Obama 6(...66)

[Kepler]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

I might add that the fundamental difference between liberals and conservatives - describe it however you like - is very often manifested in a conservative's knowledge that, though imperfect, America's actions are almost always well-intentioned and (law of unintended consequences aside) we have brought much, much....MUCH! more good to humanity than not good. Whereas liberals too often ignore, or only admit under pressure, all the good we've done for humanity and instead focus in on the tiny percentage of mistakes we've made..... and then use this tiny percentage of mistakes to rationalize surrending America's role as the spearhead against tyranny and state-sponsored injustice and agression in this world.

I suppose that's how you look at it, but I think it's nonsense. The fundamental difference between liberals and conservatives is the philosophical question of whether man is perfectable by his own actions or only through surrender to some a priori standard of perfection (gods, nostalgia for fictional "good old days," etc).

You also ignore that much of the good that America has brought to the world began with ideas that were feared to be inevitably disastrous by conservatives.

Conservatives stand athwart history yelling "stop!" That's a good approach only when things are going downhill. As America and the world have progressed in some undeniable ways, conservatism has been -- in that regard -- on the wrong side. It's useful as a brake, but not as an engine. We need both.

 

[MinnFan]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

The fundamental difference between liberals and conservatives is the philosophical question of whether man is perfectable by his own actions or only through the force of gov't.

FYP

 

[Bill]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

The great thing about appearing on Fox is you literally cannot overplay your hand.

So of course we can then logically say the same thing about CBS, NBC, ABC and their subsidiary networks.

 

[geezer]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

People do know Glenn Beck is a comedian, right? Even more than Coulter it has always been obvious to me that he's simply playing a character to make money off the stupid. The great thing about appearing on Fox is you literally cannot overplay your hand.

I agree - with the first part. It's all an act, but you don't have to be stupid to enjoy the entertainment offered by Beck (I don't) or, say, Rush (I do). But you should understand that they are motivated by audience reaction, and as such are simply entertainers.
Would you say someone who reads the NYT or Newsweek is also "stupid" for taking it seriously?

 

[Rover]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Heh: http://gawker.com/5371272/glenn-beck-is-even-wrong-in-the-future

While I don't like the guy, what Beck is doing is par for the course especially in the financial press. The "game" is to make the most outlandish predictions and hope one turns out correct, which you can then parlay into some high profile interviews and maybe a book deal.

So, post-crisis last year, everybody remembers the headlines. "US May Be on the Hook for $100T in Obligations". Or "Secret Plan to Nationalize All Banks Being Considered". You get the idea. None of these knuckleheads actually believed any of this would happen, but on the 1/1,000,000 chance they'd be correct it was worth it to sound the alarm, knowing their prediction would quickly be forgotten when it didn't pan out.

As far as the Olympics go - Montreal got creamed, LA made tons of money, not sure about subsequent Olympics. Having relatives and friends in the Atlanta area, I've yet to hear a bad thing about having the '96 games there, so I'm guessing they at least broke even on that one.

 

[pardonme]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

People do know Glenn Beck is a comedian, right? Even more than Coulter it has always been obvious to me that he's simply playing a character to make money off the stupid. The great thing about appearing on Fox is you literally cannot overplay your hand.

Did you know that he might have raped and murdered a young girl in 1990 though? http://glennbeckrapedandmurderedayounggirlin1990.com/

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Did you know that he might have raped and murdered a young girl in 1990 though? http://glennbeckrapedandmurderedayounggirlin1990.com/

I thought that was Bob Saget that raped and killed a girl in 1990. But its not true. It's not true that BOB SAGET RAPED AND KILLED A GIRL IN 1990. So you if you have any proof that BOB SAGET RAPED AND KILLED A GIRL IN 1990, stop hiding and go right to the police with it.

 

[ScoobyDoo]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Did you know that he might have raped and murdered a young girl in 1990 though? http://glennbeckrapedandmurderedayounggirlin1990.com/

That's funny. He has his own tactics thrown right up in his face. Good for whoever had the idea for that site.

 

[French Rage]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

As far as the Olympics go - Montreal got creamed, LA made tons of money, not sure about subsequent Olympics. Having relatives and friends in the Atlanta area, I've yet to hear a bad thing about having the '96 games there, so I'm guessing they at least broke even on that one.

I think the '96 games made money but also ****ed off everyone since they were so over-commercialized.

Edit: Wiki says they made $10 million (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_Summer_Olympics). As you mention, Montreal's the one that really lost a lot of money.

 

[French Rage]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Did you know that he might have raped and murdered a young girl in 1990 though? http://glennbeckrapedandmurderedayounggirlin1990.com/

Why won't he provide the evidence that he didn't?

 

[Kepler]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

The "game" is to make the most outlandish predictions and hope one turns out correct

Don't knock it.

 

[Kepler]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Why won't he provide the evidence that he didn't?

Troubling.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Hey gregg, I have you on ignore still but I did see your post...I did have a brain cramp I didn't mean that how it came out. Just thought I would let ya know That said I don't think America should be in the business of telling other countries how to run their country, let them make their own mistakes until it effects us somehow. The Cold War was different I was speaking more to the now.

 

[Bob Gray]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Hey gregg, I have you on ignore still but I did see your post...I did have a brain cramp I didn't mean that how it came out. Just thought I would let ya know That said I don't think America should be in the business of telling other countries how to run their country, let them make their own mistakes until it effects us somehow. The Cold War was different I was speaking more to the now.

Interesting. I never took you for a big time isolationist. I agree with you to a limited extent, but it sounds easier in theory than it is in practice. So, if another Rwanda genocide is taking place, we just sit back and say they can make their own mistakes? Not that Clinton did much in that situation, so maybe that's not the best example, but in hindsight most folks on both sides of the aisle say more should have been done. Maybe Darfur is a better example, as the U.S. has tried a lot, but the Euros and others have dragged their feet. The U.S. backs off, and there's less hope that the folks getting slaughtered there will get any reprieve.

 

[Rover]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

I think the '96 games made money but also ****ed off everyone since they were so over-commercialized.

Edit: Wiki says they made $10 million (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_Summer_Olympics). As you mention, Montreal's the one that really lost a lot of money.

I'm amused by the whole Olympic thing, as if he didn't go and Chicago didn't win we'd be hearing about how Obama "doesn't care enough about America to make a personal pitch" from Neanderthal set. However, if Chicago does win, it will have nothing to do with his pitch (I guess they'll give the credit to Oprah??? )

Anyway, I can see LA making money because they already had the venues. Atlanta had to build a bit of them, so its good they made money. I'm curious what Chicago will do about the main stadium, as the White Sox park is relatively new, and Soldiers Field just got renevated. Would the city build another facility?

 

[Kepler]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Atlanta had to build a bit of them, so its good they made money.

Atlanta was also going through a big gentrification push at the time, so maybe some of the costs (demolition, at least) were shunted off onto non-Olympic accounts.

The only thing I remember about Atlanta was they put all the bums in the jug and that guy who got blamed for the bomb.

I do recall that the buzz surrounding all three of the most recent US Olympics (LA, Atlanta, SLC) was that they had excellent project management and cost control. I'll bet all three still ran over budget, but they all netted more than was expected, too.

The talk after Beijing is it was the last Insanely Expensive Olympics, because (1) there's now enough analysis to disprove the notion that the Olympics give the host city a lasting economic boost, (2) Beijing's money didn't come from democratic / transparent sources -- it was the world's largest PR campaign for their Communist Party, and (3) the credit crisis could have cut the taste for huge public expenditures for good. London is supposedly being very ostentatious about not spending ostentatiously (a very British thing to do).

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Anyway, I can see LA making money because they already had the venues. Atlanta had to build a bit of them, so its good they made money. I'm curious what Chicago will do about the main stadium, as the White Sox park is relatively new, and Soldiers Field just got renevated. Would the city build another facility?

Well, the only facility that they'd likely NEED would probably be a proper Olympic Stadium for track and field. I believe Chicago already has anything else that they'd need.

 

[Old Pio]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Well, the only facility that they'd likely NEED would probably be a proper Olympic Stadium for track and field. I believe Chicago already has anything else that they'd need.

Most cities, Chicago included, don't have things like velodromes and white water rafting courses. As I understand it, their plan calls for a "temporary"
80K seat stadium on the lake front for opening and closing ceremonies and track and field. They also plan to have some acquatic events actually in the lake as well. I don't think Chicago has an Olympic class swimming facility either. Estimates for the Olympic village are at 1 billion. And the grafters are licking their chops at that one.

 

[Handyman]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

Interesting. I never took you for a big time isolationist. I agree with you to a limited extent, but it sounds easier in theory than it is in practice. So, if another Rwanda genocide is taking place, we just sit back and say they can make their own mistakes? Not that Clinton did much in that situation, so maybe that's not the best example, but in hindsight most folks on both sides of the aisle say more should have been done. Maybe Darfur is a better example, as the U.S. has tried a lot, but the Euros and others have dragged their feet. The U.S. backs off, and there's less hope that the folks getting slaughtered there will get any reprieve.

It depends...there is no absolute right or wrong it sort of goes on a case by case basis depending on what is going on in the US as much as anywhere else. Right now I am more towards isolationism because the country is in pretty rough shape and we should be focusing more on how to fix that as opposed to fixing everyone else. When things are more stable then I think we should be helping out where we can.

I also realize that what I want may not be the right answer either.

 

[goldy_331]

Re: Obama 6(...66)

I also realize that what I want may not be the right answer either.

I'm sorry, but you're not allowed to post in these political threads with an attitude like that.