What's new
USCHO Fan Forum

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

  • The USCHO Fan Forum has migrated to a new plaform, xenForo. Most of the function of the forum should work in familiar ways. Please note that you can switch between light and dark modes by clicking on the gear icon in the upper right of the main menu bar. We are hoping that this new platform will prove to be faster and more reliable. Please feel free to explore its features.

LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

What about Raven? Or was he promised something, then put in the coaches doghouse like many great players before.

Old news. Really old news. And pretty-much meaningless and insignificant news when it was discussed months ago, and when it might have been current, or interesting, or relevant. Its been well covered by people on both sides of that alleged issue, if it can even be called an issue. Nice try, but please find another dead worm to put on your Trolling fishing hook.

Truth-by-Many-Names always brings to mind my Sunday School -- and Proverbs 26:11: "As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool returneth to his folly."
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

Lakerblue. The Ravn issue has always been a mystery for me as well..The way he was talked up,you would have thought we recruited a new Blaine Lacher .
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

nd
Lakerblue. The Ravn issue has always been a mystery for me as well..The way he was talked up,you would have thought we recruited a new Blaine Lacher .

I will take the bait from sm2pk because I respect his postings. I understand that in some way, I am also taking the bait from Truth-With-Many-Names . . . and I accept that fact. I accept that it may tend to make me a hypocrite -- and I take full responsibility for that label. I don't mind hashing old conversations with posters like sm2pk because that is fun, interesting, and sm2pk doesn't make my skin crawl. Truth-With-Many-Names can glean all the perverted Munchausen Syndrome satisfaction his addled mind can extract from our conversation and perhaps have some private bathroom happy time later with a printed transcript -- knowing that he has, once again, perhaps in his own mind, drawn out a snide response from somebody like me. Fair play to him.

Since I don't want to work right now, I will give a rehash of my Ravn position: I don't care about 3rd String Goalies. Neither should you.

Here is why:


He was a stud goalie, and then he wasn't. As noted in previous discussions -- this happens in hockey (and all sports). Watch the over-hyped ESPN-saturated college football signing days -- all these amazing highly-ranked high school football stars. They are all hyped by the coaches and the schools. They even hype themselves from time to time. And you know what happens to many of them? They don't become stars, or even starters, or even 2nd stringers. Every player on a BCS D-I football roster was a highschool stud (well, virtually . . . we'll give Kent State a pass . . . Can't Read, Can't Write, Kent State). But anyhoo . . . Its the rankest folly to argue that every single highly-sought recruit will become a starter, or a star. There are so many, at every level of high-end sports, who are hyped and wined and dined and chased and promised the world -- and don't do jack.

E.g. -- 3rd string goalies.

Every D-I program has them. Most of them were star players in high school and juniors. Most of them thought they were going to be stars in college and maybe make the NHL. Many of them were recruited to come to that school. Many of them were given scholarship money. Many of them, and their parents, were told that "they will be the core of our team, the rock in net." But then they hit the ice, and either the game moved to fast, or the shots came to hard, or the screens were just too complex, or the fitness level to succeed was too much, or the school work gets to them, or -- YES -- sometimes the coaches just don't like they way they play the position, or the way they go about their business. And -- VIOLA -- one-time super star goalie is in a suit on Friday night sitting in Row 27 next to the press box, texting his girlfriend about "unfair stupid coach" and"getting screwed over by the coach" and a few random calls to mommy and daddy. And in my hockey playing days, there were more than a few mommy's and daddy's who just never wrapped their heads around the fact that schnookems isn't Martin Brodeur. Oh my good lord, the scenes I saw as a player, and now as a parent, of other parents screaming at the coaches, the refs, the other teams, the other parents -- their little Timmy is a star -- "If only the rest of the world would wake up and see that!" Its so absurd its a hockey cliche. Find a local, A-level travel hockey team for 10 year olds, and guess what? You'll find some parents and players who think the coach is screwing them over. So I hear the Ravn discussions, and I have to laugh. We are fans -- we are allegedly college educated or in the process of being college educated -- and in the name of coach-bashing we take up this absurd cause?

My problem with the stupid Ravn discussion was that this was "further evidence of the coaching staff's incompetence and wicked, evil, diobolical ways." What a load of crap-o-la.

As a Lions fan, we've always believed the 2nd string Qb was the ticket to salvation.

Folks, players are low in the depth charts for a reason. Usually, almost always, its because the palyer isn't good enough to be any higher.

If there is any indicment regarding Coach Roque and his 3rd string goalie, it is only that Roque talked this kid up too much.
 
Last edited:
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

nd

I will take the bait from sm2pk because I respect his postings. I understand that in some way, I am also taking the bait from Truth-With-Many-Names . . . and I accept that fact. I accept that it may tend to make me a hypocrite -- and I take full responsibility for that label. I don't mind hashing old conversations with posters like sm2pk because that is fun, interesting, and sm2pk doesn't make my skin crawl. Truth-With-Many-Names can glean all the perverted Munchausen Syndrome satisfaction his addled mind can extract from our conversation and perhaps have some private bathroom happy time later with a printed transcript -- knowing that he has, once again, perhaps in his own mind, drawn out a snide response from somebody like me. Fair play to him.

Since I don't want to work right now, I will give a rehash of my Ravn position: I don't care about 3rd String Goalies. Neither should you.

Here is why:


He was a stud goalie, and then he wasn't. As noted in previous discussions -- this happens in hockey (and all sports). Watch the over-hyped ESPN-saturated college football signing days -- all these amazing highly-ranked high school football stars. They are all hyped by the coaches and the schools. They even hype themselves from time to time. And you know what happens to many of them? They don't become stars, or even starters, or even 2nd stringers. Every player on a BCS D-I football roster was a highschool stud (well, virtually . . . we'll give Kent State a pass . . . Can't Read, Can't Write, Kent State). But anyhoo . . . Its the rankest folly to argue that every single highly-sought recruit will become a starter, or a star. There are so many, at every level of high-end sports, who are hyped and wined and dined and chased and promised the world -- and don't do jack.

E.g. -- 3rd string goalies.

Every D-I program has them. Most of them were star players in high school and juniors. Most of them thought they were going to be stars in college and maybe make the NHL. Many of them were recruited to come to that school. Many of them were given scholarship money. Many of them, and their parents, were told that "they will be the core of our team, the rock in net." But then they hit the ice, and either the game moved to fast, or the shots came to hard, or the screens were just too complex, or the fitness level to succeed was too much, or the school work gets to them, or -- YES -- sometimes the coaches just don't like they way they play the position, or the way they go about their business. And -- VIOLA -- one-time super star goalie is in a suit on Friday night sitting in Row 27 next to the press box, texting his girlfriend about "unfair stupid coach" and"getting screwed over by the coach" and a few random calls to mommy and daddy. And in my hockey playing days, there were more than a few mommy's and daddy's who just never wrapped their heads around the fact that schnookems isn't Martin Brodeur. Oh my good lord, the scenes I saw as a player, and now as a parent, of other parents screaming at the coaches, the refs, the other teams, the other parents -- their little Timmy is a star -- "If only the rest of the world would wake up and see that!" Its so absurd its a hockey cliche. Find a local, A-level travel hockey team for 10 year olds, and guess what? You'll find some parents and players who think the coach is screwing them over. So I hear the Ravn discussions, and I have to laugh. We are fans -- we are allegedly college educated or in the process of being college educated -- and in the name of coach-bashing we take up this absurd cause?

My problem with the stupid Ravn discussion was that this was "further evidence of the coaching staff's incompetence and wicked, evil, diobolical ways." What a load of crap-o-la.

As a Lions fan, we've always believed the 2nd string Qb was the ticket to salvation.

Folks, players are low in the depth charts for a reason. Usually, almost always, its because the palyer isn't good enough to be any higher.

If there is any indicment regarding Coach Roque and his 3rd string goalie, it is only that Roque talked this kid up too much.
OK, I’ll jump in on this again. Let me preface things by saying that my comments are strictly my opinion, except as noted otherwise. For the most part, I don’t have a lot of known facts to support my position.

I have no problem with Kapalka being the #1 goalie. He played very well his freshmen season and pretty well this past season, although I don’t think up to par with his first year.

I believe the coaching staff (and Roque in particular) initially recruited Ravn as a #1 or #2 goalie. They subsequently recruited Kapalka to fill that role during the same recruiting season. The only reasons I can think of why they would do that, given that BMW was still coming back for one more season, is that either (1) they had to take Kapalka in order to also get Campbell whom they wanted badly (both played for Vaughan in the OJHL; Campbell may have pressed for this), or (2) they saw Kapalka play after they saw Ravn play in Juniors and decided they liked Kapalka better (perhaps Campbell even asked them to look at KK when they were recruiting him). The bottom line is that I think prior to the start of the 2010-11 season, Roque had Kapalka pegged as the prime goalie recruit for that season and didn’t really care whether or not Ravn still came to LSSU. I think that Roque should have communicated to Ravn at that time that he had changed his mind about Ravn’s future as a Laker and that he would be better off to look elsewhere to play college hockey. That would have been the fair and proper thing to do. I don’t think that happened, or if there was an attempt to do so, it wasn’t communicated very well.

As far as #3 goalies are concerned, I don’t think most of them get much if any scholarship money. If they stick with the program, sure many schools probably find some limited money to give them eventually, but I don’t think it’s normally very much.

I have another issue with how Roque has treated Ravn, and this one is supported by fact. I don’t know how many of you listen to the weekly Laker Hockey Show on Mondays or the Inside Laker Hockey podcasts on Wednesdays. On one of the podcasts this past season (it was in last half of the season), Paul Waggoner and Jim Roque were talking about the goaltending situation after one of the games that Murdock had played. Roque was commenting that it was nice to have Murdock as a backup to KK and that “last season after BMW went down and KK was playing full time they were worried about something happening to KK because if anything happened to him they had nothing behind him”. I was very disappointed to hear Roque say that and think it was very disrespectful to Ravn whom Roque had actively recruited to come to LSSU. It also makes me wonder what the other players think about Roque, at least those who are aware that he said that.

I think Roque is hoping Ravn won’t return next season. Sure we can say that Ravn could transfer to a Div 3 school and he wouldn’t have to sit out a year, but I don’t think things are that simple for Ravn. Ravn is what, 22 or 23 years old, so he probably doesn’t want to start looking for another school at this point in his career. Plus he’s an engineering student so that probably further limits his options. If he does come back, and KK and Murdock stay as well for the duration of their eligibility, we’ll be in a 4 goalie situation in another year once Marble is on the scene.

To be clear, I’m not simply complaining about a lack of playing time for Ravn, who is currently the Lakers #3 goalie. I just don’t think Roque has treated Ravn very well as a person.
 
Last edited:
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

OK, I’ll jump in on this again. Let me preface things by saying that my comments are strictly my opinion, except as noted otherwise. For the most part, I don’t have a lot of known facts to support my position.

I have no problem with Kapalka being the #1 goalie. He played very well his freshmen season and pretty well this past season, although I don’t think up to par with his first year.

I believe the coaching staff (and Roque in particular) initially recruited Ravn as a #1 or #2 goalie. They subsequently recruited Kapalka to fill that role during the same recruiting season. The only reasons I can think of why they would do that, given that BMW was still coming back for one more season, is that either (1) they had to take Kapalka in order to also get Campbell whom they wanted badly (both played for Vaughan in the OJHL; Campbell may have pressed for this), or (2) they saw Kapalka play after they saw Ravn play in Juniors and decided they liked Kapalka better (perhaps Campbell even asked them to look at KK when they were recruiting him). The bottom line is that I think prior to the start of the 2010-11 season, Roque had Kapalka pegged as the prime goalie recruit for that season and didn’t really care whether or not Ravn still came to LSSU. I think that Roque should have communicated to Ravn at that time that he had changed his mind about Ravn’s future as a Laker and that he would be better off to look elsewhere to play college hockey. That would have been the fair and proper thing to do. I don’t think that happened, or if there was an attempt to do so, it wasn’t communicated very well.

As far as #3 goalies are concerned, I don’t think most of them get much if any scholarship money. If they stick with the program, sure many schools probably find some limited money to give them eventually, but I don’t think it’s normally very much.

I have another issue with how Roque has treated Ravn, and this one is supported by fact. I don’t know how many of you listen to the weekly Laker Hockey Show on Mondays or the Inside Laker Hockey podcasts on Wednesdays. On one of the podcasts this past season (it was in last half of the season), Paul Waggoner and Jim Roque were talking about the goaltending situation after one of the games that Murdock had played. Roque was commenting that it was nice to have Murdock as a backup to KK and that “last season after BMW went down and KK was playing full time they were worried about something happening to KK because if anything happened to him they had nothing behind him”. I was very disappointed to hear Roque say that and think it was very disrespectful to Ravn whom Roque had actively recruited to come to LSSU. It also makes me wonder what the other players think about Roque, at least those who are aware that he said that.

I think Roque is hoping Ravn won’t return next season. Sure we can say that Ravn could transfer to a Div 3 school and he wouldn’t have to sit out a year, but I don’t think things are that simple for Ravn. Ravn is what, 22 or 23 years old, so he probably doesn’t want to start looking for another school at this point in his career. Plus he’s an engineering student so that probably further limits his options. If he does come back, and KK and Murdock stay as well for the duration of their eligibility, we’ll be in a 4 goalie situation in another year once Marble is on the scene.

To be clear, I’m not simply complaining about a lack of playing time for Ravn, who is currently the Lakers #3 goalie. I just don’t think Roque has treated Ravn very well as a person.
The bottom line is coaches are judged by wins and losses. They will put the players on the ice who they feel give the team the best chance to win. If the coach needed to give KK a rest and he felt Ravn gave LSSU a better chance to win than Murdock, he would play him. Quite possibly Ravn is the 3rd best goalie on the roster and that's why he hasn't played.
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

When this happens up there at your little college it shouldn't be a surprise anymore with you people.

The Truth Is Out There.....
TBA
Yeah, play a kid who doesn't give your team the best chance to win. If the kid doesn't come in and earn the ice time, then he doesn't get it. If Ravn did not prove to be a better keeper than either Kapalka or Murdock, then why should he play?
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

Bill, that is one hell of a thing to say about a player . I am sure saying you have no one backing up KK if he were to go down makes the whole team feel somewhat disgusted.
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

The bottom line is coaches are judged by wins and losses. They will put the players on the ice who they feel give the team the best chance to win. If the coach needed to give KK a rest and he felt Ravn gave LSSU a better chance to win than Murdock, he would play him. Quite possibly Ravn is the 3rd best goalie on the roster and that's why he hasn't played.

I didn't get that Bill was arguing that Ravn should be playing. I thought he was pretty clear that he was just saying that he didn't think Ravn was treated very well as a person.
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

I didn't get that Bill was arguing that Ravn should be playing. I thought he was pretty clear that he was just saying that he didn't think Ravn was treated very well as a person.

Maybe the kid is a schmuck? I don't hear Roque speaking ill of any players. So you have to really be searching for the backhanded insult. BUt lets say he intended a backhanded insult . . . perhaps it was deserved? Perhaps it was a not-so-subtle motivating tool?

Scotty Bowman was frustrated with Brendan Shanahan at one point -- Shanny was starting to get offensive-happy, starting to avoid the slot (ala Brett Hull) to try to unleash his shot. Bowman's quote in the paper: (roughly recalled): "Shanahan has a great shot. If you're going to be a one-dimensional player, thats a good one dimension to have as a player." Shanahan came out the next night was hit everything that moved, got into a good fight, and crashed the net all night long.

Bowman made a few random remarks over the course of one month during the season about Federov not exactly paying as close attention to detail -- defensively. The he randomly annouces pre-game that he is moving Federov to Defense! Sergei played 3-4 games on the blue-line. You could almost hear Bowman saying, "If you won't willingly play defense, I will put you there."

I played for Bert Templeton in Canada. Bert had a funny way of getting some guys fired up. I had a horse crap week -- just could not, for the life of me, catch a break on the ice. So after three horrible games, we are in Sudbury and I dress, but I never touch the ice. I was on the PK . . . never saw the ice. I sat on the end of the bench all night long. After the game, we are hauling our gear to the bus, and Bert sees me and calls me over and has me stand next to him, and says, "Hey, I want to talk to you for a second, just stay here I need to talk to this other guy first." The other guy was a local reporter, who asked why he went with 5 D, and why I was sitting on the end of the bench. I will never forget Bert's answer, with me standing right there: "We played all the defensemen we dressed tonight. I didn't see any other defensemen on the bench. I would've played him if I saw him."

Then he turns to me and says, "Oh, I forgot what I was going to tell you. Just get on the bus."

And I heard this, and saw this, played out throughout my hockey life. And Bert Templeton was a gentleman of the highest order. And Scotty Bowman is the greatest hockey coach EVER.

If a young man hears the type of quote made by Roque -- and thinks there is ANYTHING personal in that comment, he is a fool. When you're in the doghouse, there are two things you can do: Quit, or bust your tail to get out of that doghouse. And guess what, some guys are in the doghouse because they aren't playing up to an expected level. And they hear the coach's message and wake up, hit the ice hard, hit the weight room, stay on for extra practice, they work 100% harder -- and it still DOES NOT MATTER. Sometimes, you can work as hard as you want -- you just may not be good enough. So the coach tries a few motivation techniques -- and when it becomes obvious that the problem isn't motivation -- its skill and talent -- then the coach usually drops the subject so as not to embarass the kid any more.

In this case, it appears the coach called out the kid on his radio show. The kid, for whatever reason, still hasn't hit the ice for a game. I don't watch the practices. I don't hob-nob with the team except at certain booster functions. I can only tell you that hard work some times only gets you so far.

But I must fully and completely disagree that this young man was treated poorly by the coach because of an offhand remark made on a radio show. If anything, the coach was probably tossing the kid a motivational bone. In hockey, that is how we motivate -- seriously, just tell a high-end hockey player he CAN'T play, and you'll see a very impressive reaction.

If Scotty Bowman can play mind games to motivate Brendan Shanahan and Sergei Federov -- I think its safe to say that the head coach of LSSU can try to motivate his players, too.
 
And yet another blind sheep defender of this administration throwing a kid under the bus calling him names like mentioned in the first sentence of this ramble.

You people up there never change and yet another example of the good ole boy yupper network in your village blaming of a young man to blame rather than grown adults. You people are so predictible!!!!

The Truth Is Out There....
TBA

It's YOOPER.
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

Since Ravn was down at Maloney's Alley on St. Pattys Day getting drunk and spewing crap-o-la about how the team never had a chance this year and throwing teammates under the bus like it was going out of style, I'm gonna say there are probably some underlying issues regarding that situation. And no, thats not 3rd party. He was telling me directly.

Do we really want to go in this direction. Lakers2Glory, you have now posted that you had Nick Sellers in a class and he was running down the coach so he deserved to be gone. Now you were in a bar drinking with another player and he was running down the coach and he is in the doghouse. No-one likes a snitch. Maybe you should stay away from the players if you are going to get involved in their careers. If you think coming on here and saying things like you just posted is not getting involved then maybe you should use better judgement. Can someone tell me why everyone who is a remote threat to Coach Roque is on a hit list? Players are gone, coaches are gone, radio announcers are gone.......then brought back, what the heck is up with this stuff?
Do we really want to start saying what players say about the program and the coach? Do you think this would go as positively as you or Lakerblue's represent in your posts? You might be surprised how the players really feel.
Let's leave the players out of it. If Ravn is being singled out because he or his parents are openly unhappy with his situation then that is just not right. If it because he is not good enough that is at least understandable but to call him out with the media should be left to the real Scotty Bowman's and Bert Templeton's of the world and no disrespect intended but Coach Roque is no Scotty Bowman. At least not yet. We are dealing with College athletics, not the NHL. I am happy that according to Lakerblue there is complete harmony within the hockey program for the first time in 20 years and that cash is rolling. Coach Roque should be commended for the bold things he has done to accomplish this but let's use that to build something positive not a circus side shoq.
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

When you have the good ole boy network up there in Sault Sainte Marie, "unnamed donors" whose want this coach kept in power at all cost, and the vitriolic defenders on here who will attack former players, hall of fame coaches, and good solid kids who were former players and for some reason fell out of favor or wouldn't "play ball", despite six straight bottom division finishes, dwindling attendance, playoff crowds in the 300 range, well you people know the list and have been and continue to be having to making excuses for it year after year after year after year after year after year after year after year.

The Truth Is Out There......
TBA
TBA


I waffle.

I admit it.

I am not a polititian, so I am allowed to waffle.

Do you feed the stray dog, or just leave him alone?

Some days, I take a solid oath to never take the bait.

Other days, I am either bored, or tired, or grumpy, or I have some other non-threatening-but-still-irritating malady (Double Whopper with Cheese and Onion Rings can create this sort of sick-in-the-stomach feeling for at least an hour after lunch).

Today, I feel like playing.

I know better.

I know that kicking the Gimp is only going to cause more Gimp-like activities. And yet, there is the Gimp -- asking to be kicked. And here I am -- looking for a Gimp to kick.

You don't scratch poison ivy -- and yet its almost impossible to NOT scratch poison ivy.

Worse, is when you realize that the Gimp is really just a barely-literate southeastern Michigan man who is adept at cut-and-paste message board responses.

I know all this.

And . . . well . . . darn it . . .

I want better work from Truthy. Seriously. I don't mind a person being a single-entity blow-hard jackhole who just wants to make nasty comments about an entire community, school, alumni base, fan base and region. Thats all fine. What good is the internet is you can't insult people while protected by the anaymous computer screen names? But I am going to come right out and say it: I want more. Don't bring a knife to a gunfight -- and then keep showing up with the same knife, to the same gunfight, over and over and over again. Change it up. Bring Ninja throwing stars, maybe? How about a grenade? Maybe mix it up? Cutting and pasting is just so . . . dull.

If you're going to be so blinded by hate and bile and anger and rage -- well at least entertain. Give us a song. Give us a dance.

Lets have a show. One-two-three kick in knee high patent leather boots. Something saucy? Come on, Truth-by-Many-Names -- up your game.

Show us what you've got!

Wow us. Dazzle us.

If you're going to just cut and paste rather insipid and brainless rantings, you might as well wander over to the Minnesota threads . . . you would really fit in nicely over there. They like to drone on and on and on and on about nothingness. But if you're going to Gimp-around in a UP site, you have to bring some style, some attitude, some excitement.
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

You won't get anything. That post won't even be here a day from now. You know that.
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

Truthy's kid lost in the Reebok Parking Lot Street Hockey Tournament semi-finals last weekend. The bitterness still lingers.
 
Re: LSSU Hockey 2012-2013

You won't get anything. That post won't even be here a day from now. You know that.

Do you think he just gets out of the living room on to the computer and starts posting crap and then his kid sneaks in here in the next day and delete it all because of the overwhelming shame of having THAT guy for a dad?
 
Back
Top