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Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
- Thread starter Plante26
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Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
Scooby, when would this "Reform" go into effect? Earliest I heard is 2013. If this is so revolutionary and needed now why the hell will it take 3 years to get going? The optimist in me says it is because it takes that long to set things up...the realist in me knows it is because the Bill is BS and many of the people voting on it assume by then most will have forgotten about it and who voted for it. (or they assume they will be out of office)
The Dems have screwed this whole thing up...and this bill is their way of putting through something so it doesnt look like they wasted their time. No single payer, no public option...just the same plans with a few new provisions.
Change I can yawn at...
McConnell's "Dahl Stall" strategy has worked so well the Bushies will retake the House at the midterms...when that happens we can call this a complete Epic Fail. So much promise, but once again the Spineless Party proves they have no clue what to do when they get into power.
Scooby, when would this "Reform" go into effect? Earliest I heard is 2013. If this is so revolutionary and needed now why the hell will it take 3 years to get going? The optimist in me says it is because it takes that long to set things up...the realist in me knows it is because the Bill is BS and many of the people voting on it assume by then most will have forgotten about it and who voted for it. (or they assume they will be out of office)
The Dems have screwed this whole thing up...and this bill is their way of putting through something so it doesnt look like they wasted their time. No single payer, no public option...just the same plans with a few new provisions.
Change I can yawn at...
McConnell's "Dahl Stall" strategy has worked so well the Bushies will retake the House at the midterms...when that happens we can call this a complete Epic Fail. So much promise, but once again the Spineless Party proves they have no clue what to do when they get into power.
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ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
I can't disagree. Still, there are a couple of things in the bill that should be passed but I guess never will.
I can't disagree. Still, there are a couple of things in the bill that should be passed but I guess never will.
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
Yes, that's my prediction.
Not wanting to keep the status quo is a different question than agreeing on how to change the status quo. That's what's been missing this past 100 years or so.
Say reform fails. On the one hand, Dems as long as the retain a majority will not go near this again for fear of the political consequences. If the GOP takes over, not only have they never shown a willingness to enact big changes in this field, they also will be subject to the same tactics they used on the Dems under the "what goes around comes around" mantra in politics. I'm not saying any of these events will be the right thing to do, but that's what will happen. Its politically easy to just keep borrowing money to punt the problem along to the next Congress and the next one, etc etc.
Handy, I'm not one for giving you compliments, but I can respect your willingness to state that the status quo is your preference. Its a lot clearer of an answer than I've gotten from most reform opponents.
Yes, that's my prediction.
Not wanting to keep the status quo is a different question than agreeing on how to change the status quo. That's what's been missing this past 100 years or so.
Say reform fails. On the one hand, Dems as long as the retain a majority will not go near this again for fear of the political consequences. If the GOP takes over, not only have they never shown a willingness to enact big changes in this field, they also will be subject to the same tactics they used on the Dems under the "what goes around comes around" mantra in politics. I'm not saying any of these events will be the right thing to do, but that's what will happen. Its politically easy to just keep borrowing money to punt the problem along to the next Congress and the next one, etc etc.
Handy, I'm not one for giving you compliments, but I can respect your willingness to state that the status quo is your preference. Its a lot clearer of an answer than I've gotten from most reform opponents.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
I agree with you there, but I think they should be passed as their own bill not as part of this Pork Barrel Sandwich Bill. Can you imagine if they just tried to pass a bill about pre-existing conditions (nothing else, just a bill on that alone) and the Bushies tried to road block it...the GOP would get eaten alive!
The Dem leadership dropped the ball on this big time. Watching them work on this is like watching the Gophs on the PP this year
I agree with you there, but I think they should be passed as their own bill not as part of this Pork Barrel Sandwich Bill. Can you imagine if they just tried to pass a bill about pre-existing conditions (nothing else, just a bill on that alone) and the Bushies tried to road block it...the GOP would get eaten alive!
The Dem leadership dropped the ball on this big time. Watching them work on this is like watching the Gophs on the PP this year
walrus
Wind up workin' in a gas station
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
Bet on what? You don't believe a majority of voters think reform(of some kind) needs to be done?
Bet on what? You don't believe a majority of voters think reform(of some kind) needs to be done?
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
No, that if it doesn't pass it isn't touched again for another 16 years.
No, that if it doesn't pass it isn't touched again for another 16 years.
ScoobyDoo
NPC
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
EPIC FAIL. Which is never a surprise when a Democrat is involved.
I agree with you there, but I think they should be passed as their own bill not as part of this Pork Barrel Sandwich Bill. Can you imagine if they just tried to pass a bill about pre-existing conditions (nothing else, just a bill on that alone) and the Bushies tried to road block it...the GOP would get eaten alive!
The Dem leadership dropped the ball on this big time. Watching them work on this is like watching the Gophs on the PP this year
EPIC FAIL. Which is never a surprise when a Democrat is involved.
walrus
Wind up workin' in a gas station
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
You might be right but its going to pass. Should be interesting to see the fall out once its signed.
You might be right but its going to pass. Should be interesting to see the fall out once its signed.
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
Interesting dichotomy. The people who support health care reform seem to think the bill will fail, those that oppose it think it will pass.
Interesting dichotomy. The people who support health care reform seem to think the bill will fail, those that oppose it think it will pass.
Handyman
Hug someone you care about...
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
We are all tempering our expectations
Interesting dichotomy. The people who support health care reform seem to think the bill will fail, those that oppose it think it will pass.
We are all tempering our expectations
ScottM
**** it feels good to be a bankster
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
It's called "hedging your bets".
Interesting dichotomy. The people who support health care reform seem to think the bill will fail, those that oppose it think it will pass.
It's called "hedging your bets".
WeWantMore
New member
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
FOX now reporting that the Dems have secured 216 votes.
Insurance companies rubbing their hands gleefully.
FOX now reporting that the Dems have secured 216 votes.
Insurance companies rubbing their hands gleefully.
P
Priceless
Guest
WeWantMore
New member
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
Nope. There are currently 431 house members. Come on.
Nope. There are currently 431 house members. Come on.
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
4 House members were killed by the Democrats so they could pass health care!
4 House members were killed by the Democrats so they could pass health care!
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
LOL. that would be sweet
4 House members were killed by the Democrats so they could pass health care!
LOL. that would be sweet
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
Yeah. CBO estimate. That's the ticket... From 1998:
So how'd that work out? Ummmm:
So that's more than a 50% miss in cost (and they aren't even close to done yet), not even considering that we're getting ~15% fewer planes for the higher price. Now consider that a fighter jet program is child's play compared to overhauling health care. Building a fighter jet basically amounts to buying a bunch of junk and bolting it together, and yet, we've done that dozens of times and still can't predict the costs accurately.
It's also not a matter of pure uncertainty - if that were the case, some of the cost estimates would miss high, and some would miss low. I challenge anyone to find a US government program that has come in 50% under budget in the last 30 years.
Yeah. CBO estimate. That's the ticket... From 1998:
So how'd that work out? Ummmm:
So that's more than a 50% miss in cost (and they aren't even close to done yet), not even considering that we're getting ~15% fewer planes for the higher price. Now consider that a fighter jet program is child's play compared to overhauling health care. Building a fighter jet basically amounts to buying a bunch of junk and bolting it together, and yet, we've done that dozens of times and still can't predict the costs accurately.
It's also not a matter of pure uncertainty - if that were the case, some of the cost estimates would miss high, and some would miss low. I challenge anyone to find a US government program that has come in 50% under budget in the last 30 years.
P
Priceless
Guest
Re: Obama 10: Rahm it through.....even in the shower.
Fighter planes cost more during 2 wars and while the dollar is tanking? Who'd have thunk it?
Fighter planes cost more during 2 wars and while the dollar is tanking? Who'd have thunk it?
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