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NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

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Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

How many "little" violations do the Pats have to commit before they are really busted? Having said that, talk of a year-suspension for Brady is ludicrous. WAG for fairness would be 4 games. Fine the organization a significant amount (7 figures for sure).
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

What "little" violations are you referring to? They got in trouble the last time and will this time. what does really busted mean? What was the recent penalty for falcons? They pumped in crowd noise to try and gain an advantage. It's because they sucked that nobody really cared about it. Had that come out when they had just won an nfc title game at home...different story.

Pats deserve punishment but as you say, people calling for season suspension etc have lost their minds.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

J.D. said:
What "little" violations are you referring to? They got in trouble the last time and will this time. what does really busted mean? What was the recent penalty for falcons? They pumped in crowd noise to try and gain an advantage. It's because they sucked that nobody really cared about it. Had that come out when they had just won an nfc title game at home...different story.

Pats deserve punishment but as you say, people calling for season suspension etc have lost their minds.
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The Pats just seem to break the little rules juuuuust enough to avoid major punishment. So, either throw the book at them (for continuous violations) or treat each violation as separate (which is what my guess at punishment was). There's a pattern now. I'm being (or trying to be) as neutral as I can here. But sooner or later, if this pattern continues, the NFL really needs to bring the hammer down on the organization (not the player).

Belichick tampering, Spygate, Inflategate, off the top of my head.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

Belichick tampering?

I'm not sure what you're looking for. As an example the falcons were docked 350,000 and a 5th round pick for trying to gain a competitive advantage by pumping in crowd noise. There is no way to quantify which infraction is "worse" especially when you consider what brady did with properly inflated balls. It's pretty tough to play in loud venues, this we know. Fine the organization as much as you want, don't care about that. It's really the suspension talk that people have lost touch with reality. There's no way something like this should be more than what guys who beat women/kids get. So what the number should be i don't really know. Anything more than 4 is ludicrous and even 4 is too high i think.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

J.D. said:
Belichick tampering?

I'm not sure what you're looking for. As an example the falcons were docked 350,000 and a 5th round pick for trying to gain a competitive advantage by pumping in crowd noise. There is no way to quantify which infraction is "worse" especially when you consider what brady did with properly inflated balls. It's pretty tough to play in loud venues, this we know. Fine the organization as much as you want, don't care about that. It's really the suspension talk that people have lost touch with reality. There's no way something like this should be more than what guys who beat women/kids get. So what the number should be i don't really know. Anything more than 4 is ludicrous and even 4 is too high i think.
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I'm agreeing with you. My WAG is 4 games. And IIRC, Pats were fined or whatever for tampering with Belichick from the Jets. Or was that Parcells (or both?). My point is, these infractions should be adding up at some point.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

Eh i don't think tampering is in same category. to me, tampering is league wide. I won't say that about the other infractions (although it certainly wouldn't surprise me).

The part where the organization could really get dinged is with not fully cooperating. Belichick was basically absolved in all this and that mayches up with what i've heard former nfl qbs say. But the fact they wouldn't make mcnally available after discovering texts, that could be a problem.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

J.D. said:
Eh i don't think tampering is in same category. to me, tampering is league wide. I won't say that about the other infractions (although it certainly wouldn't surprise me).

The part where the organization could really get dinged is with not fully cooperating. Belichick was basically absolved in all this and that mayches up with what i've heard former nfl qbs say. But the fact they wouldn't make mcnally available after discovering texts, that could be a problem.
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Belichick was absolved, and personally, I think he really set it up that way ("Hey, don't tell me ANYthing"). He's smart enough about that kind of thing. Kudos. Brady is looking like a moron right now, in the PR aspect. It just seems to me that the Pats have had a continuing pattern of at least accusations, many of which have been proved...this needs a closer look.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

Brady hasn't looked good but he knows it needs to be addressed. Tonight wasn't night for that as he was at a specific event that had been scheduled months ago.

Ted wells performed a colonoscopy on the pats, how much closer can you get? ;)
 
J.D. said:
Brady hasn't looked good but he knows it needs to be addressed. Tonight wasn't night for that as he was at a specific event that had been scheduled months ago.

Ted wells performed a colonoscopy on the pats, how much closer can you get? ;)
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If brady gets 4 games I'll be shocked.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

walrus said:
If brady gets 4 games I'll be shocked.
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yeah, Goodell has to punish Brady, he's boxed himself in a corner with his prior disciplinary actions and has to appear to remain consistent. and as J.D. said, is this kind of infraction really more serious than physical abuse which borders on criminal assault?
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

I'm thinking two games at most. Maybe a fine for not cooperating on top of it.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

J.D. said:
Not even saying pats are innocent but one thing i don't get is why the league basically allowed the first half of afc title game to be played with deflated balls if it's such a big advantage (brady played better with properly inflated balls in 2nd half and had a monster super bowl against legion of boom).
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I think this is the most important information I got from the report was how the NFL operated.

The NFL is so CONCERNED about illegal balls getting onto the field, INTEGRITY of the game, FAIR play, etc. THIS IS SERIOUS BUSINESS!!!!! We need an investgation and a 250-page report!

But when tipped off days before by the Colts (their suspected modus operandi of the Pats was absolutely spot on), the NFL made a choice to go about their business as usual and let potentially (at the time) illegal balls go into play. Heck, it seems like they weren't even going to check the balls after initial pregame testing until the Colts intercepted Brady and checked the PSI of the ball and notified the NFL (again). Do you think this would be as serious of a story if the Pats got caught before the game and they never had the "unfair advantage" of having deflated balls in the game? Of course not. If they had nipped this in the bud and measured some Pats balls right on the sideline before kickoff like the Colts basically dared them to do, they would have caught the Pats and had good balls in the game and everyone would be satisfied... and the results of the game wouldn't be in question. Clearly no one in the NFL thought that out beforehand. Incompetence and bad choices were made by the NFL. NFL is a crapshow under Goodell.

Lastly, I think it's interesting that this overweight, 50+ year old ball guy was confronted after allowing a practice ball (that wasn't subjected to pregame PSI measurements obviously) to enter a game in October 2004. Excuses that day were that another ballboy did it, he had no idea why it happened, and because it was raining and they were trying to get dry balls in the game. Data has shown that the Pats have had astronomical statistics compared to the other teams in the league in regards to fumbling over a long stretch of years and most agree it's tougher to fumble a deflated ball than a properly inflated one. Now that's admittedly a lot of jumping, sure, but ... Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

There's a lot of smoke, there's a lot of fire, the NFL was just so stupid they doused themselves in gasoline and rolled around in the flames rather than putting it out.
 
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Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

You can add McDaniels' cheating while in Denver to the list too, wonder where he learned that?

I don't like the comparison to domestic violence penalties dished out, they are just too different. I actually think the NFL should come down stronger on issues the put the integrity of the game into question, let the legal system deal with criminal issues.

The NC$$ needs to hit them with a lack of institutional control penalty. :D
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

I just can't rationalize taking a little air out of a football being a worse transgression than abuse of women/children. Considering the league has the ability to punish players for both types (and I applaud them for it. I like the fact they suspend players for off field actions), I just don't see it.
 
Re: NFL 2015: Let's Talk About Balls

FreshFish said:
but not under oath ;) in which case they could merely cite their right to remain silent to avoid self-incrimination. And in every jury instruction I've ever heard of, jurors are not supposed to infer anything whatsoever any time a defendant invokes said right.

or, like St. Clown said.
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J.D. said:
I just can't rationalize taking a little air out of a football being a worse transgression than abuse of women/children. Considering the league has the ability to punish players for both types (and I applaud them for it. I like the fact they suspend players for off field actions), I just don't see it.
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Fine Brady and the Pats and move on...
 
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