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Not so ez????

Re: Not so ez????

vs WCHA 8–8–4 :eek: :p
vs HE 8–9–4
vs CCHA 6–10–2
vs AHA 27–6–5

Link

Holy Christ what a terrible story.

and often confoundingly ridicule our pack as the “EZ-AC” … the wannabes of D-I men’s hockey.

Confoundingly? Really? You can figure that out?

Against Atlantic Hockey and independent Alabama-Huntsville, the ECAC was 27–6–5, for which we can be mildly content.

Still don't see why the ECAC maybe ridiculed? They are midly content with a winning record against the AHA...

ECAC Hockey probably isn’t better, as a whole, than the “Big Three,” but it’s not worse, either.

Still not seeing it Mr. Sullivan?

They aren't better but they aren't worse, so the ECAC is " equal, on par with, equivilent to" the WCHA the CCHA or HE...

Is this Yaledoc?
 
Re: Not so ez????

Saturday January 15, 2011


#4* New Hampshire 4
#4** Dartmouth 5

* in the country
** in the "EZAC"

Oops...

Wait, what? You're honestly comparing BSU (who was 4 games below .500 and 2 spots from last in the WCHA at the time of that win) beating Union (one of the top teams in the ECAC) to a match-up between in-state rivals? Both with winning/similar records? And the ECAC team comming out on top? Wow...
 
Re: Not so ez????

Wait, what? You're honestly comparing BSU (who was 4 games below .500 and 2 spots from last in the WCHA at the time of that win) beating Union (one of the top teams in the ECAC) to a match-up between in-state rivals? Both with winning/similar records? And the ECAC team comming out on top? Wow...

OK. What if a team 3 games below .500 and 2 spots from last in the ECAC beat the #2 team in the country and one of the top teams in Hockey East? Would that be a good enough comparison for you?

Individual game results mean squat. St. Lawrence beating UNH doesn't make the ECAC better than Hockey East. It proves nothing, other than that St. Lawrence played a better game on that particular night than UNH did. But Bemidji State beating Union is exactly as relevant: it doesn't prove that the WCHA is better than the ECAC. It just means that Bemidji beat Union that day.
 
Re: Not so ez????

OK. What if a team 3 games below .500 and 2 spots from last in the ECAC beat the #2 team in the country and one of the top teams in Hockey East? Would that be a good enough comparison for you?

Individual game results mean squat. St. Lawrence beating UNH doesn't make the ECAC better than Hockey East. It proves nothing, other than that St. Lawrence played a better game on that particular night than UNH did. But Bemidji State beating Union is exactly as relevant: it doesn't prove that the WCHA is better than the ECAC. It just means that Bemidji beat Union that day.

While I completely agree, I have a question. What is your criteria for determing what conference is the best, or how a conference is better than another conference?
 
Re: Not so ez????

Median Krach rating, adjusted for Bernoulli variable standard error, ie sqrt(p*(1-p)) where p is the probability of a Krach win on neutral ice between two median teams.
 
Re: Not so ez????

Median Krach rating, adjusted for Bernoulli variable standard error, ie sqrt(p*(1-p)) where p is the probability of a Krach win on neutral ice between two median teams.

I'll let you figure that one out...

Average KRACH rating:
WCHA - 258.84
ECAC - 170.53
Hockey East - 149.61
CCHA - 148.77
AH - 31.87
UAH - 16.2
 
Re: Not so ez????

OK. What if a team 3 games below .500 and 2 spots from last in the ECAC beat the #2 team in the country and one of the top teams in Hockey East? Would that be a good enough comparison for you?

Individual game results mean squat. St. Lawrence beating UNH doesn't make the ECAC better than Hockey East. It proves nothing, other than that St. Lawrence played a better game on that particular night than UNH did. But Bemidji State beating Union is exactly as relevant: it doesn't prove that the WCHA is better than the ECAC. It just means that Bemidji beat Union that day.

The WCHA is a better conference than the EZAC, fact.
 
Re: Not so ez????

While I completely agree, I have a question. What is your criteria for determing what conference is the best, or how a conference is better than another conference?

Well, my first response would be that it really doesn't matter all that much. Conferences don't play conferences; teams play teams. The worst teams in the WCHA, CCHA, and Hockey East are generally terrible. The best team in the ECAC is usually pretty darn good, and this year they appear to be right there with the best two or three teams in the country, however you want to define it at this stage of the season.

If someone did want to know whether one conference as a whole was better or worse than another, then they could take a large sample of interconference game results, over a meaningful amount of time. (This isn't all that easy in D1 hockey, by the way, because teams from some conferences play so few non-conference games.) I happen to believe that if you did that, you'd find that the ECAC was right up there at the top in the 80s, then started to drop below the level of the WCHA and Hockey East. I think that for the past ten years, the ECAC has had one or maybe two teams that were competitive with the top teams of other conferences, but pretty consistently a step behind. NCAA results for any given tournament don't say much, but I think there's a reason an ECAC team hasn't played for the title in so long. Over the past year or two, I think the ECAC is closing that gap, and I think this year's overall results bear that out, as Brian Sullivan demonstrated in his column today. I also think that once you get past, say, the 4th-place teams in these conferences, the differences aren't that great. But in the recent past, the best teams in the WCHA, CCHA, and Hockey East have been noticeably better than the best team or two in the ECAC. Those are the teams in the NCAA tournament every year, and that's why the ECAC has done so badly there. They have several good teams every year, but no great ones. That may be changing.
 
Re: Not so ez????

Well, my first response would be that it really doesn't matter all that much. Conferences don't play conferences; teams play teams. The worst teams in the WCHA, CCHA, and Hockey East are generally terrible. The best team in the ECAC is usually pretty darn good, and this year they appear to be right there with the best two or three teams in the country, however you want to define it at this stage of the season.

I wouldn't agree with that. The WCHA has 10 teams in the top 24 in KRACH. Generally, the WCHA has most of it's teams in the top half of college hockey.

If someone did want to know whether one conference as a whole was better or worse than another, then they could take a large sample of interconference game results, over a meaningful amount of time. (This isn't all that easy in D1 hockey, by the way, because teams from some conferences play so few non-conference games.) I happen to believe that if you did that, you'd find that the ECAC was right up there at the top in the 80s, then started to drop below the level of the WCHA and Hockey East. I think that for the past ten years, the ECAC has had one or maybe two teams that were competitive with the top teams of other conferences, but pretty consistently a step behind. NCAA results for any given tournament don't say much, but I think there's a reason an ECAC team hasn't played for the title in so long. Over the past year or two, I think the ECAC is closing that gap, and I think this year's overall results bear that out, as Brian Sullivan demonstrated in his column today. I also think that once you get past, say, the 4th-place teams in these conferences, the differences aren't that great. But in the recent past, the best teams in the WCHA, CCHA, and Hockey East have been noticeably better than the best team or two in the ECAC. Those are the teams in the NCAA tournament every year, and that's why the ECAC has done so badly there. They have several good teams every year, but no great ones. That may be changing.

Well, it's nearly impossible to determine conference superiority over the course of 1 season using this criteria. Perhaps over the course of a decade it could be done though.

I do agree with you. The ECAC does appear to be stronger this season. They will most likely get 3-5 teams in the NCAA Tournament. I think the performance of their teams in the NCAA tournament will be what people use to determine what conference is best, fair or not.

I won't get into what I think of Brian Sullivan. :p:D:D
 
Re: Not so ez????

I wouldn't agree with that. The WCHA has 10 teams in the top 24 in KRACH. Generally, the WCHA has most of it's teams in the top half of college hockey.

Tournament field:

1 seeds - UND, UAA, UMD, DU
2 seeds - Bemidji, Gophers, Col Coll, Wisconsin
3 seeds - UA_, Notre Dame, MTU, UNO
4 seeds - NMU, SCSU*, HEA qualifier, AHA qualifier
*EZAC is so awful that no team from its league deserves to be in the tournament, so any team with said credentials is skipped.
 
Re: Not so ez????

I wouldn't agree with that. The WCHA has 10 teams in the top 24 in KRACH. Generally, the WCHA has most of it's teams in the top half of college hockey.

The majority of its teams are good, I'll grant you that. But the last-place team isn't always good. It very often stinks - badly. Just to take a snapshot of the current standings, Michigan Tech and Bowling Green would be bad in the ECAC, too. (And yes, I doubt that Princeton would be in 2nd place right now if it were in the WCHA.) I guess my real argument is with those people who suggest every year that a WCHA team with one win in conference play would be near the top of the ECAC. No they wouldn't.

Edit: Meant to say I doubt Princeton would be in 2nd, not that they wouldn't.
 
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