Future Frozen Four sites

[Nick Papagiorgio]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

Then call those cities / arenas and convince them to submit bids.
Many on here are bemoaning the cities that they wish were chosen, but nearly all of them share one thing in common - no bids. You can't win it if you're not in it.

Makes one wonder if the NCAA is not making it an easy sell to put in a bid.

 

[gscott13]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

Add me to the list of those that were underwhelmed with the list... I get Detroit given that FFFF was an abject disaster because of the facility, but with Little Caesar's Arena opening, I get it. Pretty meh on the others having lived in Boston for a number of years, having it recently in the Burgh, and well, Buffalo is Buffalo.

The one location I was really hoping for was for someone to put in a bid for Nashville... I would go for the full week and not just jet in on Wednesday and leave Sunday morning... Someone made a comment that the SEC hoops tournament and concerned about a conflict... FF runs during the NCAA hoops tourneys, so there should be no conflict there... I too was hoping for a return to Denver...

I like the idea of Portland, OR, but I don't see it happening anytime soon. San Jose and Dallas would be an interesting choice, too...

 

[joecct]

Seriously?! I'm not even from the Twin Cities and I know this is a totally bogus statement.



Well, if you are going to Ritter, you'll end up in Rochester, NY on the RIT campus. I'll buy you a beer, because you won't have much women's hockey to watch.

But I think you would rather go to RiDDer...

Speaking of the Ridder, Mrs. Ridder died yesterday.

 

[pgb-ohio]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

I think another big drawback is the "home rink" angle. While St. Paul is a huge advantage to Minnesota and the TD Garden is a huge advantage to the Boston area schools, at least they're not literally someone's home rink. I think you'd hear b******g if OSU made the FF as a low seed.

I know this factor is very important to you, and I do respect your viewpoint. But in the context of the Frozen Four , it's truly an argument in search of an issue.

A Schottenstein Center bid will not be forthcoming. As for the rest of college hockey? To the best of my knowledge there's only one other home rink big enough to host a FF -- Kohl Center in Madison. While I'm the furthest thing from a UW insider, I'd wager that UW will bid for Milwaukee or even Tampa again rather than Madison.

You can relax on this one.

 

[thebrain]

I know this factor is very important to you, and I do respect your viewpoint. But in the context of the Frozen Four , it's truly an argument in search of an issue.

A Schottenstein Center bid will not be forthcoming. As for the rest of college hockey? To the best of my knowledge there's only one other home rink big enough to host a FF -- Kohl Center in Madison. While I'm the furthest thing from a UW insider, I'd wager that UW will bid for Milwaukee or even Tampa again rather than Madison.

You can relax on this one.

The Admirals moved to the old Mecca Arena in Milwaukee. The new arena would have make ice for a Frozen Four. A regional would work well there though.

I can see a lot of arenas not wanting to give up a Wednesday through Saturday to an event which will bring in roughly 18,000 people on two of those nights with no beer money coming in.

It gets really tough to schedule if you have multiple tenants. NBA teams will place a hold on an arena for weeks at a time. I would think an NHL team would do the same. It must be crazy trying to book Staples Center with two NBA teams and an NHL team.

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

The Admirals moved to the old Mecca Arena in Milwaukee. The new arena would have make ice for a Frozen Four. A regional would work well there though.

I can see a lot of arenas not wanting to give up a Wednesday through Saturday to an event which will bring in roughly 18,000 people on two of those nights with no beer money coming in.

It gets really tough to schedule if you have multiple tenants. NBA teams will place a hold on an arena for weeks at a time. I would think an NHL team would do the same. It must be crazy trying to book Staples Center with two NBA teams and an NHL team.

The new Milwaukee arena will have ice making capabilities, it just won't have the admirals.

 

[pgb-ohio]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

[

The new Milwaukee arena will have ice making capabilities, it just won't have the admirals.

That's my understanding as well.

Also notice the NCAA likes to select shiny, new buildings for marquee events. This is no different than MLB All-Star Games or NFL Super Bowls. And there really isn't anything wrong with that; new buildings do create interest.

In the FF Lottery era, the overwhelming emphasis has been on NHL Arenas. When exceptions have been made, problems have arisen. But a new NBA building in Milwaukee, designed to accommodate a rink? Just maybe that's the exception that would work.

 

[CLS]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

Makes one wonder if the NCAA is not making it an easy sell to put in a bid.

With the focus on NHL rinks, there's a built in disadvantage in that this is a critical period in the NHL season, especially in light of the signage and messages in the ice restrictions. In the case of some venues it's even worse, because you also affect an NBA team, also in a critical time of their season.

I'm frankly surprised that Boston put in another bid so soon, particularly in light of the fact that they already lose a weekend to the HE tournament.

Even if the NCAA is a big event, if you can sell out the joint anyway with fans who pay for overpriced beer, what's the incentive? It seems to me the only institutions that benefit are the hotels, airlines, and tourist attractions. Speaking for Boston, the bars and restaurants near might do marginally better, since fewer folks need to eat at a restaurant, but they're pretty full for Bruins games anyway.

 

[brassbonanza]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

Schloss is tweeting this morning that UND will very likely be hosting *another* regional in Sioux Falls, SD this coming year. Mankato, Omaha, St. Cloud, and the Gophers are all geographically closer.

 

[UAHStatman]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

And you don't even have to have a hockey team. Didn't Navy host the DC Frozen Four?

Yes, and Fairfield was a regional host after it dropped their varsity program.

 

[TigerFan86-87]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

With the focus on NHL rinks, there's a built in disadvantage in that this is a critical period in the NHL season, especially in light of the signage and messages in the ice restrictions. In the case of some venues it's even worse, because you also affect an NBA team, also in a critical time of their season.

I'm frankly surprised that Boston put in another bid so soon, particularly in light of the fact that they already lose a weekend to the HE tournament.

Even if the NCAA is a big event, if you can sell out the joint anyway with fans who pay for overpriced beer, what's the incentive? It seems to me the only institutions that benefit are the hotels, airlines, and tourist attractions. Speaking for Boston, the bars and restaurants near might do marginally better, since fewer folks need to eat at a restaurant, but they're pretty full for Bruins games anyway.

I agree with the criticality of that point in the season angle.
However when it comes to comparing the sellout crowds (and their drinking habits) between the NHL / NBA games with the Frozen Four, it is not a zero sum game where one is traded for the other. The arenas are going to host the same number of home NHL and NBA games regardless of when the other one-time events occur. It's a matter of when, not if, the pro games are scheduled. The FF revenue is additional, regardless. What it might need to be traded for is some other one-time event (Circus, WWE, Concerts, Trade Shows, etc.)

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

I have a full list of bids going back a long time. When I get back to my desk I'll publish the data I could find.

I predicted Buffalo, Detroit, Denver, DC with Tampa, Vegas/Phoenix as dark horses.

Dream would be Nashville, Denver, DC, and Portland (OR)

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

2004-2006 Round
2004:
Anaheim
San Jose - Finalist
Orlando
Atlanta
Boston - Host
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City - Finalist
St. Louis - Finalist
East Rutherford (NJ) - Finalist
Albany
Grand Forks
Cincinnati
Columbus - Finalist
Madison (WI)
Milwaukee - Finalist

2005:
Anaheim
San Jose - Finalist
Orlando
Atlanta
Boston - Finalist
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City - Finalist
St. Louis - Finalist
East Rutherford - Finalist
Albany
Grand Forks
Cincinnati
Columbus - Host
Madison
Milwaukee - Finalist

2006:
Anaheim
San Jose - Finalist
Orlando
Atlanta
Boston - Finalist
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City - Finalist
St. Louis - Finalist
East Rutherford - Finalist
Albany
Grand Forks
Cincinnati
Columbus
Madison
Milwaukee - Host

==============================================

2007-2008 Round:
2007:
Denver - Finalist
Boston - Finalist
Auburn Hills (finalist??)
Detroit (finalist??)
St. Paul - Finalist
St. Louis - Host
Omaha - Finalist
Albany - Finalist
Buffalo - Finalist
Columbus - Finalist
Philadelphia - Finalist
San Antonio - Finalist

2008:
Denver - Host
Boston - Finalist
Auburn Hills (finalist??)
Detroit (finalist??)
St. Paul - Finalist
St. Louis - Finalist
Omaha - Finalist
Albany - Finalist
Buffalo - Finalist
Columbus - Finalist
Philadelphia - Finalist
San Antonio - Finalist

==============================================

2009-2012 Round:
2009:
Glendale (AZ)
DC - Host
Sunrise (FL)
Tampa - Finalist
Boston - Finalist
Detroit - Finalist
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City
Albany
Buffalo
Columbus
Philadelphia - Finalist
San Antonio

2010:
Glendale (AZ)
DC - Finalist
Sunrise (FL)
Tampa - Finalist
Boston - Finalist
Detroit - Host
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City
Albany
Buffalo
Columbus
Philadelphia - Finalist
San Antonio

2011:
Glendale (AZ)
DC - Finalist
Sunrise (FL)
Tampa - Finalist
Boston - Finalist
Detroit - Finalist
St. Paul - Host
Kansas City
Albany
Buffalo
Columbus
Philadelphia - Finalist
San Antonio

2012:
Glendale (AZ)
DC - Finalist
Sunrise (FL)
Tampa - Host
Boston - Finalist
Detroit - Finalist
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City
Albany
Buffalo
Columbus
Philadelphia - Finalist
San Antonio

==============================================

2013-2014 Round:
2013:
Denver (???)
Boston
Kansas City (???)
St. Louis
Omaha (???)
Buffalo (???)
Philadelphia
Pittsburgh - Host

2014:
Denver (???)
Boston
Kansas City (???)
St. Louis
Omaha (???)
Buffalo (???)
Philadelphia - Host
Pittsburgh

==============================================

2015-2018 Round:
2015:
DC - Finalist
Orlando
Tampa - Finalist
Chicago - Finalist
Boston - Host
Detroit
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City
Brooklyn - Finalist
Buffalo - Finalist
Cleveland
Columbus - Finalist
Philadelphia - Finalist
Pittsburgh - Finalist
Milwaukee

2016:
DC - Finalist
Orlando
Tampa - Host
Chicago - Finalist
Boston - Finalist
Detroit
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City
Brooklyn - Finalist
Buffalo - Finalist
Cleveland
Columbus - Finalist
Philadelphia - Finalist
Pittsburgh - Finalist
Milwaukee

2017:
DC - Finalist
Orlando
Tampa - Finalist
Chicago - Host
Boston - Finalist
Detroit
St. Paul - Finalist
Kansas City
Brooklyn - Finalist
Buffalo - Finalist
Cleveland
Columbus - Finalist
Philadelphia - Finalist
Pittsburgh - Finalist
Milwaukee

2018:
DC - Finalist
Orlando
Tampa - Finalist
Chicago - Finalist
Boston - Finalist
Detroit
St. Paul - Host
Kansas City
Brooklyn - Finalist
Buffalo - Finalist
Cleveland
Columbus - Finalist
Philadelphia - Finalist
Pittsburgh - Finalist
Milwaukee

==============================================

2019-2022 Round:
2019:
Glendale
Los Angeles
Denver
DC
Detroit
St. Paul
St. Louis - May have been withdrawn due to NCAA concerns
Buffalo
Omaha
Philadelphia
Milwaukee (???)

2020:
Glendale
Los Angeles
Denver
DC
Tampa - Only bid 2020 and 2021
Detroit
St. Paul
St. Louis - May have been withdrawn due to NCAA concerns
Buffalo
Omaha
Philadelphia
Milwaukee (???)

2021:
Glendale
Los Angeles
Denver
DC
Tampa - Only bid 2020 and 2021
Detroit
St. Paul
St. Louis - May have been withdrawn due to NCAA concerns
Buffalo
Omaha
Philadelphia
Milwaukee (???)

2022:
Glendale
Los Angeles
Denver
DC
Detroit
St. Paul
St. Louis - May have been withdrawn due to NCAA concerns
Buffalo
Omaha
Philadelphia
Milwaukee (???)


Regarding the possibility of Boston and Pittsburgh not being on the list above, this isn't exhaustive. It's based on what I could find in newspaper articles, blogs, and press releases. If they didn't publicly state they were bidding, I wouldn't have found it.

Corrections and additional info welcome!

 

[Shirtless Guy]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

2021:
Glendale
Los Angeles
Denver
DC
Tampa - Only bid 2020 and 2021
Detroit
St. Paul
St. Louis - May have been withdrawn due to NCAA concerns
Omaha
Philadelphia
Milwaukee (???)
Corrections and additional info welcome!

so despite people believing that Buffalo, Pittsburgh, Detroit and Boston will host the next 4 years after St Paul, there is no evidence that Buffalo, Pittsburgh and Boston even bid?

 

[mookie1995]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

anything but omaha!!!!

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

so despite people believing that Buffalo, Pittsburgh, Detroit and Boston will host the next 4 years after St Paul, there is no evidence that Buffalo, Pittsburgh and Boston even bid?

Buffalo was included. Nix that. I forgot them from my list. I'll edit it.

Regarding Pittsburgh and Boston, no, I couldn't find any evidence. Now that it seems likely they bid, I'll go back and find the sources if there were any.

 

[buoldtimer]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

2004-2006 Round


2022:
Glendale
Los Angeles
Denver
DC
Detroit
St. Paul
St. Louis - May have been withdrawn due to NCAA concerns
Buffalo
Omaha
Philadelphia
Milwaukee (???)


Regarding the possibility of Boston and Pittsburgh not being on the list above, this isn't exhaustive. It's based on what I could find in newspaper articles, blogs, and press releases. If they didn't publicly state they were bidding, I wouldn't have found it.

Corrections and additional info welcome!

What are the concerns with St.Louis?

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

Going back and searching articles posted between 1/1/2016 and 4/1/2017, the only article I could find that mentions Pittsburgh as a potential bidder for the Frozen Fours is:
http://burghhockey.com/nwhl-commish-pittsburgh-embracing-womens-hockey/

Evidence is hard to come by sometimes when you're blindly looking for articles via google.

 

[dxmnkd316]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

What are the concerns with St.Louis?

http://www.collegehockeynews.com/news/2016/09/15_missouri_law_could_squash.php

 

[cF[Authentic]]

Re: Future Frozen Four sites

Does anyone know for sure that the KC bid was for real? Just curious why the NCHC would bid for a city that is outside their own geographical footprint (although not by much, < 3 hrs from Omaha) and definitely a non-traditional college (or any kind of) hockey town.

Yes, I know for sure that the KC bid was real. The NCHC was trying to work something out with the Staples Center but they didn't want anything to do with it. So they looked at KC.