Future of the ccha????

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Future of the ccha????

Except that the Alaska travel is mostly paid for by UA (Fairbanks) and gets you two games that don't count against your total.

Which really doesn't help the former AHA schools nearly as much as the NCHC teams. In all honesty, I'm kinda surprised that the NCHC didn't want one of the alaska schools...

 

[5hole]

Re: Future of the ccha????

The two exempt games are nice but I would want to make absolutely sure that UAF was still willing to pay for travel if they were participating in a league that did not include the big name B1G schools

For Niagara, a flight of just 2-3 hours from Buffalo to Huntsville with only a one-our time zone difference is a lot more desirable than the Alaska flight ... A commercial flight from Buffalo to Fairbanks has a duration of about 14-18 hours including stopovers (Buf-Chi-Sea-FAI) plus you have, I believe, a five hour time difference.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Future of the ccha????

Not really. The question is, do they want to go there? Do they want the expense of a 2 day trip?

Well obviously they don't mind since Mercyhurst is making a trip down there by choice...so are LSSU and BGSU. FSU and RMU made the trip last year. The question is how big of a hang up would this be for Canisius and Niagara (since neither has done a NC series in Huntsville recently)?

 

[bigmrg74]

Well obviously they don't mind since Mercyhurst is making a trip down there by choice...so are LSSU and BGSU. FSU and RMU made the trip last year. The question is how big of a hang up would this be for Canisius and Niagara (since neither has done a NC series in Huntsville recently)?

Niagara has played in Huntsville before, and knows how big of a bind they're in. I would think they would be fairly sympathic to Huntsville. They know what's it's like to hung out to dry.

 

[Squarebanks]

It's 4 hours difference. Also, it's probably safe to say we have little to no interest pairing up with AHA schools.

For Niagara, a flight of just 2-3 hours from Buffalo to Huntsville with only a one-our time zone difference is a lot more desirable than the Alaska flight ... A commercial flight from Buffalo to Fairbanks has a duration of about 14-18 hours including stopovers (Buf-Chi-Sea-FAI) plus you have, I believe, a five hour time difference.

 

[5hole]

Re: Future of the ccha????

It's 4 hours difference. Also, it's probably safe to say we have little to no interest pairing up with AHA schools.

Okay, four hours ... didn't have time to check it as I was just leaving the house.

Your lack of enthusiasm for pairing up with AHA schools is not surprising ... saw a lot of the same sentiment on the LSSU and FSU threads. Since we are divulging our true feelings here, this was my post on a Niagara sports talk site:

" ...the attitude of some of their fans at the CCHA leftovers that we could be joining ... while they rightfully look at the four AHA schools as quite a comedown from Miami, Michigan, Michigan State and Ohio State - and even from those directional schools Western and Northern Michigan - they do not really see things as our fans do. Yes, we get back to 18 scholies and that is critical. But - is it really an upgrade to go from Air Force, RIT and Holy Cross to LSSU, Ferris State and BGSU? HELL NO!! What it does do is rid us of our dregs - AIC, UCONN, Bentley, SHU. And give us more control ... if FOUR AHA schools join to become the Eastern Bloc of the CCHA and there are only three CCHA leftovers as the western block, then you would think we could run the conference, right?

That is not what some of their fans are thinking ...
From LSSU thread on USCHO:
No WCHA? That will be terrible -- but what are our options if this happens? I say LSSU takes charge. Put the league offices in the Soo. Take the position that LSSU is the best situated college hockey school in the remaining mess. If we must band together and take on UAH, Ferris, BGSU, and Robert Morris, Niagara, Mercyhurst -- then lets take a position that LSSU is the biggest, best, more traditional-laden team of that group."

Hey, good luck getting into the WCHA.

 

[Squarebanks]

Re: Future of the ccha????

Okay, four hours ... didn't have time to check it as I was just leaving the house.

Your lack of enthusiasm for pairing up with AHA schools is not surprising ... saw a lot of the same sentiment on the LSSU and FSU threads. Since we are divulging our true feelings here, this was my post on a Niagara sports talk site:

" ...the attitude of some of their fans at the CCHA leftovers that we could be joining ... while they rightfully look at the four AHA schools as quite a comedown from Miami, Michigan, Michigan State and Ohio State - and even from those directional schools Western and Northern Michigan - they do not really see things as our fans do. Yes, we get back to 18 scholies and that is critical. But - is it really an upgrade to go from Air Force, RIT and Holy Cross to LSSU, Ferris State and BGSU? HELL NO!! What it does do is rid us of our dregs - AIC, UCONN, Bentley, SHU. And give us more control ... if FOUR AHA schools join to become the Eastern Bloc of the CCHA and there are only three CCHA leftovers as the western block, then you would think we could run the conference, right?

That is not what some of their fans are thinking ...
From LSSU thread on USCHO:
No WCHA? That will be terrible -- but what are our options if this happens? I say LSSU takes charge. Put the league offices in the Soo. Take the position that LSSU is the best situated college hockey school in the remaining mess. If we must band together and take on UAH, Ferris, BGSU, and Robert Morris, Niagara, Mercyhurst -- then lets take a position that LSSU is the biggest, best, more traditional-laden team of that group."

Hey, good luck getting into the WCHA.

The lack of enthusiasm has nothing to do with arrogance...it's simply that a bunch of NY and PA schools is a poor conference fit with an Alaska school. UAF needs to be moving west, not east. The travel alone would be a nightmare; as it is now, CCHA travel is long but doable; most road trips to the current CCHA can be done with one connection (Fairbanks-Seattle-Detroit/Chicago). Adding some of the AHA schools into the mix makes those trips two connections on a good day. There are other reasons, but it's nothing personal towards AHA teams, it's just not a good fit.

 

[ExileOnDaytonStreet]

Re: Future of the ccha????

It'd be interesting to see if the new WCHA could find a way to function with two Alaska schools. That's a lot of flights.

On the plus side, if MSU-M 2.0 actually does come to pass, then the WCHA would have eight teams with pretty natural permanent rivalries: UAF-UAA, SCSU-MSUM, BSU-MSUM 2.0 and MTU-NMU. Still probably can't avoid the possibility of some teams making two flights to Alaska.

 

[scsutommyboy]

Re: Future of the ccha????

I think that as long as North Dakato has a say, SCSU probably won't get in invitation. Then-president Sago of SCSU is who instigated that lawsuit to have teams like the Fighting Sioux change their nicknames.

SCSU wasn't invited. I think they could get an invite in the future if they have the proper support. The problem is they have a president with no vision, so they wouldn't join any way.

 

[mmf]

Re: Future of the ccha????

I took break to eat dinner and Squarebanks scooped me...but what I was typing was...

A reconstituted CCHA without UM, MSU, OSU, ND, NMU, and possibly WMU would be a step backward for Alaska, but hopefully it's not perceived as an arrogance thing on our part. We have no reason to be arrogant. But it is what it is.

The problem with a reconstituted CCHA is that we are no longer a good fit. If we are left out of the WCHA, I can't see us subsidizing travel for the newly formed CCHA. That's a high price to pay for the diminished conference. Based on the teams that could possibly become part of the CCHA, I'm not sure they could afford the travel or even want us in the conference if we do not continue to subsidize travel.

So lacking WCHA affiliation, I see us probably being kicked out of the CCHA.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Future of the ccha????

It'd be interesting to see if the new WCHA could find a way to function with two Alaska schools. That's a lot of flights.

On the plus side, if MSU-M 2.0 actually does come to pass, then the WCHA would have eight teams with pretty natural permanent rivalries: UAF-UAA, SCSU-MSUM, BSU-MSUM 2.0 and MTU-NMU. Still probably can't avoid the possibility of some teams making two flights to Alaska.

It's really not that big of a deal when you consider they no longer have to make flights to colorado...

 

[scsutommyboy]

Re: Future of the ccha????

It's really not that big of a deal when you consider they no longer have to make flights to colorado...

I know most people won't agree, but I think it would be fine with Alaska joining the WCHA as long as the league adds a 8th team. In my opinion I would like to LSSUhe, but I doubt other than the UP eams would go for that.

 

[sideshowbob]

Re: Future of the ccha????

The problem with a reconstituted CCHA is that we are no longer a good fit. If we are left out of the WCHA, I can't see us subsidizing travel for the newly formed CCHA. That's a high price to pay for the diminished conference. Based on the teams that could possibly become part of the CCHA, I'm not sure they could afford the travel or even want us in the conference if we do not continue to subsidize travel.

So lacking WCHA affiliation, I see us probably being kicked out of the CCHA.

The sad irony of the situation is that the best fit for either of the Alaska schools -- both for the school and their conference mates -- would be the NCHC. Those schools, given their attendance and revenues, have more to gain from the Alaska exemption. Plus they are going to be flight dependent for many games anyway. And they are closer and easier to get to for an Alaska school (I would think; someone with more knowledge might be able to comment on the flight connections). I would think UAA or UAF would be happy to continue subsidizing visiting schools if it meant the likes of UND, UD, etc. as the guests.

Obviously, no indication this is happening, though, but if Notre Dame ends up in the NCHC as I expect, I think they'd be better off inviting either UAF or UAA instead of Western Michigan if they plan to go to 8 teams (though it's possible they'd just prefer 7 teams and more non-conference games).

 

[mmf]

Re: Future of the ccha????

Obviously, no indication this is happening, though, but if Notre Dame ends up in the NCHC as I expect, I think they'd be better off inviting either UAF or UAA instead of Western Michigan if they plan to go to 8 teams (though it's possible they'd just prefer 7 teams and more non-conference games).

I had commented in the Alaska thread that adding Alaska as the 8th team would...
...give NCHC 28 conference games and 8 non-conf, which is a big consideration for ND.
...each team picks up 4 conf games, possibly 4 conf wins , but only drops 2 non-conf games...such a deal.
...travel mostly paid for by Alaska.
...and remember, it's a dry cold.

 

[davyd83]

Re: Future of the ccha????

I had commented in the Alaska thread that adding Alaska as the 8th team would...
...give NCHC 28 conference games and 8 non-conf, which is a big consideration for ND.
...each team picks up 4 conf games, possibly 4 conf wins , but only drops 2 non-conf games...such a deal.
...travel mostly paid for by Alaska.
...and remember, it's a dry cold.

Neither Alaska school is likely to enter the NCHC because they don't bring the budgetary "commitment" that the other founding members do. In fact, it's quite likely that they bring less than half.

 

[davyd83]

Re: Future of the ccha????

Well obviously they don't mind since Mercyhurst is making a trip down there by choice...so are LSSU and BGSU. FSU and RMU made the trip last year. The question is how big of a hang up would this be for Canisius and Niagara (since neither has done a NC series in Huntsville recently)?

That's doing one trip down to Huntsville by choice. Not the same as having to make that trip every year.

 

[Squarebanks]

Neither Alaska school is likely to enter the NCHC because they don't bring the budgetary "commitment" that the other founding members do. In fact, it's quite likely that they bring less than half.

I think it's less to do with budgets and more to do with the fact we are both D-II in everything besides hockey (although I personally think UAA is scheming for D-1 with their new arena, but that's another discussion). That plus the fact we are in Alaska, which might as well be the moon for those NCHC schools.

 

[fairman]

Re: Future of the ccha????

That's doing one trip down to Huntsville by choice. Not the same as having to make that trip every year.

It's a difference of 3 hours in distance from Mercyhurst to Bentley versus Mercyhurst to Huntsville. It's only a difference of ONE HOUR of driving time from RMU to UAH versus RMU to Bentley.

I do the drive from Huntsville to Columbus or Cleveland multiple times a year, in one day, by myself. Sure, it's closer then Pittsburgh or Erie, but not by all that much. Travel for the western PA schools should not be the huge issue that you're making of it. Can you read a map? It's not like Huntsville's on the Gulf Coast. It's 1.5 hours south of Nashville.

 

[mmf]

Re: Future of the ccha????

Neither Alaska school is likely to enter the NCHC because they don't bring the budgetary "commitment" that the other founding members do. In fact, it's quite likely that they bring less than half.

No doubt we are a much better fit for the WCHA. We would be “owned” in every sense of the word by the NCHC. But there aren’t too any programs out there that basically pay for all their conference foes to travel to their barn and also provides those same teams an opportunity to pick up two more non-conference home games. The NCHC wouldn’t be looking so much at what we bring to the conference, but how can they best “use” us to their benefit.

I hope we end up in the WCHA.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Future of the ccha????

That's doing one trip down to Huntsville by choice. Not the same as having to make that trip every year.

LSSU to Huntsville is the same as LSSU to Omaha...I don't see the big deal