represent a small small minority, but that's what's been pushing this crap along on both sides for the whole time.)
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There's just one problem - your "small small minority" on your side are the people with the power. Obama telling "those who made this mess" (like it was our personal problem) to "stop talking." Pelosi starting this whole Nazi nonsense by saying the opposition "carried swaztikas." Pelosi and Hoyer calling the opposition "un-American" (fire up HUAC again, woo!). And the coup de grace, SEIU, the union which said it was "proud" to have spent $60 million electing Obama and committed itself to his causes, turning out thugs in uniform to intimidate and in one case, assault the opposition.

And your main concern is the "small small minority" which recommends taking measures in self-defense rather than backing down from their cause.

Sad, really. A woman with a brain, taking herself down to Rover's level. I wish you luck.
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

ScottM said:
I agree, but I voted for him, not Pelosi or Reid. He has been remarkably disengaged in this debate, and peeking his head out to give a some bite or tightly controlled townhall meeting doesn't count. Hell, his press conference on health care degenerated into the Gates fiasco. He should be quarterbacking the healthcare debate, not cheerleading or offering pearls of wisdom from the press box. Maybe he should grab Rahm, head to the Hill and start cracking heads if he's serious about getting a deal by year-end.
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Well, the last time a president tried to reform healthcare from the WH, that didn't go so well.
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

Before the PC police jumps me, I'm just saying French Rage does seem to have at least cognitive reasoning in her head - I'm not saying that quality is rare in women or anything like that. So calm down.
 
Re: Obama V: For Vendetta

rufus said:
Well, the last time a president tried to reform healthcare from the WH, that didn't go so well.
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Like this fiasco is going any better? :confused:

Obama's legacy will be defined to a large degree by his handling of this issue. If he doesn't seize control of it, it will seize control of him.
 
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